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Thread: What's a 4w5?

  1. #31
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vala Faye View Post
    Alright ... you asked for it

    I find that I doubted a long time between 9 and 4 and even got repeatedly asked why I went for 4, especially on the forums (which triggered my 9 to keep the peace). But I relate to the 4 feeling of shame. That dramatic feeling of 'nobody understands me
    Also, 9's tend to avoid intense dark feelings while 4's wallow in it. Trust me, I've done my share of spelonking and can even enjoy the intense emotion of jealousy, paranoia or fear, when my mood is right. It's beautiful in its own right. From what I understand, 9's prefer not feeling to feeling dark feelings. Not me. If I feel nothing, I feel dead. Actually, I believe it to be a faith worse than death. Yeah, I know, drama-queen ftw.

    I don't like conflict between people, but I do enjoy investigating contradicting feelings within myself, and fleshing out how it works. I enjoy pushing buttons and tinkering with dialing up feelings and turning them down. I enjoy indulging in fantasies (all the things 4's should avoid ) that allow me to intensify that feel. Less so these days, but I am addicted to intensely feeling. On top of that, I have a finicky taste in creativity, arts and esthetics. It has to feel *just* right, and don't ask me to explain it, it's something I cannot put into words.

    What drives me is finding out who I am and how that differs from what I consider to be 'ideal' and finetuning myself to become that person, or adjusting the ideal image along the way as I gather more information.

    My hobbies include dancing, singing, crafting jewelry, psychology, animal behaviorism, learning new things by reading books on *everything* (my w5), so really *anything* that either explains people's/animals drives so I can better understand myself and others or anything that allows me to express myself, and to make an impact upon the world with that. To inspire others along the way on my quest to find myself. I realize how flowery I'm sounding atm, and I hate it, but I find it hard to bring it into words. I strive to find a balance and a zen without losing that intensity I love so. I find myself enjoying pushing my limits on how much negative emotion i can take, to want to endure and conquer each emotion in the book in all its intensity. And i can tell you that even positive ones at their highest intensity are a bitch to take..but also utter bliss (infatuation anyone?).

    I love people, but I find it easier to be by myself as it requires conscious effort to monitor myself and not overload them, or have them overload/trigger me. It's easier to do my own thign when nobody is around, though I do enjoy having company. So I shift between those two needs. Some people are able to take me fully as I am. Those, I treasure immensely. Most of the time though, I try and behave or isolate myself when I find myself too moody to deal with people. I also find that when I stress, I seek out (as an unhealthy 2 would, which 4 turns into when stressed) others to get reaffirmed and exchange affection with. Of course, I'm aware that this isn't exactly desirable behavior, so I try and curb it as much as I can. I also find that when I'm alone and not have to worry about impacting others, and can focus on being creative or the project I'm interested it in, I see that 1-streak coming through, which is a very satisfying feeling.

    /histrionic drama queen act.
    I wouldn't call it a histrionic drama queen act. Seems kind of anti-society, though. Thank you for the in depth reply.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiltyred View Post
    The descriptions fit.
    At random: I feel turned inside out sometimes, like there's normal and then there's me, the opposite. I don't care about money, only care about things in so much as they might entertain me, I don't care for the most part if anybody likes me or they don't or what they think about my hair, I am happy alone indefinitely, I almost never speak unless spoken to (at which point I'm warm and friendly but secretely mostly hoping it will be over soon), I think about everything all the time, I do what I feel because I honor my heart. If I have a hobby, it's learning more about people, but at a deep level, like, where do their ultimate motivations come from, what causes them, why are we here ... I like to ponder the inpenetrable mysteries. I like Kurt Kobain and Sylvia Plath and Anne Sexton (are you seeing a pattern here?) I don't try to be weird - I aim to be genuine - it's often interpreted as weird, I've always been gifted or special or something other than ordinary in some way. I live in my head. I want life to be beautiful but not in the Disney way -- I mean that I would like to have enough detachment to be able to appreciate every single part of it, the "good" and the "bad." My goals are all internal. I don't like to go out. I'm good to talk to if you have a problem or if you feel misunderstood, but once the problem is solved, I go back inside. If I let you in, it's a big deal. I don't answer the phone. I don't do things for the result they create or for a reward, so it's hard to motivate me. I need a small niche where I can belong and do my thing undisturbed. I'm not flashy. I'm always looking for the underpinnings and the hidden.
    This is interesting. What is your instinctual variant, and why not 4w3? I see a lot of INFJ weaved in here.

    Quote Originally Posted by chana View Post
    i'm very much in my own head, i don't feel like a lot of people get me. i can be very laid back and detached from life, but will get very intense and obsessive about certain things, especially my relationships. when i'm upset about something i think about it constantly and analyze every aspect of it to death. i don't think i try very hard to be different, but i always have been, and i tend to rebel against things that people i dislike and don't relate to like. i've gotten increasingly more quiet over the years, because i'm either afraid of being misunderstood or i just don't think it's that relevant or important for people to know. i don't feel the need to push my values and beliefs on others, and i resent it when people do the same to me. i don't worry about my physical safety a lot, i can be reckless and fearless but then get very anxious about stupid little things like a phone call or seeing someone i don't want to. i hate looking like i don't know what i'm talking about, if i see something i know i always try to look it up myself and i get annoyed with people who are content being ignorant or ask a lot of stupid questions they could easily answer themselves. i think i'm pretty good at figuring people out, seeing through the bullshit, knowing their strengths and weaknesses. this makes me kinda scary when people get on my bad side, because i don't have a bad temper at all but i can usually find the best way to push someone's buttons or upset them (this doesn't happen a lot.) i value my independence a lot, and i definitely like my alone time, but i like having people i can relate to. i don't hurt people often or put a lot of demands on people, but i will admit to being pretty selfish and i think about my own needs before others, because i figure if i don't look out for myself who will? i'm really lazy and pretty content spending my whole day doing nothing but hanging out, reading, watching tv or movies, listening to music. i have no desire to be someone big or important, i just want to be happy and comfortable and have a few people around that care about me and vice versa.
    That seems like a common 4 mentality to me. Seems like the end goal is a bit different from what society thinks and "end goal" should look like. Being true to yourself is an end goal in itself.
    06/13 10:51:03 five sounds: you!!!
    06/13 10:51:08 shortnsweet: no you!!
    06/13 10:51:12 shortnsweet: go do your things and my things too!
    06/13 10:51:23 five sounds: oh hell naw
    06/13 10:51:55 shortnsweet: !!!!
    06/13 10:51:57 shortnsweet: (cries)
    06/13 10:52:19 RiftsWRX: You two are like furbies stuck in a shoe box

    My Nohari
    My Johari
    by sns.

  2. #32
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    I think I am 4w5 but I am not that knowledgable about the enneagram soo yeah. everytime i take it i get different answers so i remain unconvinced that it has scientific merit. same with the instinctual variant thingys. from reading the description of what each one is, I know I am SX/SP because that makes the most sense... but I don't really see myself in the description for what that combined means. which is possibly because the site i read about these things had glowing things to say about SO/SX and SX/SO and then basically talked about how horrible the other types are. But, I digress.

  3. #33
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I think I am 4w5 but I am not that knowledgable about the enneagram soo yeah. everytime i take it i get different answers so i remain unconvinced that it has scientific merit. same with the instinctual variant thingys. from reading the description of what each one is, I know I am SX/SP because that makes the most sense... but I don't really see myself in the description for what that combined means. which is possibly because the site i read about these things had glowing things to say about SO/SX and SX/SO and then basically talked about how horrible the other types are. But, I digress.
    Testing aside, what makes you feel that you're a 4w5?
    06/13 10:51:03 five sounds: you!!!
    06/13 10:51:08 shortnsweet: no you!!
    06/13 10:51:12 shortnsweet: go do your things and my things too!
    06/13 10:51:23 five sounds: oh hell naw
    06/13 10:51:55 shortnsweet: !!!!
    06/13 10:51:57 shortnsweet: (cries)
    06/13 10:52:19 RiftsWRX: You two are like furbies stuck in a shoe box

    My Nohari
    My Johari
    by sns.

  4. #34
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    Um... I guess since I am fairly independent and am ok with being by myself. I like intellectual pursuits. I am good at math.... or I used to be.... I like unicorns.... I like science.... I love astronomy!

  5. #35
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    4w5? Me!

    I feel like a 4w5 because there are two people inside me. One is very emotional, dreamy, dramatic, highly idealistic and passionate, not to mention slightly self-destructive at times; the other is analytical, calm, reserved, safety-oriented and loves to figure things out rationally. The problem is the two don't always get along. However, if they fight, the first emotional one almost always wins, but just barely -- so that makes me a 4w5 and not 5w4.

    I'm older now and I feel like my 4 is settling a little bit. I think I'm moving towards 1, hopefully in a healthy way. But I'm still pretty certain my main type is still 4 and not 1, because I'm still obsessed with being unique and couldn't care less about being right
    4w5 sp/sx EII

  6. #36
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    Does anyone have a good website with descriptions of these subtypes specifically? I have tried looking up 4w3 and 4w5 descriptions and I get nothing of value.

    Thanks

  7. #37
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    Does anyone have a good website with descriptions of these subtypes specifically? I have tried looking up 4w3 and 4w5 descriptions and I get nothing of value.

    Thanks
    Someone just posted this site in a thread. I have found it very helpful. http://theenneagram.blogspot.com/200...-ennegram.html

    (It makes people sound less like cartoon characters.. It helped me understand fours.)
    06/13 10:51:03 five sounds: you!!!
    06/13 10:51:08 shortnsweet: no you!!
    06/13 10:51:12 shortnsweet: go do your things and my things too!
    06/13 10:51:23 five sounds: oh hell naw
    06/13 10:51:55 shortnsweet: !!!!
    06/13 10:51:57 shortnsweet: (cries)
    06/13 10:52:19 RiftsWRX: You two are like furbies stuck in a shoe box

    My Nohari
    My Johari
    by sns.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    Someone just posted this site in a thread. I have found it very helpful. http://theenneagram.blogspot.com/200...-ennegram.html

    (It makes people sound less like cartoon characters.. It helped me understand fours.)
    Thanks

    I found this:
    Healthy side of this wing brings a withdrawn, complex creativity. May be somewhat intellectual but have exceptional depth of feeling and insight. Very much their own person; original and idiosyncratic. Have a spiritual and aesthetic openness. Will find multiple levels of meaning to most events. May have a strong need and ability to pour themselves into artistic creations. Loners; can seem enigmatic and hard to read. Externally reserved and internally resonant. When they open up it can be sudden and total. When entranced or defensive, Fours with a 5 wing can easily feel alienated and depressed. Many have a sense of not belonging, of being from another planet. Can get lost in their own process, drown in their own ocean. Whiny - tend to ruminate and relive past experience. Prone to the emotion of shame. Air of sullen, withdrawn disappointment. May live within a private mythology of pain and loss. Can get deeply morbid and fall in love with death.
    I can relate to a lot of what is said here, except for the bold part. I'd prefer to fall in love with a volcano instead of that. Ironicaly enough if I did fall in love with a Volcano, it would most likely result in my death.

    Definitely see more of myself in wing 5 than wing 3.

    So I guess the "mystery" of me is solved with a few letters: INFP, SX/SP, 4w5. Add in some stardust and you are almost there.

  9. #39
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    I also found this description in another thread *yoink!*

    Type 4 with a 5 wing: Type Four individuals are intensely emotionally aware, and often retreat to their rich inner world of concepts and ideas. They are the most artistic type in the Enneagram and driven to create their own, unique identity. Type Fours value authenticity highly and express themselves whenever they can. They are one of the most individualistic types in the Enneagram. Type Fours, when in a state of growth, become principled like Type Ones. When stressed, Type Fours can become clingy like an unhealthy Type Two. You are a Type Four with a Five wing, which means that the individualist nature of a Four combines with the cerebral nature of a Five to make you one of the most creative types in the Enneagram.
    Rings pretty true for me as well.

  10. #40
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I also found this description in another thread *yoink!*



    Rings pretty true for me as well.
    That one's quite good. doesn't say the word, "magical" either. That makes me cringe.
    06/13 10:51:03 five sounds: you!!!
    06/13 10:51:08 shortnsweet: no you!!
    06/13 10:51:12 shortnsweet: go do your things and my things too!
    06/13 10:51:23 five sounds: oh hell naw
    06/13 10:51:55 shortnsweet: !!!!
    06/13 10:51:57 shortnsweet: (cries)
    06/13 10:52:19 RiftsWRX: You two are like furbies stuck in a shoe box

    My Nohari
    My Johari
    by sns.

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