[Type 8] Te and eight

[yenom]

What is the connection? I want to know.

 

[teslashock]

I'd go with Je. Je is responsible for realizing a goal, whether it's realizing this through bringing people together or through attempting/modifying a process so it is as efficient and productive as possible. In order to be successful at both of these things, one must usually be confident, assertive, resourceful, and somewhat domineering yet still a bit inspiring and motivational (e8).

 

[JustHer]

Je would leave only Fe and Te, and somehow I don't see ENFJs as 8s at all.

I'd say Te fits enneagram 8, either that or just really strong introversion

 

[teslashock]

What precludes ENFJs from being 8s? They are like born leaders...just a bit "nicer" than ENTJ leaders.

And do you care to elaborate on that introversion thing?

 

[the state i am in]

T is more straightforward, linear, and directly assertive than F. F is more roundabout/holistic, Fe can persuade and manipulate, but unless it's a sit-com, it can't directly create a chain of events as easily or commandeeringly as Te.

i'm assuming that was to mean extroversion. unchecked extroversion with no inner balancing weight. i'm considering whether the sx subtype is a necessity for the w8 of ep 7w8. it would create more directness, intensity, focus, drive, energy, etc.

8 is also affected by the inferior Fi of etj. it makes sense that there is a strong connection between the inferior function (Fi) and the defense strategy of the enneagram type. the blindspot creates a perceived weakness that must be defended.

as a 5, my blindspot is Se. i want knowledge so i don't have to improvise physically in the moment and can anticipate everything coming very zenlike, whereas other itps want knowledge so they can say fuck it and don't have to worry about the emotions of others (which easily bother them and are difficult to read/imagine).

 

[teslashock]

T is more straightforward, linear, and directly assertive than F. F is more roundabout/holistic, Fe can persuade and manipulate, but unless it's a sit-com, it can't directly create a chain of events as easily or commandeeringly as Te.

But isn't enneagram about personal preferences anyway? It seems like an Fe dom would value accomplishing goals (whether or not these goals are accomplished holistically or assertively), so it seems like Fe doms would thus value a sense of control, power, and resourcefulness and test as e8s. Perhaps it's not as easy to see in Fe doms, but it's still there, is it not?

 

[JustHer]

No no I actually meant extreme introversion. Like if you are someone who totally lives in your own inner world, you could be a type 8 due to being terrified of the external world trying to attack your personal integrity. I know some introverts who seem to really freak out at the thought of people trying to "control them".

As for why I think ENFJs dont make type 8s, don't Fe users LIKE to follow social rules? And don't they like to live in harmony with the external world? I just don't see this correlating to a need to be independant and self sufficient like the kind present for type 8s.

 

[JustHer]

8 is also affected by the inferior Fi of etj. it makes sense that there is a strong connection between the inferior function (Fi) and the defense strategy of the enneagram type. the blindspot creates a perceived weakness that must be defended.

Yeh I definitely see Enneagram 8 as the use of Te due to weak Fi.

 

[teslashock]

No no I actually meant extreme introversion. Like if you are someone who totally lives in your own inner world, you could be a type 8 due to being terrified of the external world trying to attack your personal integrity. I know some introverts who seem to really freak out at the thought of people trying to "control them".

Ah, right. Like the crazy Ti Randists! That makes sense. Good point.

As for why I think ENFJs dont make type 8s, don't Fe users LIKE to follow social rules? And don't they like to live in harmony with the external world? I just don't see this correlating to a need to be independant and self sufficient like the kind present for type 8s.

Hm, maybe ESFJs want to adhere to social rules, and you're right, I bet an ESFJ would be a lot less likely to be an e8.

The ENFJs that I know, however, value independence A LOT. They use their ability to understand social dynamics as a way of manipulating social groups to their liking in order to accomplish a specific end goal. I think ENFJs value the act of appearing to be socially harmonious, but I don't think they would give up their independence to do so.

 

[the state i am in]

i think the key in this discussion is our definition of independence. many types want to be independent in some way or another. as a 5, i like to be independent to pursue my ideas freely without restriction/restraint on time, finances, the interests of a group, etc.

8s, i feel, want to be independent from the feelings of others, so they try to become the boss, in-charge, etc. they don't know how to work or play the feeling game well, so it is burdensome, exhausting, viewed as an excuse, etc. they think- fuck that noise, they should take care of themselves. why should i have to look out for them, you have to go after what you want, you can't go thru life whining about your feelings and acting so entitled.

there could be another way to be an 8. i'm not familiar enough with the core need to recognize how it could fit into another enneagram type.

an enfj tho, would feel threatened by Ti. i don't think fear of others logic can produce enneagram 8s. control, in this case, would have to be drastically reinterpreted to "by manipulating others, creating alliances, and boosting harmony within the group that hosted your own opinion of the situation." which sounds far more like 3w2 behavior than 8w_. when the 8w9s try to peace-make and create harmony, it's way more laid-back let's all get along fuck it let's get a beer kind of interlude. it is a strategy of more passivity rather than more skilled assertion, a kind of looseness.

 

[teslashock]

^Yeah, you may be right. I honestly don't know much about enneagram stuff really, but I thought 8s were the controlling leader type that value independence, and I could still see that in ENFJs, even if they don't appear to be as outwardly aggressive as Te doms. I'd listen to your analysis more than mine though.

 

[strychnine]

There's definitely a correllation between Te and 8 but Se also. Se and 8. Both, as in ESFP/ENTJ means 8 is common among those types.

 

[á´…eparted]

I've always associated 8 with Se, but come to understand it aligns with Te just as much.

 

[Masokissed]

Se and Te. Even the 8s that don't use Se/Te have that flavoring. I know an 8 that I can't decide Te-dom or Se-dom for.

 

[Virtual ghost]

8 and Te/Se loop are basically the same thing described by two different personality systems. It is possible to have one without another but the two are just natural fit.


How can you be the real "boss" if you don't have commanding/organizing skills and ability to see what is going on ? Or if you have good commanding/organizing skills and ability to see what is going on there are good chances that you will be in charge sooner or later.

 

[miss fortune]

I think that, traditionally, Te-ness is most associated by people with 8-ness...I identify as ESTP, but I've been called an ENTJ several times in real life by people who were familiar with MBTI... it comes across as 8-ish in people and people mistake 8-ness FOR Te

 

[ceecee]

8 and Te/Se loop are basically the same thing described by two different personality systems. It is possible to have one without another but the two are just natural fit.

Yes, Se vacuums up everything and dumps it into Ni but Te is going to decide how/where it's used. At least that's how I see it.

How can you be the real "boss" if you don't have commanding/organizing skills and ability to see what is going on ? Or if you have good commanding/organizing skills and ability to see what is going on there are good chances that you will be in charge sooner or later.

Even if they don't want to be the boss they will be because a) they can't handle it being done by incompetent people and b) for an 8, they'll act if their environment is being invaded.

 

[Virtual ghost]

I think that, traditionally, Te-ness is most associated by people with 8-ness...I identify as ESTP, but I've been called an ENTJ several times in real life by people who were familiar with MBTI... it comes across as 8-ish in people and people mistake 8-ness FOR Te

I presume that this is because of ability to push through thing and not really being under anyones control ? (this is perhaps the only way you can be 8 without having Te in the mix)

 

[miss fortune]

I presume that this is because of ability to push through thing and not really being under anyones control ? (this is perhaps the only way you can be 8 without having Te in the mix)

yeah, I have the tendency to ignore protocol and get shit done in most cases... see a problem and solve a problem!

 

[ceecee]

I think that, traditionally, Te-ness is most associated by people with 8-ness...I identify as ESTP, but I've been called an ENTJ several times in real life by people who were familiar with MBTI... it comes across as 8-ish in people and people mistake 8-ness FOR Te

My dad is absolutely an 8 and many people think ENTJ. He isn't, he's an ESTJ, perhaps ESTP.