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  1. #1

    Default INFJs 4s are a lot different to Fi dom 4s?

    A lot of INFJ 4s seem to think they're 2s cause they don't like the stereotypes that surround being a 4 like being self-centred. I have also noticed that 4 INFJs can sometimes try to fit in as opposed to a 4 Fi dom practically if they're a 4w3 INFJ.

  2. #2
    Honeyed Water thoughtlost's Avatar
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    I think INFJ (or maybe just Fe???) 4s are different in the sense that they probably do seem like other types at first. I know a 4 that was once labeled as 9 at first. But then as they trust you and you get them talking, then their arrogance/socially critical nature will pop out. That same 4 is seen as a 2 (a shy, non-imposing but helpful 2), but people who do not see the arrogance. Turns out that the person was just an INFJ ..so that's what makes them seem 9ish or 2ish. The INFJ 4 won't desire to express themselves in extreme ways (they are very socially conscious/have a strong spotlight effect-complex thingy). They don't desire to do anything extravagant (they are not a Johnny Depp level of 4).

    They are a 4, so they are still self-centered (doesn't matter what MBTI type maybe???). But it's not obvious.
    You are so arbitrary.
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  3. #3
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Seem more likely to have a 3 wing and be social subtypes.
    Stuff gets attributed to Fi that is really e4 and it applies equally well to INFJ 4s, IMO.
    A lot of INFJs may not own up to being self-centered, but they may be. That's not a Fi thing at all.
    INFPs are often more aware of their own emotional motivations and can have extremely high ideals, making them cop to being self-centered even if it's in a normal degree, i.e. most people are that self-centered if not worse.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

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    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Fe and 4-ness is a fun mix, speaking from experience, of course

    You try so hard to please, so hard to fit in, but at the same time you know you're not selfless, and you struggle to be you, and you deal with the guilt, and with feeling phony, and with all that destructive and horrible but yet awesome things in your turbulent internal world while projecting a sense of having it all together (so the people around you won't panic).
    4w5 sp/sx EII
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  5. #5
    In Full Flight Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    I'm INFJ, 4 with a 3 wing...

    I've never thought of myself as anything but a 4; 2 is not something I relate to much at all. I went back and forth between a 3 and a 5 wing. The 3 descriptions were so dramatic so it threw me off at first, but the core motivations of the 4w3 are very much me. I'm pretty introspective and can be self-indulgent as far as understanding myself but I'm more other-centered than self-centered. I could, however, see others viewing me as another type (whether Enneatype or MBTI) because a lot of myself isn't shown outwardly and what is can be contradictory.
    ~Life in a cappella~
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  6. #6

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    INFJ 4s can come off very Fi-like actually. The 4 gives their Fe a Fi flavor that can make them appear like an IxFP at times. However, the Fe function would make them more agreeable in a 9ish way than dauntless and overly distant like some e4 Fi types can be. In general, 4s are a very introspective type, so these INFJs in particular would appear a little more inward than others of the same type with a different enneagram core.
    Like you - I am broken and fragile.
    Like you - I am tasting my heart for the first time.


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  7. #7
    "timber..." Peter Deadpan's Avatar
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    Enneagram 4 and dom/aux Fe are an odd combination indeed, although I have never once mistaken myself for a core 2.

    The thing about being a core 4 and a high Fe-user is that you tend to use your Fe differently than other NFJs. There are two major differences between introverted and extroverted feeling - Whose feelings you are focused on, and how you express your own feelings. Fi users will focus on themselves over others and also tend to hold their feelings under wraps a bit more. Fe users tend to focus on the feelings of others and tend to express their own feelings more outwardly. I think what happens with a 4 Fe user is that they prefer to focus on themselves, much like an Fi user, but they express their feelings more readily. I think for this reason, Fe 4s tend to look more dramatic/loud than Fi 4s.

    This is a type that presents with striking differences based on instinctual stacking. I would imagine an Fe 4 Sp to present much more like and NFP than an NFJ at first and even second glance. An Fe 4 Sx would present much more "in your face" than an NFP and could easily be mistaken for a 7 or 8, or having a 3-wing when they actually have a 5-wing, or even being an extrovert if INFJ. An Fe 4 Soc would look less Fi-ish and would be more consciously aware of the rift between their Fi behavior and their Fe desires, and they would feel ashamed about it. Soc would be the most likely to sacrifice their wants for others. The other two would be more stubborn or finicky.

    The NFJ 4 Sx is a... uh... "complex" personality and not always fun to deal with. You will hear about what bothers them, but they'll probably hold it in longer than they should because that Fe holds them back a bit. Sx/Sp is the most likely to have feelings bubbling and boiling over seemingly out of the blue, sometimes for the most trivial shit (like getting unreasonably mad at their phone when they try to text something 3 times and typos keep happening).
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  8. #8
    Honeyed Water thoughtlost's Avatar
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    I think I am in agreement with Peter about aux Fe...

    How I understand Fe is this: Fe focuses on what is around them (in terms of people). It notices the mood/opinion/feeling of another (or group of people doesn't matter ...it's any and all humans that are are not them). Fe users vary in the levels of expressiveness because it all depends on the environment around them; that is what they focus on. They can either be not expressive because they are aware that it isn't an appropriate time to express their real feelings and harmony between two or more people and themselves matter more. Or they are expressive (and they are still conscious about how others are perceiving them) and they are aware of how they are impacting the environment/people around them.

    Note: when I say conscious, I don't mean shy. I just mean that an aux Fe person is always aware of how they are coming across and how others are coming across.

    An Fe aux 4 that has a social instinct will actually look super Fe (because ...they are). There is no rift between Fi behavior. It's just that they spend a lot of time thinking about what others are doing in relation to them (everyone expects me to be X way or everyone else is shallow). It seems like Fi because of people's misunderstanding of it. However, it's the clearest example of aux Fe I've ever seen in real life. It's because they are SO focused on what others are doing/what the social norm is that they can't even begin to understand themselves unless it's in relation/comparison to others.

    It's when the other instincts dominant in a 4 ...that's when you get a less Fe 4 (if they are actually an Fe dom/aux).

    However, I don't think Fe users are necessarily more expressive. I think both types (Fe and Fi) can be expressive or not expressive, but for different mentalities. These two functions really can look alike on the surface.... even if one person is a 4 Fe and the other person is a 9 Fi, but really these two types are so different internally.

    It's just that Fi doesn't have the awareness that Fe has. Fe "sees" all. It is aware of the energy at a party (and how they may or may not fit in with it). They are aware of what's popular. They may not go along with it ...but they are HIGHLY aware of it. Fi doesn't have an awareness of that. Fi does focus on the self that way.

    Fi focuses on their own internal/emotional worlds. Fi users focus on the internal landscape of an individual. It doesn't need to be communicated with external expressions of what they are feeling. So I wouldn't call Fi individualistic... it's just more ...hidden I guess??

    Of course being an intuitive vs. sensor will modify how both Fi and Fe are in a person and the position. So far, my post has been about aux Fe. A dom Fe user is focused on establishing the emotional tone that they want. They are less in the observer role and more in the driver's seat. And I've found ExFPs to be a bit more individualistic than Fi doms. Idk could be wrong, but it's what I think.
    You are so arbitrary.
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  9. #9
    "timber..." Peter Deadpan's Avatar
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    You are always so eloquent @thoughtlost. I have a tendency to blurt my thoughts out without fine tuning the language or even the concept. I think you describe true Fi and Fe better than I do at times. And you are right about the constant comparisons to others and using them as a reference point for oneself for Fe 4s.

    But I do feel confused about one thing: Are Fi dom/aux really that unaware of the moods of others, or the opinions others have of them? Can they really spend time with a group of people and not gather clues about the impressions others are forming of them? Or the feelings unmentioned but still shown subtly? (maybe the latter is Ni)

  10. #10
    Honeyed Water thoughtlost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Deadpan View Post
    You are always so eloquent @thoughtlost. I have a tendency to blurt my thoughts out without fine tuning the language or even the concept. I think you describe true Fi and Fe better than I do at times. And you are right about the constant comparisons to others and using them as a reference point for oneself for Fe 4s.

    But I do feel confused about one thing: Are Fi dom/aux really that unaware of the moods of others, or the opinions others have of them? Can they really spend time with a group of people and not gather clues about the impressions others are forming of them? Or the feelings unmentioned but still shown subtly? (maybe the latter is Ni)
    If you're interacting with me, I will pay attention to your emotions; I am aware of an individual's feelings. I am a 9 after all. I don't want to say anything mean or hurtful to others and I want be considerate to others. I can even joke around. So I look like an Fe user. But, unlike an Fe user, I am not thinking "Oh, I am not like everyone else... what must people think of me?" Some Fe auxes will do annoying things just to see people's reaction, as that entertains them. I've never done that ...like ever. I am not a jokester/prankster/troll.


    Fe is the function of communication. They can flirt with you even if they don't genuinely like you, just for the dynamic is creates between people; and they are aware of what they are doing. But they don't expect other people to take them seriously because there is no "real" feeling backing it up.

    Fi people ...aren't necessarily trying to communicate with you in that way. I am unaware of what impact I am having. And that also means that I can express myself too honestly without realizing how I am affecting others. I won't exactly realize that people are flirting with me or just how people are perceiving me. It sort of makes me uncomfortable to think such thoughts and I sort of just ignore it sometimes. I prefer to ignore it because it helps me just be comfortable socializing with others and moving about in the world.
    You are so arbitrary.
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