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  1. #221
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    First: total bullshit
    Second: where's you legitimacy to put yourself as someone able to rework a model that you don't understand?
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

    Chaotic Neutral

    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  2. #222
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    First: total bullshit
    Second: where's you legitimacy to put yourself as someone able to rework a model that you don't understand?
    Care to add some substance to that? Or some specificity at least?

  3. #223
    garbage
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    Do you still have the images? For some reason, the attachments won't load.

  4. #224
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Every. Single. Time. There is some kind of server change, those images stopped working.

    I eventually got tired of getting a mod to keep editing the OPs since they are too old for me to edit. These days, I just link to them at my photobucket account, but I never got around to pestering a mod yet again to make that change.

    Sorry.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


    _________________________________
    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  5. #225
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    @Magic Poriferan, can't you attach the files themselves to a new post? Or is that what you've done already?

    I've actually wanted them a few times recently...

  6. #226
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    i was trying to understand your system, so i tried to make myself the missing diagrams. (visual learner... lol)

    does this help you guys?

    i'm sure it's not nearly as pretty as your initial images, but maybe it can be helpful...


    D1. Enneagram Chart:

    ____________Suppressive___Turbulent ___Controlling
    Avoiding _________5___________4_________9
    Pursuing__________3___________8_________7
    Anticipating________1___________6_________2

    Tiled:

    Emotions: S = Suppressive, T = Turbulent, C = Controlling
    Behaviors: V = aVoidant, P = Pursuing, A = Anticipating

    S T C S T C

    V 5 4 9 5 4 9

    P 3 8 7 3 8 7

    A 1 6 2 1 6 2

    V 5 4 9 5 4 9

    P 3 8 7 3 8 7

    A 1 6 2 1 6 2


    ie:
    Behavioral wings of a 1 are 5 (Avoidant) and 3 (Pursuing). Emotion is fixed at Suppressive.
    Emotional wings of a 1 are 6 (Turbulent) and 2 (Controlling). Behavior is fixed at Anticipating.

    FOLLOWING BASED ON MAGIC PORIFERAN'S PERSONAL TYPING:

    D2. Instinctual stacking

    Intimate > Self-Preservational > Social

    (I-P-S)

    D3. Behavioral stacking

    Anticipating (1,2,6) > Avoiding (4,5,9) > Pursuing (3,7,8)

    D4. Emotional stacking

    Suppressive (1,3,5) > Turbulent (4,6,8) > Controlling (2,7,9)

    D5. Magic's typing:

    Anticipating > Avoiding > Pursuing
    Suppressive > Turbulent > Controlling
    Intimate > Self-preservational > Social

    (personal addition - to determine which wing comes first: Behavioral > Emotional)

    Thus:

    Anticipating/Suppressive = 1 > Anticipating/Turbulent = 6 (Behavioral wing) > Avoiding/Suppressive (Emotional wing) = 5

    1 > 6 > 5 I-P-S


    ----

    i think in your system i would be

    Anticipating > Avoiding > Pursuing
    Turbulent > Controlling > Suppressive
    Intimate > Social > Self-Preservational

    6 > 2 > 4 I-S-P

  7. #227
    garbage
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    i was trying to understand your system, so i tried to make myself the missing diagrams. (visual learner... lol)

    does this help you guys?
    Cool stuff. Let me take a stab at it:

    D1. Enneagram Chart:

    Code:
                   Suppressive Turbulent Controlling
    
    Avoiding           5           4          9
    
    Pursuing           3           8          7
    
    Anticipating       1           6          2
    Tiled:

    Emotions: S = Suppressive, T = Turbulent, C = Controlling
    Behaviors: V = aVoidant, P = Pursuing, A = Anticipating

    Code:
       S   T   C   S   T   C
    
    V  5   4   9   5   4   9
    
    P  3   8   7   3   8   7
    
    A  1   6   2   1   6   2
    
    V  5   4   9   5   4   9
    
    P  3   8   7   3   8   7
     
    A  1   6   2   1   6   2

  8. #228
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bologna
    [better diagrams]
    well aren't you fancy


  9. #229
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    REPOST
    Hello, everyone!
    What I have for you here, is an extensive description of my new version of the Enneagram. This version hopes to make the workings of the Enneagram both more clear and more consistent. It seeks to take away the fuzzy, esoteric aesthetic of the Enneagram and replace it with a series of easy to follow formulae and definitions. I hope you find it insightful.

    *While I'm the one that's talking, this material is owed in part to Dissonance, so remember that for everything you see below, some credit is due to him thanks to his contributions.

    Now, let's start.

    A new way of defining the types.

    You might have noticed that the Enneagram types seemed more pure, simple, or archetypical than the MB types. You might have observed that they are each individually defined, int stead of being comprised of variables. They were 9 allegedly "unique" types. Well that's hogwash. They are related or unrelated to each other in traceable variable based patterns, and the attempts to say otherwise have lead to many aspects of the Enneagram types that seem either vague or inexplicable.
    Well, we'll be having no more of that.

    By my analysis of the Enneagram types, there are two variables, each with three values. 3 x 3 = 9, so that's the number of types right there.

    The first variable is sort of the behavioral variable. This is the one that really decides how a person approaches challenges is life. to put it vaguely. The best single words I've found for these types so far is pursuing, avoiding, and anticipating.

    So, pursuing types have targets that they very pro-actively pursue. It could be that they seek pleasure, or they aim to pre-emptively tackle problems, the actual target of their pursuits is determined by other variable. They are impatient, impetuous people. They also tend to over-estimate the benefit end of cost-benefit analyses, which is one of the things that make them aggressive. They expect to profit from adventures. These types are 3, 7, and 8.

    So then we have avoidant types. They generally over-estimate the cost end of cost-benefit analyses. These people tend to spend more time on avoiding what they don't like than they do on seeking what they do like. When they can't avoid stress, they often fall into an almost fatalistic state of passivity. Throwing weight around is something these types seem to have particular distaste for. These types are 4, 5, and 9.

    So, the anticipating types do not pursue nor avoid these highlights of life. They stand and deal with them whenever they come. They handle life like a tetris player. These people have a more balanced view of cost-benefit analysis, but perhaps too balanced sometimes. These people don't like making dramatic decisions the same way the other two can, which can make for missed opportunities. These types are 1, 2, and 6.

    The second variable is one that regards emotional states and responses. They can be turbulent, suppressive, or controlling, for lack of better words.

    The turbulent ones are the people that do not hinder their emotions at all. They let their moods tempestuously flare with every feeling as it is set off. Their emotions run wild. They often seem to tilt toward being more negative than positive, but I think this is largely just because there are more negative emotions than positive ones, not because these types particularly want to dwell on negativity. These types are 4, 6, and 8.

    The suppressive types try to keep their emotions from speaking up. They tend to believe that they can work best when they are not hearing their emotions much or at all. By default they are well composed people. But when they fail to successfully suppress their emotions, it often results in awkward displays. These types are 1, 3, and 5.

    The controlling types are the ones that try to manipulate the flow of their own feelings to their advantage. These are the people that try to think positive. They make an effort to both display desirable emotions to others, and to also frequently reassure themselves of such good feelings. Most usually pick feelings like confidence, happiness, or love to project, but they may develop whatever feeling is appealing to them. They are also prone to suffering from denial, and usually take it very hard if their self-assurances can be completely disproven. These types are 2, 7, and 9.

    So, to summarize the types:
    Pursuing/Turbulent = 8. Avoiding/Turbulent = 4. Anticipating/Turbulent = 6. Pursuing/Suppressive = 3. Avoiding/Suppressive = 5. Anticipating/Suppressive = 1. Pursuing/Controlling = 7. Avoiding/Controlling = 9. Anticipating/Controlling = 2.

    Here's a chart of the types, centering on the 8, to help give you an idea of where they stand.



    This additional picture, centered on the 1, shows you the pattern if the chart was continuously tiled.



    Every type shares one value with four of the other types, and shares no value with the remaining types. As you can see in the charts, a type shares a value with every other type that is on the same row or column. Naturally, a type shares both values only with itself. So as an example, the 1 is anticipating and suppressed, it relates to the 2 and 6 because they are both anticipating, and it relates to the 3 and 5, because they are both suppressed.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


    _________________________________
    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  10. #230
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Enter Instincts and the stack.

    You all may be familiar with the so-called Instinctual Variant system. If not, there are a number of places you can read about on this site. If you're vaguely familiar with it, then you should remember that it is one variable, with three values, essentially focused on what a person is concerned about or motivated by. Well, after starting to look at the Enneagram in this new way, I realized that the Instincts were perfectly matched for this system. It refers
    to yet another three value variable, and one that covers a factor the other two do not, motive. So, we can add up the two variables that comprise the core type with the Instincts, and say that the behavioral variable asks you what you do, the emotional variable asks you how you feel, and the instinctual variable asks you what you want. To make more sense of it, we might not call the instinctual variable the "motivational" variable instead.
    In the reverse order: What you want? How do you feel? What are you going to do about it?

    But there is a much more important point here than simply adding in the Instinct system. Do recall how the Instincts are set up in a "stack", where you are tested for the priority that you put each potential value at. So not only is one at the top, but one is displayed in second place, and another in third or the bottom, like this:


    (that's my stacking)

    The idea here is to give a more complete picture. It not only tells us what a person's primary motive is, but it tells us what they would settle for next in line. Of course, if it's applicable to that variable, then why not the others? So we can take the variables for the core type, and stack them, too. We have the primary, secondary, and tertiary preferences of behavior, and the same would go for the emotions. It would appear like this:


    (also my stacking)

    So we see that I am an Intimate type 1, but we also see by way of the stack that I am much more like a 4 than a 7, while some other person who's a 1 might be more like a 7 than a 4. All depends on that stack.

    Actually determining what a person's stack is can only be done by personal analysis or some kind of test designed for it. We cannot conclude what a person's stack is going to be based on any pre-existing information.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


    _________________________________
    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

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