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  1. #1

    Question Genuinely Serious Question

    Recently, I have been studying a few different enneagram sources (mostly for my leisure, and also to find out a few things about each type, and finding out some good indicators that maybe hint towards X type). Anyway, I have been reading about how similar 4sx can be (in a good few ways) to enneagram 8 and I have also read somewhere that 4 sx types "are better 8s than type 8s." I have a few questions regarding my findings:

    1. Do you guys (8s/4 sxs) agree with that phrase about the 4sxs being better 8s than 8s?
    2. Do you think too many people assume all 4s are 'melancholic' like the stereotype, and don't actually have much 'substance' outside those stereotypically boundaries when they really do?
    3. 8s, have you ever been mistyped as 4sx before?
    4. 4sxs, have you ever been mistyped as an 8 before?
    5. What is the best way to define the 'motivations' though both may act similar at times (from what I know)?

    I'm genuinely curious to know what you guys think.
    And if you've ever heard about these claims before.

  2. #2
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2016


    As far as motivations go, I'd read Naranjo. Haven't come across better illustrations of the types yet.

  3. #3
    Senior Member KitchenFly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015

    Default Genuinely Serious Question

    5. The motivations are Lead via E because all four subtypes 4w3 4w5 8w9 8w7 are lead via E first in the action of there general motivations or overcompensating passion lead actions.

    At the level of the subtypes there are multiple drives influenced via the wings one is mood lead and the other is agenda lead, this balance requires the focus of there dose the individual focused there attention (I or E) in defence automatic influence's in act,

    - 4w3w5 , the three component is (I)STJ mood, five component is (I)NTP agenda.

    - 4w5w3 , the five component is (I)NTFP mood, three is (I)STP agenda.

    - 8w7w9 , the severn component is (E)SFP mood, nine is (I)NFP agenda.

    - 8w9w7 , the nine component is (I)NFJ mood, Severn is (E)NTJ agenda.

    There is more nuanced depth to be witnessed because a three into three action, is in action, underneath the personalities base actions, there is the the nine core energy point witch suit the Three instinct model perspective and the six instinctual subtype actions seperate separate that best suit the eighteen subtype level of the personalities actions. Core point energy, wing energy, wing energy (three parts). The Self that replaces the authentic self has Severn Parts, Core two subtype energy and two wing energies and two shadow wing subtype energies.

    Do Ra Mi Fa So La Si and the authentic self "DO". It may be interesting to note the remaining six (RA ME FA SO LA SI) could be thought of as the six points in active at this injunction so to say, meaning.

    Core: point nine, subtype energy 9w1w8 shadow subtype energy 9w8w1 wing 1w2w9 shadow wing 1w9w2 other wing 8w9w7 other shadow wing 8w7w9. Severn Parts (Do Ra Mi Fa So La Si).

    Core Point energies remaining Point:1 Point:2 Point:3 Point:4 Point:5 Point:6 Point:7 and Point:9 maybe seen as the remainder unto Parts portions of the true self in part, (RA MI FA SO LA SI)

    DO RA MI FA SO LA SI would be the authentic self a creation of Greater Nature Severn Parts is not nine parts so my thinking is that HOST is the the hosting Multiplicity. Like Points 3 & 6 and then the remaining Severn Points 1, 2 4, 5 7, 8 and Point:9.

    The thought that to mind when thinking in this context multiplicity and Greater Nature and three into three is (Energy/Mass) , (Dark Energy) , (Dark Mater).

    Energy/Mass (1 2 4 5 6 7 8 9), the physical cosmos so to say and and the Multiplicity (3 & 6) would be like (Dark Mater & Dark Energy).

    Personality in the example above is like nine times eight equals seventy two Do Ra Mi Fa So La Si DO via nine Points. Two nines are eighteen - nine multiplicity within a structure of 90 parts add nine lots of six RA MI FA SO LA SI and that equals 72 +18 + 54 = 144.

    Another thought that comes to mind and please be a wear I have no real knowledge about the structure of music, is that the six instinctual variants remind me of Three pairs of like multiplicities in this way,
    So/Sp and Sx/Sp
    Sx/So and Sp/So
    Sp/Sx and So/Sx

    All seem to be pairs like three coins with two sides so to say.

    Another way I look at the same thing is like two complimentary 1/2 notes of the of the same false octave (do--Do) as in like do to Do

    So/Sp and Sx/Sp ,. Si Point:8 and Fa Point:4
    Sx/So and Sp/So ,. Si Point:5 and Ra Point:1
    Sp/Sx and So/Sx ,. Mi Point:2 and La Point:7

    8+4 , 5+1 , 2+7 = 27 a Two and a Severn again.

    12 , 6 , 9 ,.

    12 ("1+2") = "3" + 6 + 9 = 18

    27 - 9 = 18 ,. The twelve termed into three leaving nine.

    So/Sp (8) and So/Sx (7) = 15
    Sx/So (5) and Sx/Sp (4) = 9
    Sp/Sx (2) and Sp/So (1) =3

    15 terns into 6

    Now we have a 3 and a 6 and a 9

    And a nine that was from 15 trending into 6.

    So now we have to number values of nine like a multiplicity nine plus nine equals eighteen 18 "eighteen" (1+8) = 9

    Wow like the triangle and three into three 3 & 9 and Point:9.

    The hexad and the triangle.

    27 and 18

    Two and Severn one and eight.


    144 divided by 8 equals eighteen.

    (do ra mi fa so la si Do)

    Don Richard Riso designed his basic questionnaire with 144 questions.


    27 + 18 = 45

    If we order the six numbers differently

    1 & 2 & 4 & 5 & 7 & 8

    We have the six pointed fig of the Hexad.

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