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Thread: 1's and Anger

  1. #1
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Default 1's and Anger

    This is primarily for E1's but anyone can chime in with thoughts/opinions of course.

    The vice of E1's is anger, and ever since I learned I was a 1 I felt this was the only thing that was largely amiss. It wasn't until Monday that I realized that yeah, anger is definitely a thing with me, I just don't well understand it.

    I have always considered myself to not have a temper, and that I don't snap easily. In certain regards that still holds true, but in others that's a laughable notion. It's partly due to the fact that I have a few mental disorders that colored my self perception growing up and lead me to stifiling who I am and not coming into my personality. Now at 26, I'm pretty much solidly into who I am and who I am going to be for the rest of my life.

    I'm starting to notice that I am not all that self aware of my anger, and convince myself that emotions I feel aren't that but instead are annoyance, frustration, irritation, or all kinds of other descriptors that are like anger, but don't carry that label. It's often said that despite feeling angry frequently, 1's suppress this as they regard it as a reprehensible thing to express and therefore makes the individual "bad" to do so. While I don't actively think this, I am noticing that I suppress anger releases against my own will, even when I want to let it out in full force pretty badly. It still comes out, but it's always a controlled leak and ultimately not satisfying and if anything makes things worse.

    There's sort of this burning desire to just enter into it fully, and in hindsight I find myself looking for situations that could allow me to do so. I.E. looking for a fight or a reason to be angry. In reflection I can see I find these sorts of experiences exciting and satisfying, as if I am proving something, but in the end it never goes quite how I want (the endgame doesn't feel completely or done right). I'm not entirely sure why, but it's definitely there. Part of me wants to say it's because it's permenantly bottled up, but I don't consciously think that.

    Anyway, for other 1's, what's your relationship with anger, how do you experience it/release it. For others, if you know any 1's, how do they do with it?
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    Senior Member great_bay's Avatar
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    I have 1w2 as my image. I go into hypercritical rampage with extreme passive-aggressiveness.

  3. #3
    Senior Member KitchenFly's Avatar
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    I am a 9w1 and a Sx/Sp.

    I view the would with my gut and I see the would though my senses at the visceral first level I can holly feel the would but it is far to intense that intensity can only be felt while within the balance of a higher synergy as a state of mind like a natural three into three.

    I find that my one wing is geared to managing stratagem refining context monitoring cognition. My Sx/Sp is my primary instinctual variant and it seaports and counterbalances and partly works with my one wing.

    My one wing and my instinct can act as a force unified in directive while my shadow side is engaged. The two forces together give me the punitive callas of the type 1 with a two wing and I an fertiliser with the focus and intensity of my own ESTJ,.

    My Instinctual energy of Sx/Sp while coupled with my one wing can behave with the directness and manipulative calculating punitive intensity of the 4w5 So/Sx Mind set energy. It most likely has an array of variations.

    Four and six are important energies for me in balancing my primary 9w1 energy. Four and six and five also helps to balance and utilise the eight energy at its instinctual and phycological levels and together as a synergy theses six enneagram points ( 9, 1, 4, 6, 5, 8, ) serve me and serve as a synergetic balance that Isabel's me to not be prone to Rage & Anger.

    I have done the full energy anger from point 1 and I have utilise the positive assertive anger of point one. So anger at point one has its proactive and dark potentialities.

    If I am stressed and unsettled then I can be snappy but in general I do keep my thinking and life narrative in check.

    Sometimes if I smoke pot or smoke a little to frequently I become a little hypersensitive and intolerant towards the over emo and apathetic problems my closest friend projects. I find that I become short in tolerance and EJ emo defend and TS block and try to stem or shut down that of witch irritates me about the other persons conversational output. So I think the ESTJ can also be EJTS or EJST.

    Point blank refusal to wont to or be open to, is my one wing but also is my Sp/So.

    So it gets complex and it is difficult to become a hole and compete human while energies not commonly used are preprogrammed to in gage in roles needed by mind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KitchenFly View Post
    I am a 9w1 and a Sx/Sp.

    I view the would with my gut and I see the would though my senses at the visceral first level I can holly feel the would but it is far to intense that intensity can only be felt while within the balance of a higher synergy as a state of mind like a natural three into three.

    I find that my one wing is geared to managing stratagem refining context monitoring cognition. My Sx/Sp is my primary instinctual variant and it seaports and counterbalances and partly works with my one wing.

    My one wing and my instinct can act as a force unified in directive while my shadow side is engaged. The two forces together give me the punitive callas of the type 1 with a two wing and I an fertiliser with the focus and intensity of my own ESTJ,.

    My Instinctual energy of Sx/Sp while coupled with my one wing can behave with the directness and manipulative calculating punitive intensity of the 4w5 So/Sx Mind set energy. It most likely has an array of variations.

    Four and six are important energies for me in balancing my primary 9w1 energy. Four and six and five also helps to balance and utilise the eight energy at its instinctual and phycological levels and together as a synergy theses six enneagram points ( 9, 1, 4, 6, 5, 8, ) serve me and serve as a synergetic balance that Isabel's me to not be prone to Rage & Anger.

    I have done the full energy anger from point 1 and I have utilise the positive assertive anger of point one. So anger at point one has its proactive and dark potentialities.

    If I am stressed and unsettled then I can be snappy but in general I do keep my thinking and life narrative in check.

    Sometimes if I smoke pot or smoke a little to frequently I become a little hypersensitive and intolerant towards the over emo and apathetic problems my closest friend projects. I find that I become short in tolerance and EJ emo defend and TS block and try to stem or shut down that of witch irritates me about the other persons conversational output. So I think the ESTJ can also be EJTS or EJST.

    Point blank refusal to wont to or be open to, is my one wing but also is my Sp/So.

    So it gets complex and it is difficult to become a hole and compete human while energies not commonly used are preprogrammed to in gage in roles needed by mind.
    This is barely even tangentially on topic, and I can't even begin to follow whateverthehell you're trying to say. But, yeah don't bother trying to reexplain it.
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    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Firstly, I'd like to say that I'm glad you've learned to see this aspect of yourself instead of denying it. Much healthier in the long run. (Also makes it less likely that people will tell you you're not a 1. )

    Now to move on to the questions in the OP:

    What's your relationship with anger?

    Love-hate.

    Love:
    - It fuels me and helps me stay motivated to accomplish my goals. I don't really know how I'd function without it.
    - Righteous anger makes doing the right thing feel AMAZING. Best I can describe it is like the difference between how pizza tastes when you're sober and how pizza tastes when you're drunk.

    Hate:
    - Too much anger is toxic, and a lot of things can anger me -- so out of necessity, I've had to learn how to pick and choose what I allow myself to be angry about. Anything else, I either try to detach from, ignore, or defuse with humor.
    - People tend to make me feel guilty whenever I actually release my anger around them. That is rarely, if ever, their intention, but I'm a people-pleaser, and I'm not completely oblivious, so I learned quickly that what the general public wants out of me is emotional consistency and predictability.
    - I have been known to act immaturely in situations when anger catches me off guard -- especially situations where I'm unexpectedly and publicly embarrassed, e.g. if I'm doing a group activity and doing poorly at it, or if I am corrected on something I remembered/argued incorrectly in a group -- and reacting to embarrassment by embarrassing myself kind of feels like kicking myself when I'm down.
    - Related to the previous point: I am so easily angered by people whose opinions are wrong, that I usually have to be one of the first people to drop out of a debate. Again, not wanting to embarrass myself by throwing a tantrum and saying something like "Well you're a BAD PERSON and should be ASHAMED"...
    - If I embrace my anger too much, it turns inward, and I go full 4. Enough said, lol.

    How do you experience anger / release it?

    It's pretty much always there in some form. If I'm feeling irritated, wary, judgmental, bitter, etc, that all connects to anger. It doesn't feel like a looming cloud, or anything ominous like that. I am aware most of the time that mild irritation, or similar feelings, could magnify exponentially at the drop of a hat, but that doesn't worry me.

    I release more mild levels of anger with humor and laughter, most of the time. Medium and high levels, I'll either listen to really loud music, or completely isolate myself from outside noise and stimuli. I might try to reason with myself, or I might take deep breaths and meditate for a couple of minutes, depending on whether I'm angry for good reason, or whether I'm angry because I have a bad attitude and need to put things in perspective.

    I made a kind of silly post about my "anger levels" a bit ago, and will re-post it here when I find it.
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    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



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    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Found it!

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Because I have too much time on my hands and lists are fun:


    EJCC's Anger Levels:

    Level 1: Anger can only be read in facial expression
    Level 2: Anger can be read in facial expression and word choice (much more formal)
    Level 3: Anger can be read in facial expression, word choice (colder), and tone of voice (irritated), but is still not acknowledged
    Level 4: Obviously annoyed, occasionally making snide remarks or frustrated exclamations ("You really believe that?" "Why are you still doing that?" "This is bullshit!!"), and often laughing out of frustration; will feel bad after outbursts and apologize
    Level 5: Raised voice, ready for a confrontation

    -----------------

    90% of anger is at levels 1-3, and a good deal of time is spent within those levels on a daily basis (what can I say, a lot of things irritate me)

    Levels 1-3: Control is maintained; intense internal battle is occurring over how to filter pure rage and frustration into something civil and constructive

    Level 4-5: Control is either in the process of being lost or is already lost; minimal fucks are given, if any


    (There's nothing higher than level 5, or at least there hasn't been in about 10 years -- I don't yell or throw things or try to hurt people emotionally)
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



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  7. #7
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Firstly, I'd like to say that I'm glad you've learned to see this aspect of yourself instead of denying it. Much healthier in the long run. (Also makes it less likely that people will tell you you're not a 1. )
    I don't think anyone has ever guessed me to be anything other than a 1. Once in a blue moon someone might think I am a 6 but they have always changed their minds when they see how I respond/deal with authority. Either way yes it definitely will be more healthy in the long run. The first step is understanding what causes anger, to what levels. Cause as it stands I don't well understand it. I have some ideas (I'll write the story in another post here when I get some labwork done- I have some potentially exciting results to sift through!).


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Love:
    - It fuels me and helps me stay motivated to accomplish my goals. I don't really know how I'd function without it.
    - Righteous anger makes doing the right thing feel AMAZING. Best I can describe it is like the difference between how pizza tastes when you're sober and how pizza tastes when you're drunk.
    I can't say it fuels me to stay motivated. Most of the time I wilt under high goals. Ultimately its failure that motivates me. I need to think about this more. That said, righteous anger definitely does make doing the right things feel really amazing, in particular if you're proven right in the process. THAT feels good.


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Hate:
    - Too much anger is toxic, and a lot of things can anger me -- so out of necessity, I've had to learn how to pick and choose what I allow myself to be angry about. Anything else, I either try to detach from, ignore, or defuse with humor.
    - People tend to make me feel guilty whenever I actually release my anger around them. That is rarely, if ever, their intention, but I'm a people-pleaser, and I'm not completely oblivious, so I learned quickly that what the general public wants out of me is emotional consistency and predictability.
    - I have been known to act immaturely in situations when anger catches me off guard -- especially situations where I'm unexpectedly and publicly embarrassed, e.g. if I'm doing a group activity and doing poorly at it, or if I am corrected on something I remembered/argued incorrectly in a group -- and reacting to embarrassment by embarrassing myself kind of feels like kicking myself when I'm down.
    - Related to the previous point: I am so easily angered by people whose opinions are wrong, that I usually have to be one of the first people to drop out of a debate. Again, not wanting to embarrass myself by throwing a tantrum and saying something like "Well you're a BAD PERSON and should be ASHAMED"...
    - If I embrace my anger too much, it turns inward, and I go full 4. Enough said, lol.
    Yeah too much anger clouds my thinking, and leads to me thinking the battle is WAY larger than it actually is. In the moment I genuinely believe with all my heart that I am being clear as crystal and I'll argue until I am sick to the teeth that I am. It's not until later on that I can see where clouds were. I'll also lock on to us vs. them mentality way way too much. Subsequently my discernment goes down. I don't think I have all that much control over what I feel anger over. I can contain it and keep it out of the way, but the feeling is still there. Overcontainment seems to make it worse too because then I'll get excessively gossipy and start trying to poison social networks between others (which is BAD). I can't say I feel guilty if I let anger out, but I do feel bad (mostly for making a mistake or feeling like I failed in some way. I think shame is the most accurate way to describe it for me). When I get angry at someone or something I find what I want most is for them to know in every way shape and form that they are wrong and they deserve what's coming to them. The line of "Well you're a BAD PERSON and should be ASHAMED" is extremely true. Anger also seems to make me less willing to argue details or semantics, and it will condense everything to a single point. Thus to others they understand it less. That single point is often the quality of the person. When I snap at some level people see me as overreacting. Granted, from everyone elses prospective I am in a permenant state of overreaction and hyperbole at varying levels (though I blame this more on being ENFJ and their tendancy towards dramatics). I don't think my anger has ever tilted me inwards towards 4 though. More often is I'll burn out from the anger, and it then slips to 4. I need to reflect on that more though.


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    It's pretty much always there in some form. If I'm feeling irritated, wary, judgmental, bitter, etc, that all connects to anger. It doesn't feel like a looming cloud, or anything ominous like that. I am aware most of the time that mild irritation, or similar feelings, could magnify exponentially at the drop of a hat, but that doesn't worry me.

    I release more mild levels of anger with humor and laughter, most of the time. Medium and high levels, I'll either listen to really loud music, or completely isolate myself from outside noise and stimuli. I might try to reason with myself, or I might take deep breaths and meditate for a couple of minutes, depending on whether I'm angry for good reason, or whether I'm angry because I have a bad attitude and need to put things in perspective.

    I made a kind of silly post about my "anger levels" a bit ago, and will re-post it here when I find it.
    That first sentance was the crux of the problem with not understanding it. I assumed all of those things were completely disconnected from anger, and anger was its own basic independent emotion. I find the way I let the anger is expressing it to others that didn't set me off. Being alone or doing things alone seldom does anything. I can do thought experiments to lower it, which I do naturally, but in those moments I become really sensitive but it's extremely rare to be poked in those situations.

    I'll reflect on all of this more and come back when I get more thought out.
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    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari

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  8. #8
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    I don't think anyone has ever guessed me to be anything other than a 1. Once in a blue moon someone might think I am a 6 but they have always changed their minds when they see how I respond/deal with authority.
    Yeah I was thinking 6, when I wrote that. I feel like a lot of people mistyped you as 6 early on. Though I can't blame them, because your 6 fix is SUPER strong.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    I can't say it fuels me to stay motivated. Most of the time I wilt under high goals. Ultimately its failure that motivates me. I need to think about this more.
    I'd be surprised if you were right about this. You aren't at all motivated by things that are wrong with the world/society/ideas? Correcting things out in the world that are wrong and therefore make you mad? Maybe I'm getting social-first 1 confused with self-pres-first 1.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    I don't think I have all that much control over what I feel anger over. I can contain it and keep it out of the way, but the feeling is still there.
    Wondering if some of this is also social-first 1 vs. non-social-first 1. I feel like no matter where I look, there's something that COULD be annoying, if I chose to think about it that way. Which is why I decided that 7 is second, not third, in my tritype: literally as soon as I shove that 1-ness out of the way, I revert to 7 and decide to distract myself with other things as a coping mechanism.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    I can't say I feel guilty if I let anger out, but I do feel bad (mostly for making a mistake or feeling like I failed in some way. I think shame is the most accurate way to describe it for me). When I get angry at someone or something I find what I want most is for them to know in every way shape and form that they are wrong and they deserve what's coming to them.
    Some of this could be Fe vs. Te. Also I always forget the difference between guilt and shame. After Googling it to remind myself, I agree that shame is more accurate in my case too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    I don't think my anger has ever tilted me inwards towards 4 though. More often is I'll burn out from the anger, and it then slips to 4. I need to reflect on that more though.
    If you're like me in this regard, then the point where slipping to 4 often begins is when you fail to measure up against your own "reasonable" 1 standards. You rage at yourself in the same way you'd rage (internally) at other people who disappoint you, only to a MUCH more extreme and unfair degree: you're a hypocrite, you will never measure up, why do you always fail, you irresponsible ignorant unreliable failure of a human being. And then you react to your own verbal abuse by retreating even further into 4.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    That first sentance was the crux of the problem with not understanding it. I assumed all of those things were completely disconnected from anger, and anger was its own basic independent emotion. I find the way I let the anger is expressing it to others that didn't set me off. Being alone or doing things alone seldom does anything. I can do thought experiments to lower it, which I do naturally, but in those moments I become really sensitive but it's extremely rare to be poked in those situations.
    I always find that aspect of Fe/Ni to be so interesting -- venting as a method of "thinking out loud" except for your emotions. Emoting out loud?

    A while ago I was trying to figure out how I used to manage my anger, when I was younger, because I pretty much never opened up to anyone and yet had a pretty good handle on my feelings from day to day. And then I remembered that I kept a journal. Apparently that was all my baby Fi needed!
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    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



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    want to ask me something? go for it!

  9. #9
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Yeah I was thinking 6, when I wrote that. I feel like a lot of people mistyped you as 6 early on. Though I can't blame them, because your 6 fix is SUPER strong.
    Only a few did (at least that I heard of). My 6 fix appears a lot stronger online than it is offline. If you see me in person I suspect you'll see this. My day to day I am not nearly as focused on security and it's concepts. My 3 fix is stronger, it's just heavily guarded from public view because my 1ness regards it is "undesirable". It's a different matter. I have many "masks" which is integral to who I am, but not many pick them out (some do though).

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I'd be surprised if you were right about this. You aren't at all motivated by things that are wrong with the world/society/ideas? Correcting things out in the world that are wrong and therefore make you mad? Maybe I'm getting social-first 1 confused with self-pres-first 1.
    Ok yeah, you are right. I am definitely motivated by the wrongs. The thing is though if I get into them too much I get needlessly angry, it effects my productivity and functionality. I'm definitely fixated on fixing the wrongs, and I don't go after them NEARLY as much as I want to. When I hear "motivation" I default to think of my overall major life goals (get a PhD, develop a social network, etc). However in a broad sense on what motivates my action on a small scale day-to-day week-to-week, yeah you would be absolutely correct then.


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Wondering if some of this is also social-first 1 vs. non-social-first 1. I feel like no matter where I look, there's something that COULD be annoying, if I chose to think about it that way. Which is why I decided that 7 is second, not third, in my tritype: literally as soon as I shove that 1-ness out of the way, I revert to 7 and decide to distract myself with other things as a coping mechanism.
    Oh I am the same, there are all kinds of things I could get annoyed at, but I will tell myself "*sigh* let it go" if I see it as a fruitless battle. However, sometimes my annoyance will be tripped very quickly at the get go, and I can't turn it off. I will usually have to rely on others to make it go away.


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Some of this could be Fe vs. Te. Also I always forget the difference between guilt and shame. After Googling it to remind myself, I agree that shame is more accurate in my case too.
    Guilt is not an emotion I feel very often, ever since I was a small child (guilt trips completely uneffected me). Because of it I've looked for other words to describe what I'll experience. Shame I am really succeptible to.


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    If you're like me in this regard, then the point where slipping to 4 often begins is when you fail to measure up against your own "reasonable" 1 standards. You rage at yourself in the same way you'd rage (internally) at other people who disappoint you, only to a MUCH more extreme and unfair degree: you're a hypocrite, you will never measure up, why do you always fail, you irresponsible ignorant unreliable failure of a human being. And then you react to your own verbal abuse by retreating even further into 4.
    Ok yes worded like this, it's dead on. I'm experiencing it right now actually. Long story short, HvZ had a changing of the guard and I lost my position as an executive mod to an ENTP 7w8 who's management style INFURIATES me. Even just thinking about it now is making me feel mad. Game wise he is ideologically opposed to me as well and I see him as just fundementally wrong. Alas, it's making me do all the things described. My INFJ 5w4 talked a bit of sense in me last night cause I got into the "woe is me everyone hates me I have been hated as a mod all along" stuff. It's still bothering me. It's also making me want to snap at ANYONE in mod squad who is trying to do anything new/different.

    Anyway yeah, it's absolutely true. I think that it's just not the only thing that can send me into 4, but this could be worsened since I'm bipolar II.


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I always find that aspect of Fe/Ni to be so interesting -- venting as a method of "thinking out loud" except for your emotions. Emoting out loud?
    I don't know how someone could not do that! It's definitely emoting outloud and it's essential for me. I get all bent out of shape and start beating myself up in ways I don't understand if I don't have a proper outlet.


    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    A while ago I was trying to figure out how I used to manage my anger, when I was younger, because I pretty much never opened up to anyone and yet had a pretty good handle on my feelings from day to day. And then I remembered that I kept a journal. Apparently that was all my baby Fi needed!
    My day to day feelings were a mess. When I tried to keep them in they just ate at me and festered. I have to be able to outlet them. Even the good things. For example: I have been having some really interesting/good things happen in lab lately and oh my gosh I have to talk about it. I was noticing that not being able to share it was actually making me feel bad. I'm coming to much better terms with the fact that I have to let out and emote often, and that I am not built as an apparent-objective non emotionally effected person. I absolutely can be objective and am regarded as such by many, but I never had the "image" I felt I should have.

    Anyway, thanks for all the help so far! This is really really helpful.
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    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari

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  10. #10
    Senior Member KitchenFly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    This is primarily for E1's but anyone can chime in with thoughts.

    Anyway, for other 1's, what's your relationship with anger, how do you experience it/release it. For others, if you know any 1's, how do they do with it?

    You asked a question of others I have a one wing that I utilise everyday, you asked an obscure question HOW DO THEY DO WITH IT?

    I answered it concisely.

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