User Tag List

First 34567 Last

Results 41 to 50 of 99

  1. #41
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    1w9 sp/sx
    Socionics
    ESI Fi
    Posts
    3,182

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Yeah, I had an ESTP 8 boss who was like this everytime I asked him to clarify something (and I really had to ask him because he was extremely picky about work being done exactly the way he wanted, and the way he wanted was fairly different from my natural style). Not to mention whenever anyone said something that went "over his head" - comment: "lol he's really stupid he can't even explain his ideas".

    I understand it's often a matter of being time-sensitive when there's a lot of stuff to do, but then you're asking the people around you to be mind readers rather than hard workers.
    I am in a similar situation now. And the bold is what I've noticed. I find it to be a ridiculous expectation.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    2) Another point that I would like to make is that many times in doing a task or trying to understand something, when I am asking my boatload of questions, it angers the 8's. So what I will do is just not ask questions in order to avoid confrontation. Then, once it's actually time to do the task, I won't know how to do it, and the 8 will look at me like I'm an incompetent dipshit. You are damned if you do, and damned if you don't.
    Again. I'm in a similar situation with the same 8 boss as mentioned above, and my conclusion is the bold.

    (And I'd just like to point out the wonderfully useless irony of this thread....asking 8's why you can't ask them. Funny stuff. Ha)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kasper View Post
    The best approach with 8s is: Be direct. If you've asked them once, and don't get it, ask someone else to explain in a different manner, if you cannot do that it is better to annoy them for clarification then do it wrong (just don't apologise over and over while you're asking), both approaches can be unappreciated but the latter is much worse.

    Plus what Jock said.
    Yea, I used to do this.

    I don't even bother asking anymore though. It's to the point that I don't care about the 8 anymore. So if I get it wrong, it's cause I wasn't trained right, not cause I'm stupid, and not cause I didn't ask. Oh well for them, shit happens.
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
    10w12

  2. #42
    Senior Member Sanjuro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    MBTI
    Ne
    Enneagram
    468 sx/so
    Socionics
    :-( None
    Posts
    822

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    2) My problem is that I have an 8w9 co-worker ...
    Wait, the guy you're writing this about is your co-worker? So, you don't actually work for him anyway? So you don't have to do anything he tells you, and you don't have to ask questions to clarify what you need to do?

    If so, I think that's your answer.

  3. #43
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Socionics
    ENTj
    Posts
    5,908

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    I don't even bother asking anymore though. It's to the point that I don't care about the 8 anymore. So if I get it wrong, it's cause I wasn't trained right, not cause I'm stupid, and not cause I didn't ask. Oh well for them, shit happens.
    At the end I did this and I had to eventually change jobs, much to the dismail of some colleagues who were better than me at "mind reading".
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  4. #44
    Anew Leaf
    Guest

    Default

    I don't think such responses are the sole glory of the 8. There is, on occasion, simply too many questions being asked and one must throw ones hands up in the air ala surrender in the form of "OMG IM DONE."

    I have to deal with my INTP father at my business on occasion during the week, and while at times it IS beneficial to have the power house of investigative functions working its magic upon the computers... it is another thing entirely to say "I want X done" and discover that my decision has now become a tug of war of details and facts which to me seem to be so obvious as to be dancing in glittering seductive costumes with a trick pony at their side to the point where I throw down the iron wall of "JUST DO IT AND DONT WONDER ABOUT IT" which drives him insane for he must know ALL THE REASONS.

    Overly curious NeTi should realize that like the ant, the only thing between it and death by pudding is the strength of the pudding's skin.

  5. #45
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    1w9 sp/sx
    Socionics
    ESI Fi
    Posts
    3,182

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    At the end I did this and I had to eventually change jobs, much to the dismail of some colleagues who were better than me at "mind reading".
    Yea, some people either:

    1)care to try to figure other ppl out

    2)or instinctively know what other ppl want , etc..

    I'm neither one of those types of ppl. And I find it an absurd idea that I would need to be. Just tell me how to do the job and I'll be running circles around you in no time. If you don't put in that initial effort with me though, you are your own drain to the company. Not my problem.

    And thankfully I'm just working so I can gain experience, start school again, and then I'll move on to my preferred field. I find that I can handle it only because I keep those end goals in mind.

    And if it ever gets to be too annoying, I have no real energy invested. So ironically I'm thankful to the 8 for that lol.

    (Also, I am apprehensive to change jobs because there's always going to be another 8....in one form or another. So I don't want to feel like I'm running away from my problems.)
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
    10w12

  6. #46
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    6w7
    Posts
    3,461

    Default

    @kyuuei

    Usually I get angry about that because whatever I just said probably took a lot of effort to say in the first place. I don't mind repeating myself when someone didn't hear me.. but when they did? and I just told them something pretty personal and shared something vulnerable only to get back "wait, what?" as if they weren't paying attention in the first place? Immediately annoying. Instead of saying "Wait, repeat that again?" it's much, much better to ask, "I understood you saying you x, but not y. Is that right? Why?"
    Ok thank you so much. That is actually a very good idea. From now on, I won't just say, "I don't understand". I will say, "I understand this" and "I understand that" but can you clarify this part? That's actually a really good idea.

    I
    t is rather annoying, and I'm entirely guilty of it. If a date pisses me off, I assume he knows WHY I'm mad. Typically he doesn't though. But to me it's really obvious--even if you DIDN'T know, just think back to when my mood changed.. what did you say/do right before then? What happened then? It's a better clue to say, "Why did me saying you're thin piss you off?" than "What did I do?! I didn't do ANYTHING!"
    Yeah, you have to work on that.

    @Redbone

    Yes...this. For me, these indirect, proby-poky, 'feel you out' questions are the worst. I hate sneakiness.
    Yeah, I have learned to curve any type of passive-aggressive tendencies with 8's. Eights tend to absolute despise passive-aggression any in way, shape, or form. Eights want you to be very upfront and direct with them. However, it can be very hard to be upfront with 8's and many of them don't seem to understand why this is. 8's in general tend to be very abrasive and can easily come off as scary to most people. So what happens is that people tend to avoid them like the plague. People tend to go behind 8's backs and tend to avoid them because they are so afraid to face them. Then when people go behind the 8's backs, they see it as being unloyal, as being sneaky, and as being untrustworthy. This is another thing that makes type 8's hard to deal with.

    @DiscoBiscuit

    I'll answer a question and help you get the concept the first time.

    From there you either get it or you don't.
    This is why I have hated every ennegram 8 professor that I have ever known.

    @ceecee

    Well let me ask you this. If you had to explain a task that someone did every day, same time, same way and still asked for clarification, where would you draw the line and say - you can't learn this and I can't explain it any more clearly? Maybe it wouldn't have to be repeated if that person seeking clarification learned it another way, for instance. Why is your learning placed on us? That's probably what is so angering for 8's, although I can't say for sure for every 8.
    Yeah, it would get very annoying to explain the same task over and over again. However, my quarrel with 8's is that they generally don't even want to explain the same task even more than once. 8's just don't realize that sometimes people just don't get something right off the bat.


    @Animal

    I fully, whole-heartedly agree with this description. I only differ in the sense that..ugh.. it turns me on.. <3
    Or at least, my ex turns me on.
    I love that man so hard.

    Admittedly my Sp-8 friend is very easy to deal with in comparison.
    It was basically a paraphrasing of Naranjo's sexual 8 description.

    @andante

    So if an 8 says 'hi', do you wonder if they want to kill you and insist that's the case since that's the nature of the beast?
    It's not just me who thinks this. 8's tend to have a way of carrying themselves where they just exert aggressive energy and people perceive it that way. 8's often don't understand just how aggressive that they come off to others. There may be no intended aggression on the 8's part, but that's how it comes off to other people.

  7. #47
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    6w7
    Posts
    3,461

    Default

    @Urarienev

    Again. I'm in a similar situation with the same 8 boss as mentioned above, and my conclusion is the bold.
    Yeah 8's are generally not my favorite enneagram type, but I created this thread as AN ATTEMPT to try find out how to get along with them.

    (And I'd just like to point out the wonderfully useless irony of this thread....asking 8's why you can't ask them. Funny stuff. Ha)
    Perhaps a better title for this thread would be, "Asking 8's to explain the things that they consider common sense".
    @Sanjuro

    Wait, the guy you're writing this about is your co-worker? So, you don't actually work for him anyway? So you don't have to do anything he tells you, and you don't have to ask questions to clarify what you need to do?

    If so, I think that's your answer.
    I work in security and though the guy is not my "official manager", he is the patrol officer and when the boss is gone, he is the next one in charge.

  8. #48
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    5,806

    Default

    My boss is an 8 I suspect, but I learnt very early on to be direct and not be particularly nervous about asking questions.

    I still get many things wrong because it's a highly detailed job and memorising steps is my weakest trait work wise, but I generally just let her criticisms wash over me and accept that sometimes I'll just forget information from time to time.

    We actually work quite well together because of this.

    PS: if you hadn't noticed, 8's don't really like sharing any information they deem not your business, unfortunately it can be a tough job even working out what is or isn't your business in their eyes. I remember the countless arguments I used to get into with my old stock room manager about his method for organising the stock.

    A lot of not my business going on there and yet I had to keep raising the point that if I'm working there it very much is my fucking business, thanks.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  9. #49
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    enfp
    Enneagram
    8
    Posts
    13,877

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Yeah, I have learned to curve any type of passive-aggressive tendencies with 8's. Eights tend to absolute despise passive-aggression any in way, shape, or form. Eights want you to be very upfront and direct with them. However, it can be very hard to be upfront with 8's and many of them don't seem to understand why this is. 8's in general tend to be very abrasive and can easily come off as scary to most people. So what happens is that people tend to avoid them like the plague. People tend to go behind 8's backs and tend to avoid them because they are so afraid to face them. Then when people go behind the 8's backs, they see it as being unloyal, as being sneaky, and as being untrustworthy. This is another thing that makes type 8's hard to deal with.
    The idea is, if you need the information, then you need it. If you don't, why are you asking at all? If you're needing to ask, then ask and be upfront about it. Give the situation some dignity and respect. It isn't like all of us are immediately going to bite someone heads off. In fact, I've had people frequently tell me I seem really scary, bitchy, cold-hearted... then when they get to know me, all those ideas vanish. It's a delusion people have--but they'll never get over it if they don't make steps to do so. I can't change someone's mind actively, they'll figure out if I'm really all those things or not on their own. Even if it's scary.. It isn't like there isn't anyone that intimidates me in my life either. Yet I get up there and do it. Because it is a sign of respect. I have a lot of trouble talking about my feelings, and it takes a lot to muster up that strength to do so.. but it's okay, and I do it, because I know it's important and there's a degree of health to it.

    I have never, ever heard anyone saying they felt more respected with passive-aggressive behavior. Not even quiet, shy, mousy people. And anything that can be mistaken for passive-aggressive behavior is more abrasive to me than anything you would ever say to me straight up, and immediately puts me on the defense. If it's someone I know well enough, it is easy for me to look past that. But I don't know many people THAT well.

    This is why I have hated every ennegram 8 professor that I have ever known.
    To be fair, teachers ought to have extensive training about how to properly teach students. I don't really have any problems getting a student to finally learn a subject regardless of how many times and ways I have to explain it.

    Yeah, it would get very annoying to explain the same task over and over again. However, my quarrel with 8's is that they generally don't even want to explain the same task even more than once. 8's just don't realize that sometimes people just don't get something right off the bat.
    It's a frustration, sure. But that's something 8s just work on with themselves. Because, really, no one gets EVERYTHING the first go-around in their lives. Frequently, though, I found that many people not getting a task immediately are not getting it because of distractions or a lack of paying attention--they didn't hear it the first time, they were on their phones, they didn't care then, they were daydreaming, and then they ask again because they realized too late important stuff was being said/done. So it is grating when you see that so constantly and frequently, and you're going to sometimes get mad at people who genuinely had real distractions they couldn't help, but it is what it is.

    It's not just me who thinks this. 8's tend to have a way of carrying themselves where they just exert aggressive energy and people perceive it that way. 8's often don't understand just how aggressive that they come off to others. There may be no intended aggression on the 8's part, but that's how it comes off to other people.
    I've learned the hard way that this is exactly how I come off. Nearly everyone I knew in the army thought I was a terrible scary person when they first met me.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
    Halla74: Think your way through the world. Feel your way through life.

    Cimarron: maybe Prpl will be your girl-bud
    prplchknz: i don't like it

    In Search Of... ... Kiwi Sketch Art ... Dream Journal ... Kyuuei's Cook book ... Kyu's Tiny House Blog ... Minimalist Challenge ... Kyu's Savings Challenge

  10. #50
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Socionics
    ENTj
    Posts
    5,908

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    but I generally just let her criticisms wash over me
    lol. Completely impossible for me. If you are not providing me the required information in a very detailed fashion, I will make it clear that it's also YOUR fault if you start criticizing me. Needless to say I'm not that loved as an employee by most "aggressive" bosses. Tbh in my experience 8s don't really like it anyway if you are very upfront and abrasive, just like them. They'll respect your for that but they'll also try to get rid of you as soon as possible. My current boss is a 2 and while he can be a bit histrionic, he knows how to talk with people as actual human beings - and that's enough for me.

    Anyway, I once had a very fruitful relationship with an 8 boss because he came around as I was very experienced in that specific job, so he let me do my stuff without being too controlling but still very fair. That was cool.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

Similar Threads

  1. Why do most people believe you can't change your type?
    By Zeego in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: 06-08-2016, 08:49 AM
  2. If enneagrams work using wing types, why can't mbti?
    By Kensei in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 04-27-2015, 01:15 AM
  3. Replies: 8
    Last Post: 01-10-2014, 09:23 PM
  4. why can't you buy just one carrot?
    By prplchknz in forum Home, Garden and Nature
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 01-07-2012, 11:26 AM
  5. [E6] Enneagram 6s, why don't I like you as much as I should?
    By Asterion in forum Enneatypes
    Replies: 69
    Last Post: 08-08-2011, 01:13 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO