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  1. #31
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post

    Wait, yeghor, did you just associate introverted intuition with Type 1? I have to hear the deduction behind this.
    I wouldn't say it is. Ni can link with E1 (I've met several over the years), but it's not the stereotype of it, and I'd hesitate to call it the most common. I'd say the most "classic" for E1 is SJ types. Reason being, is E1 often has a huge drive for traceable certainty (as it's innate with perfectionism and correctness), which is a strong marker of Si in the dominant or secondary position.

    When E1 is linked with Ni-doms, it usually shows as a desire and push for "grand designs" to be perfect in a way. It's a lot of refining "how things should ideally be", and they want everything to fit within their models. It doesn't have that classic obessiveness that can show in perfectionism that is often seen in E1 types.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  2. #32
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    This is true.

    I have wondered what the hell that would look like.

    It would be really fucking odd.

    And goddamn would they be good at it.

    (haha... if we could only be made to give a damn...)



    Ok, got it.

    Fair enough.

    I think the other method is more useful, though.



    ISTJ, ISFJ, INFJ

    I've seen a bunch of ISFJ and INFJ phobic 6s here... and at least one ISTJ...

    I've seen zero phobic INTJ 6s here...

    I don't see where you get that 6 is deprived of Fe...

    They really don't post here much anymore, but there used to be a cackle of IFJ phobic 6s here...

    I don't know if you could really draw an 6 subtype correlations to MBTI...

    Other than maybe ISTP counterphobics, and IFJ (and maybe ISJ as well) phobics.

    Consider how inferior Ne could cripple someone with paranoia just as bad, if not worse, than Ni dominance and Se inferior...

    Inferior Se might actually tend to lead the person to lash out more in a counterphobic sense, and perhaps actually be proactive...

    Whereas inferior Ne will be more just frantic mental scenario-making, and less tendency to actually get physically proactive.

    Remember, INTJs are overrepresented among those who use "Working Out/Exercising" as a Leisure Activity.

    (And also are among the top three types to be over-represented amongst substance abusers...)

    So, just because their Se is inferior, doesn't mean they don't use it! :P

    http://www.discoveryourpersonality.com/intj.html
    That's an interesting assessment. Come to think of it, inferior Ne would probably represent the inferiority complex surrounding the environment more than inferior Se. Inferior Ne would manifest itself negatively through the assessment of all kinds of negative possibilities in the environment, whereas inferior Se would manifest itself negatively through the inferiority complex surrounding the immediate environment. Not what could happen, as the type 6 is afraid of, but what already it. Therefore, the ISxJ would be a prime candidate to represent the phobic 6.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    When E1 is linked with Ni-doms, it usually shows as a desire and push for "grand designs" to be perfect in a way. It's a lot of refining "how things should ideally be", and they want everything to fit within their models. It doesn't have that classic obessiveness that can show in perfectionism that is often seen in E1 types.
    And that, in itself, is representative of the 1s drive for perfection through its most correlative function, Te. Meaning that most 1s are perfectionists of action (Je), rather than thought or analysis (Ni/Ti).

  4. #34
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    And that, in itself, is representative of the 1s drive for perfection through its most correlative function, Te. Meaning that most 1s are perfectionists of action (Je), rather than thought or analysis (Ni/Ti).
    Yeah I would agree with that. However, Fe can be and is action oriented, just in a different manner. Ultimately E1 types are external. A parallel would be E5's which can coincidentially become internal perfectionists. Not their main drive, it just sort of comes with the teritory at times.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  5. #35
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    ...Wait, @yeghor, did you just associate introverted intuition with Type 1? I have to hear the deduction behind this.
    Type One:
    Basic Fear: Of being corrupt/evil, defective
    Basic Desire: To be good, to have integrity, to be balanced

    We have named personality type One The Reformer because Ones have a “sense of mission” that leads them to want to improve the world in various ways, using whatever degree of influence they have. They strive to overcome adversity—particularly moral adversity—so that the human spirit can shine through and make a difference. They strive after “higher values,” even at the cost of great personal sacrifice.

    This orientation makes it difficult for them to trust their inner guidance—indeed, to trust life—so Ones come to rely heavily on their superego, a learned voice from their childhood, to guide them toward “the greater good” which they so passionately seek. When Ones have gotten completely entranced in their personality, there is little distinction between them and this severe, unforgiving voice. Separating from it and seeing its genuine strengths and limitations is what growth for Ones is about.
    The learned voice from childhood, i.e. superego, is coming from an "introverted perception" function, which continuously gazes internally upon the self, criticizes and instructs the self... it's a self-defense mechanism aimed to minimize the risks and threats to the self (mentally and physically)... However, it also torments and berates the self for mistakes (hence the perfectionism in 1s), and causes anxiety for the self, which also causes the self to be fearful, stressed as well as conflict and risk avoidant...

    Edit:
    Type One Key Motivations: Want to be right, to strive higher and improve everything, to be consistent with their ideals, to justify themselves, to be beyond criticism so as not to be condemned by anyone.
    Introverted perception functions are Si and Ni... Enneagram 9 descriptions mention something about 9 being the most grounded one in his body so I assumed Si is more related to 9 so that leaves Ni for enneagram 1...

  6. #36
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    You certainly have to have noticed how many people have challenged you on the forums, saying you're ideas are not well founded, or even just flat out wrong. There's a theme, and it seems that you aren't even picking up on that. If you are learning, it's really reeeeeeeeeally slow.
    Yeah I am not giving up am I...?

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    That's an interesting assessment. Come to think of it, inferior Ne would probably represent the inferiority complex surrounding the environment more than inferior Se. Inferior Ne would manifest itself negatively through the assessment of all kinds of negative possibilities in the environment, whereas inferior Se would manifest itself negatively through the inferiority complex surrounding the immediate environment. Not what could happen, as the type 6 is afraid of, but what already it. Therefore, the ISxJ would be a prime candidate to represent the phobic 6.
    The other thing to keep in mind is the Fe will lead to more of a phobic response than Te, as Fe will choose to submit or defer more often than Te, which will try to dominate, take charge, and impose both/either tertiary Fi's mandate, or what it considers to be objective Te truth. The 6SSs, the most superegoic and purely Systemic/mental of all (sub)types (of which I am one), is the counterphobic subtype, and would correlate to Te (and Ni, and probably Ti [and perhaps Ne as well]) thinking more than any of the other functions.

    When I think of a phobic 6, my first thought is a deferring ISFJ (and, secondarily, INFJ and ISTJ).
    When I think of the Prussian 6, I first think of STJs (and then all the other IJs).
    When I think of counterphobic 6s, I think of NTJS and STPs (and NTPs and SFPs).

  8. #38
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeghor View Post
    Yeah I am not giving up am I...?
    That's not necessarily a good thing. It's one thing to try, it's another to keep redoing the same thing with at best a veneer change.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  9. #39
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    This might be helpful

    In this graph, as you see only about 10% of INFJs are of enneagram types 1 and 2... If what I say holds water, this means that only 1 in 10 INFJs online is an actual INFJ...

    And half of those who type themselves as INFJs are of the enneagram type 4, which I associate with IxFPs... So it appears @Azure Flame was not that off the mark when he was "ranting" about INFPs mistyped as INFJs...

    That means at any given time, half the INFJs you converse with will actually be IxFPs...

    Check these people that identify themselves as INFJs for instance, mind that these guys and gals all have good self-confidence and image, do you see any signs of "superego" at play in these videos? Especially at earlier ages, INFJs would look and dress very much like ISFJs do... only later in my 30s have I started to assert my own looks...:

    Disclaimer: This is not about elitism or uniqueness or stuff...

    ISFP - Pin-up girl


    IxFP - Fi eyes


    ISFP - Chill guy


    Don't know - but she has too much make-up on...

  10. #40
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Continued

    xxFP


    xxFP - Fi eyes


    xNFP - Too much accessorizing...


    xNFP - Goth style?

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