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  1. #31
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Octavarium View Post
    ...is quintessentially NF.
    No. Many other types would say similar things.

    Something I didn't mention @Look Alive_Sunshine is how many statements you make in this thread that (IMO) a 4 would never say. You have some 4 traits perhaps, but not the drives. You do sound clearly like an identity centre (ie, 2,3,4), though.

    The fact you identified with the Social 4 type (which is what I am ) could just be that 3-ness coming through, because there is some cross-over between 3 traits and the social instinct. You don't really strike me as a social dom either, and certainly not a So/Sp. You seem too direct, where a So-dom would have more diffuse energy. Have you looked at some 3 stack descriptions?
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  2. #32
    Senior Member HBIC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    No. Many other types would say similar things.

    Something I didn't mention @Look Alive_Sunshine is how many statements you make in this thread that (IMO) a 4 would never say. You have some 4 traits perhaps, but not the drives. You do sound clearly like an identity centre (ie, 2,3,4), though.

    The fact you identified with the Social 4 type (which is what I am ) could just be that 3-ness coming through, because there is some cross-over between 3 traits and the social instinct. You don't really strike me as a social dom either, and certainly not a So/Sp. You seem too direct, where a So-dom would have more diffuse energy. Have you looked at some 3 stack descriptions?
    I said So/Sp because when I read type 4's subtypes by stacks, that was the one that jumped out at me:
    Social (Des. 5): I can describe them this way: They're kind of like the outsiders who wished they fit in. Not the "F you" outsiders, but the "I wanna join but I'm not good enough" outsiders. They wished they possessed all the qualities of 'regular' people (which they feel they lack) so that they can do what they really want to do: participate in society. This is why they're kinda hard to notice, since they're usually innocuous and not all that attention-seeking. To acquaintances they're pretty friendly and generally try to please, but they can get kinda holier-than-thou and reactive with people they know well, esp. when it has something to do with how they are perceived by others. If you challenge their image of themselves they just FLIP OUT royally and will have a hell of a time trusting you. They are VERY aware of social norms and deliberately try to 'stand out' and kinda "wait around" for someone to notice them. They're not very likely to do stuff to get 'any' kind of attention, just 'worthy' attention. Like they're not going to start a fit to get ANYONE's sympathy, they usually direct their acting towards certain individuals/groups. To others they just try their best to act normal so that no one notices that they're not.
    so/sp - warm outward focus retreats quickly inward when threatened

    The social 4w3 tend to be the quiet ones that hang out in the "alternative" cliques with 3w4s or 7s. They need to be part of a group and express themselves through some kind of interest, whether its raving or theatre plays or whatever. They lack confidence outside their area of expression, though. The SP 4w3 never seems to lack confidence around others and it only comes out in private or with close friends. Otherwise the need to feel "elite" and above the commoners is important, although they do want others to pay attention to them and what they do.

    soc/sp - This type is often the most comfortable in group settings, but tends to be a bit formal and awkward in one to one relations.
    But I guess that now that I read it again, I can 3's motivation alignig with it.

    Just read the info at the link you posted and:
    Sexual/Self-pres

    This subtype can appear almost Four-like. They can be dramatic and appear introspective, especially with the Four wing. There is an on and off quality to these Threes. They can be very emotional and then become very business like. It’s not uncommon to find this subtype in the arts, especially as actors, singers or performers. The outward sexual energy coupled with the secondary self-pres energy can cause these Threes to focus on projecting an image of themselves to the world. They will seek validation in the area of their persona. This type especially wrestles with the authenticity of the persona/image they create. On the one hand, the image protects the real self, but at the same time they hate the image they project. This subtype is likely to be in a constant state of flux when it comes to the image they project and for this reason, they run the risk of burn-out and disillusionment. They are more prone to depression than the other subtypes.

    When healthier, these Threes begin to trust their intimate relationships, and begin to disentangle the real self from the flux of partial identities they create. They learn that being vulnerable is necessary if they are to get what they really want, which is to reveal the real self and trust that they are lovable even with their flaws.
    It's picth perfect, word by word.

  3. #33
    Blood of the Exile Animal's Avatar
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    @Look Alive_Sunshine

    I'm with @Southern Kross on this, at this juncture. I think 3 seems much more likely. I'll break down your posts again soon and explain. As for Sx/Sp, that description REALLY DOES sound like your energy that I've seen so far. You seem to know yourself well. It's refreshing.

    Figuring out instincts, it's a bit more complex than a short description. Basically - the first instinct is the one you obsess over, which 'trips you up' in a very conscious way. If you're SX first then whenever you meet a partner you're obsessing over them rejecting you, or becoming insecure about it. IF you're Sp first it's more insecurity about money, resoucres and physical comfort. If you're Social first it's more insecurity about your place in the larger world, or the state of the world at large and where you fit into it, your social network connections etc. The second instinct (for example if you're Sx/sP the second is Sp) - this instinct is what you use to smooth over the first. In other words if I'm Sx/So, I'd be very 'smooth' socially or comfortable with my place in the world at large, so when I'm having Sx insecurity, the way I attempt to resolve it is by thinking wider, or socializing with a larger network to feel like 'i dont need him', staying connected with others too or.. if I have a boyfriend I might introduce him to my social circle. IF I'm Sx/Sp then when I'm insecure I'd attempt to resolve it with physical exercise or bodily pleasures, and if I have a boyfriend I'd provide such pleasures for him.

    The last instinct - (the one not listed in the double stack) is more of a blind-spot that you don't think about, but it creeps up to haunt you when you're not looking, and at that point you can feel insecure about it.

    That's a very over-simplified (and I'm not sure if exactly accurate) explanation. But I'll write more later. I don't personally have a strong opinion on your instincts yet, but I'm seeing more and more 3 core.
    Art is the blood of the Exile
    4w3 6w7 8w9 ~ Sx/Sp ~ ISTP ~ LSI-Se

  4. #34
    Senior Member HBIC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Animal View Post
    @Look Alive_Sunshine

    I'm with @Southern Kross on this, at this juncture. I think 3 seems much more likely. I'll break down your posts again soon and explain. As for Sx/Sp, that description REALLY DOES sound like your energy that I've seen so far. You seem to know yourself well. It's refreshing.

    Figuring out instincts, it's a bit more complex than a short description. Basically - the first instinct is the one you obsess over, which 'trips you up' in a very conscious way. If you're SX first then whenever you meet a partner you're obsessing over them rejecting you, or becoming insecure about it. IF you're Sp first it's more insecurity about money, resoucres and physical comfort. If you're Social first it's more insecurity about your place in the larger world, or the state of the world at large and where you fit into it, your social network connections etc. The second instinct (for example if you're Sx/sP the second is Sp) - this instinct is what you use to smooth over the first. In other words if I'm Sx/So, I'd be very 'smooth' socially or comfortable with my place in the world at large, so when I'm having Sx insecurity, the way I attempt to resolve it is by thinking wider, or socializing with a larger network to feel like 'i dont need him', staying connected with others too or.. if I have a boyfriend I might introduce him to my social circle. IF I'm Sx/Sp then when I'm insecure I'd attempt to resolve it with physical exercise or bodily pleasures, and if I have a boyfriend I'd provide such pleasures for him.

    The last instinct - (the one not listed in the double stack) is more of a blind-spot that you don't think about, but it creeps up to haunt you when you're not looking, and at that point you can feel insecure about it.

    That's a very over-simplified (and I'm not sure if exactly accurate) explanation. But I'll write more later. I don't personally have a strong opinion on your instincts yet, but I'm seeing more and more 3 core.
    I realize that, but my tests results are all over the place for instincts and reading the type descriptions with stacks it's better than reading the ones without them.

    I think that I can say for certain that Sp is the second one. Sexual sounds off in general because I've never obssessed with people in any way and the interaction style usuall described freaks me out. But Sexual 3 sounds about right...

  5. #35
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by Look Alive_Sunshine View Post
    I realize that, but my tests results are all over the place for instincts and reading the type descriptions with stacks it's better than reading the ones without them.

    I think that I can say for certain that Sp is the second one. Sexual sounds off in general because I've never obssessed with people in any way and the interaction style usuall described freaks me out. But Sexual 3 sounds about right...
    If the sx/sp interaction style freaks you out my bet is you aren't sx/sp. Nothing in your questionnaire answers struck me as sx/sp. Sx/so, maybe, but not sx/sp. (I still think so/sp is probably a good fit.)

    Have you read these? In my experience they are very right on.

    soc/sx
    Motivation: to create lasting connections with those they are interested in - the "best friend."

    soc/sp
    Motivation: to attain status within their chosen sphere - the "social climber."

    sp/sx
    Motivation: to live in a secure, comfortable environment where they can pursue their private interests in depth.

    sp/soc
    Motivation: to attain a position of material and societal security.

    sx/sp
    Motivation: to know the heart, reconcile inner conflict, form a secure union.

    sx/so
    Motivation: to impact others, question assumptions, challenge convention.

    The link they are from goes into greater detail about the instincts but I often think the essence of something is more universal than the particulars. From here: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...tual-Stackings

  6. #36
    Senior Member HBIC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    If the sx/sp interaction style freaks you out my bet is you aren't sx/sp. Nothing in your questionnaire answers struck me as sx/sp. Sx/so, maybe, but not sx/sp. (I still think so/sp is probably a good fit.)

    Have you read these? In my experience they are very right on.

    soc/sx
    Motivation: to create lasting connections with those they are interested in - the "best friend."

    soc/sp
    Motivation: to attain status within their chosen sphere - the "social climber."

    sp/sx
    Motivation: to live in a secure, comfortable environment where they can pursue their private interests in depth.

    sp/soc
    Motivation: to attain a position of material and societal security.

    sx/sp
    Motivation: to know the heart, reconcile inner conflict, form a secure union.

    sx/so
    Motivation: to impact others, question assumptions, challenge convention.

    The link they are from goes into greater detail about the instincts but I often think the essence of something is more universal than the particulars. From here: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...tual-Stackings
    I had it as so/sp while I was sure I was a type 4. Those 4w3 so/sp descriptions resonated with me. But the 3w4 so/sp don't.

    Based on these one liners, I'd say sx/so first, then so/sp and lastly sp/sx.

    When I said the interactions freaked me out I meant sx doms romantic interactions in general, not sx/sp. The ones I read were about sexual 4's.

    This was something about sx dom I had never came across:

    This intensity does not have to be met by another person—it can be satisfied by a project, hobby, or special interest. Rather than looking inward or to the group to resolve their problems and challenges, these types tend to look to close relations and activities that can guarantee them an experience of liveliness and intensity.

    SX-first people enjoy feeling invigorated. They may fantasize about scenarios that make them feel alive and that are emotionally stimulating. Key words: activation, immersion, charisma, broadcasting displays, fusion, inspiration, volatility.
    That was interesting, because usuall they describe sx doms as obssessed with only people, not things.

  7. #37
    Blood of the Exile Animal's Avatar
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    I'm a clear SX dom, according to some the most clear they've ever seen lol… and I'm mostly obsessed with my projects, music, writing and so forth, and sometimes a person.

    That being said, even if my projects come to include social issues, the crux of them is always about a person. My songs, stories, everything; people tell me the lyrics are 'intellectual' and make psychological deep points… but I will be the first to confess that even a song that is about people or about myself, or about a social idea… was motivated by a guy I was in love with, either an ex or a prospect or a current…. EVERY TIME. It's always a thought process inspired by an SX connection. But then, over time, the project becomes much bigger to me than the SX connection alone. Like my book now, I came up with the plot 10 years ago and it came from IRL experiences with specific people.. but then their ideals and so forth, stemmed out to "symbolize" something larger.
    @Look Alive_Sunshine
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    4w3 6w7 8w9 ~ Sx/Sp ~ ISTP ~ LSI-Se

  8. #38
    Male johnnyyukon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Look Alive_Sunshine View Post
    I had it as so/sp while I was sure I was a type 4. Those 4w3 so/sp descriptions resonated with me. But the 3w4 so/sp don't.

    Based on these one liners, I'd say sx/so first, then so/sp and lastly sp/sx.

    When I said the interactions freaked me out I meant sx doms romantic interactions in general, not sx/sp. The ones I read were about sexual 4's.

    This was something about sx dom I had never came across:



    That was interesting, because usuall they describe sx doms as obssessed with only people, not things.
    You seem like you're mostly having an illuminating discussion on what enneagram you are. That's great, BUT I just wanted to say that really, in the end, I think you're the only one that can type yourself.
    I've had this ice cream bar, since I was a child!

    Each thought's completely warped
    I'm like a walkin', talkin', ouija board.

  9. #39
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by Look Alive_Sunshine View Post
    I had it as so/sp while I was sure I was a type 4. Those 4w3 so/sp descriptions resonated with me. But the 3w4 so/sp don't.

    Based on these one liners, I'd say sx/so first, then so/sp and lastly sp/sx.

    When I said the interactions freaked me out I meant sx doms romantic interactions in general, not sx/sp. The ones I read were about sexual 4's.

    This was something about sx dom I had never came across:



    That was interesting, because usuall they describe sx doms as obssessed with only people, not things.
    Interesting, you picked all the contra-flow types. This doesn't surprise me, that's what I was figuring for you. Information on contra-flow and syn-flow are on the link I sent you. Yes, sexual doms will be obsessed by whatever or whomever attracts them. As @Animal says, it's typically both. For sexual doms, life is about getting that charge and intensity.

    I would think a 4w3 so/sp would identify a lot with 3. Conversely, it makes sense that sx 3w4 would identify a lot with 4. That's why I'd say try to focus on the instincts irrespective of the enneagram type. It might actually help you figure out your core type.

  10. #40
    Blood of the Exile Animal's Avatar
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    @brainheart - I agree with you on that, especially where the dominant instinct is concerned.

    I make a decent example of this, I think..

    Art is the blood of the Exile
    4w3 6w7 8w9 ~ Sx/Sp ~ ISTP ~ LSI-Se

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