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  1. #121
    brainheart
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    This whole six freak out thing will never make sense to me. On the whole, if I had to pick, six is probably my favorite type. And I'm not saying that to be diplomatic or anything. They are just cool, interesting, complex people. (Yes I'm married to one so I'm a little biased.)

    Seriously, why do people freak the hell out about six? I'm asking, honestly, because I don't get it and I want some answers.

  2. #122

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    I agree with the sentiment of the OP. It's overly simplistic to say that 6s can't be aggressive because they're not an "aggressive type", but it's also true that not everyone who is aggressive is a 6, and not everyone who is aggressive because they're insecure and want to prove how much of a badass they are is a 6.

    I think 6, as a type, tends to be defined in a much broader way than the others. @Sanjuro has already pointed out most of the reasons; the self-contradictory nature of the type, and the way the enneagram community seems to assume that anyone who has a six trait is a six. Honestly, with the way some people define the type, I don't know what it would take to not be a six.

    Meanwhile, type 8 is defined so narrowly that it sometimes makes me wonder whether 8s (as described on internet forums) even exist. If you're being immature and overly aggressive, you're not an 8. If you ever feel vulnerable, or you're ever affected by any human emotion whatsoever other than anger, you're not an 8. Oh, and most self-typed 8s are "not animalistic enough" to be 8s, whatever that means.

    Maybe I'm exaggerating a little, but my point is that some forum members are very eager to put people into the 6 category (if you don't fit anywhere else you're probably a 6, because the opposite of a 6 is a 6) but if you type as an 8, (and the same thing happens with 4 and 5 to an extent) as @Animal said, it's like you have to prove that you're a "real 8". 8 (and 4 and 5) are not standards that people can either meet or fail to live up to.

    My final point on the subject of 8s is that, I don't know whether there are lots of people who want to be 8s, or if that's just something people on forums say, but speaking for myself, I have never wanted to be an 8. Maybe because I've never seriously considered the type for myself (I ruled out all the id types very quickly) and I don't have any desire to be a very different kind of person than who I actually am, but also because the descriptions just don't appeal to me. That's not to say I think 8 is a bad type (I'm not sure I've ever met an 8 IRL, so I don't really have an opinion on whether I tend to like/get along with them) but those Riso and Hudson descriptions that everyone supposedly aspires to, if anything, in their more exaggerated parts at least, make them seem like bullies with no conscience.

    And my actual final point for this post is that, even if 6 is the most common type in the general population (and we don't have any evidence to back that up as far as I'm aware) that doesn't necessarily mean that 6 should be the most common type on typology forums. Maybe some types are more likely to be drawn to the Enneagram, or to internet forums, than others.

  3. #123
    ndovjtjcaqidthi
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    On the whole, if I had to pick, six is probably my favorite type. And I'm not saying that to be diplomatic or anything. They are just cool, interesting, complex people.
    So it begins.

  4. #124

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    Quote Originally Posted by Animal View Post
    1s and 5s are less likely to deny it, though they can also mistype.
    Why do you think this is? Is it just that they don't have the particular issues the other types have, which you listed in your post, or do you think there's something in particular about 1s and 5s that makes denial less likely?

    Speaking of 1s, it seems like a very high percentage of the 1s who post on typology forums have mistyped at 6 at some time. They do have a lot in common; Sp 1s, especially with their anxiety and "negative anticipation" tend to relate to 6, and social 6 descriptions can sometimes sound somewhat 1-ish. In fact, 6/1 has always struck me as a much more similar pair of types than 6/8.

  5. #125
    hypersane Hive's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Seriously, why do people freak the hell out about six? I'm asking, honestly, because I don't get it and I want some answers.
    They're the most "boring". Descriptions paint them as insecure, rule abiding, loyal to groups and systems (i.e. part of the herd), which are way less cool flaws than being impulsive and prone to addiction (7), or being an angry, bulldozing asshole (8), for example. I particularly think it's the insecurity and almost milquetoaste traits described in type profiles which makes people averse to identifying as 6. And, as this thread testifies to, counterphobia is often forgotten or ignored, which is a hugely important aspect of Sixes since the phobic/counterphobic spectrum makes them the most diverse type in the way they go about their basic fear/motivation (since most Sixes fluctuate between phobia/counterphobia, tho one of them is usually the default state).

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    This whole six freak out thing will never make sense to me. On the whole, if I had to pick, six is probably my favorite type. And I'm not saying that to be diplomatic or anything. They are just cool, interesting, complex people. (Yes I'm married to one so I'm a little biased.)

    Seriously, why do people freak the hell out about six? I'm asking, honestly, because I don't get it and I want some answers.
    Because 6s are balls of anxiety and insecurity. Just talking about 6s is like kicking a bee hive. Anyone with 6 influence goes into fight or flight mode. I already knew this thread was going to explode before I posted it.

  7. #127
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by unsung View Post
    They're the most "boring". Descriptions paint them as insecure, rule abiding, loyal to groups and systems (i.e. part of the herd), which are way less cool flaws than being impulsive and prone to addiction (7), or being an angry, bulldozing asshole (8), for example. I particularly think it's the insecurity and almost milquetoaste traits described in type profiles which makes people averse to identifying as 6. And, as this thread testifies to, counterphobia is often forgotten or ignored, which is a hugely important aspect of Sixes since the phobic/counterphobic spectrum makes them the most diverse type in the way they go about their basic fear/motivation (since most Sixes fluctuate between phobia/counterphobia, tho one of them is usually the default state).
    But they aren't the most boring. If anything, they're the contrary. Besides, they are loyal to a fault. Seriously, you cannot get a six to leave you. My husband (ESFP/6w7so/sx/631) was the first person I had a romantic relationship with who was presented with all of my drama and inner turmoil and said, "You know, I know this is going to be tough but I love you so I will stick through this." How can you not love that and think it's the most badass thing ever?

    Also, as you say, most sixes oscillate between counterphobic and phobic which means there is never a dull moment. My sexual instinct loves that.

    Sixes are the most truly punk rock people in existence.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    This whole six freak out thing will never make sense to me. On the whole, if I had to pick, six is probably my favorite type. And I'm not saying that to be diplomatic or anything. They are just cool, interesting, complex people. (Yes I'm married to one so I'm a little biased.)

    Seriously, why do people freak the hell out about six? I'm asking, honestly, because I don't get it and I want some answers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Octavarium View Post
    I agree with the sentiment of the OP. It's overly simplistic to say that 6s can't be aggressive because they're not an "aggressive type", but it's also true that not everyone who is aggressive is a 6, and not everyone who is aggressive because they're insecure and want to prove how much of a badass they are is a 6.

    I think 6, as a type, tends to be defined in a much broader way than the others. @Sanjuro has already pointed out most of the reasons; the self-contradictory nature of the type, and the way the enneagram community seems to assume that anyone who has a six trait is a six. Honestly, with the way some people define the type, I don't know what it would take to not be a six.

    Meanwhile, type 8 is defined so narrowly that it sometimes makes me wonder whether 8s (as described on internet forums) even exist. If you're being immature and overly aggressive, you're not an 8. If you ever feel vulnerable, or you're ever affected by any human emotion whatsoever other than anger, you're not an 8. Oh, and most self-typed 8s are "not animalistic enough" to be 8s, whatever that means.

    Maybe I'm exaggerating a little, but my point is that some forum members are very eager to put people into the 6 category (if you don't fit anywhere else you're probably a 6, because the opposite of a 6 is a 6) but if you type as an 8, (and the same thing happens with 4 and 5 to an extent) as @Animal said, it's like you have to prove that you're a "real 8". 8 (and 4 and 5) are not standards that


    Quote Originally Posted by unsung View Post
    They're the most "boring". Descriptions paint them as insecure, rule abiding, loyal to groups and systems (i.e. part of the herd), which are way less cool flaws than being impulsive and prone to addiction (7), or being an angry, bulldozing asshole (8), for example. I particularly think it's the insecurity and almost milquetoaste traits described in type profiles which makes people averse to identifying as 6. And, as this thread testifies to, counterphobia is often forgotten or ignored, which is a hugely important aspect of Sixes since the phobic/counterphobic spectrum makes them the most diverse type in the way they go about their basic fear/motivation (since most Sixes fluctuate between phobia/counterphobia, tho one of them is usually the default state).
    people can either meet or fail to live up to.

    My final point on the subject of 8s is that, I don't know whether there are lots of people who want to be 8s, or if that's just something people on forums say, but speaking for myself, I have never wanted to be an 8. Maybe because I've never seriously considered the type for myself (I ruled out all the id types very quickly) and I don't have any desire to be a very different kind of person than who I actually am, but also because the descriptions just don't appeal to me. That's not to say I think 8 is a bad type (I'm not sure I've ever met an 8 IRL, so I don't really have an opinion on whether I tend to like/get along with them) but those Riso and Hudson descriptions that everyone supposedly aspires to, if anything, in their more exaggerated parts at least, make them seem like bullies with no conscience.

    And my actual final point for this post is that, even if 6 is the most common type in the general population (and we don't have any evidence to back that up as far as I'm aware) that doesn't necessarily mean that 6 should be the most common type on typology forums. Maybe some types are more likely to be drawn to the Enneagram, or to internet forums, than others.
    Quote Originally Posted by Octavarium View Post
    Why do you think this is? Is it just that they don't have the particular issues the other types have, which you listed in your post, or do you think there's something in particular about 1s and 5s that makes denial less likely?

    Speaking of 1s, it seems like a very high percentage of the 1s who post on typology forums have mistyped at 6 at some time. They do have a lot in common; Sp 1s, especially with their anxiety and "negative anticipation" tend to relate to 6, and social 6 descriptions can sometimes sound somewhat 1-ish. In fact, 6/1 has always struck me as a much more similar pair of types than 6/8.


    SUCH A FUCKING CROCK OF SHIT I JUST LOST A LONG ASS FUCKING RESPONSE TO THESE

  9. #129
    hypersane Hive's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    But they aren't the most boring.
    Well, you know. Stereotypes and misunderstandings become perpetuated by dilettants with superficial knowledge from poor and incomplete internet descriptions. Nothing new under the sun.

    And the thing about loyalty was more to point out that the good and bad traits of Sixes aren't as cool and alluring as with other types. A lot of people interested in enneagram are in search of an identity and few wants to identify with unexotic attributes like loyal, reliable and anxious when they can get sexy traits like artistic, intense and moody or intellectual, innovative and nihilistic from other types.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by unsung View Post
    Well, you know. Stereotypes and misunderstandings become perpetuated by dilettants with superficial knowledge from poor and incomplete internet descriptions. Nothing new under the sun.
    It's *almost* like you're describing somebody in this very thread...

    And the thing about loyalty was more to point out that the good and bad traits of Sixes aren't as cool and alluring as with other types. A lot of people interested in enneagram are in search of an identity and few wants to identify with unexotic attributes like loyal, reliable and anxious when they can get sexy traits like artistic, intense and moody or intellectual, innovative and nihilistic from other types.
    You know, for someone with only 250 posts or so, what you do post always bears a disproportionately heavy weight with me, and what you have posted I almost invariably have found to be highly accurate and insightful.

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