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  1. #41
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stansmith View Post
    Probably not...but I'm sort of half-there mentally when it comes to social-situations, so I rarely experience myself as part of a cohesive unit. At most, I'm a receptive participant.
    That really, really sounds social-last to me. I mean, isn't that practically the definition of the last instinct "blind spot"?

    Anyways, your previous post almost seemed to be assuming the non-existence of social-first and second people. Re: whether "everyone" is experiencing that discomfort -- from my knowledge of the social instinct, people who are well-versed in it should have a very good idea of who's uncomfortable and who isn't -- or at least, which sections and sub-sections of the group would be most likely to be uncomfortable. Based on that quick analysis you could decide which subgroup you choose to cater to.

    Some of this could also be Fe. I tend to have a lot of Fe and social first/second friends, so this whole fuck-the-group mentality that some people have -- not Qlip, but others (going on an Ne semi-tangent here) -- is completely foreign to me, as is the assumption that "most people" wouldn't care about group atmosphere.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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    want to ask me something? go for it!

  2. #42
    ndovjtjcaqidthi
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    If you eat awkward silence you should hang out with me. lol Interesting reaction. Although I might get paranoid in response. I'd think you were trying to play mind tricks on me. Which you would be. So maybe we shouldn't hang out.
    That sounds exactly like something @prplchknz would say^

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    Yeah that's nice. But it takes awhile ime.
    You can get lucky.

  3. #43
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Thanks -- this makes sense to me. I can see how in that situation, remaining silent would make sense as a sort of test. If they had been friendly and accepting, they would have reached out to you. The fact that they didn't was an indicator that either they weren't interested, as you suggested, or they were too uncomfortable with straying from their comfort zone. Neither option is terribly accepting, interesting, or kind.

    If this is a representative example of the times when you intentionally make social situations uncomfortable, then I think both @Hard and I had a bit of a communication breakdown. Because when you get down to it, you weren't entering that situation going "I will make them uncomfortable and I'm fine with it" -- if I understand you correctly, your perspective was "I'm testing you to see if you're accepting of who I am as a person -- and I am not a socially inappropriate person, nor are my actions socially inappropriate, so if you are uncomfortable, then that's your problem". I've done almost exactly what you described, also as a social test, but didn't consider it socially inappropriate at all -- any social awkwardness would have been due to individuals and not the group as a whole.
    Ah, I'm glad you think it's socially acceptable, and I'm sure @Hard would think so as well. But the things is, I disagree with him, and probably you :P in principal. I'll give you another example, occasionally I'll say very awkward things. I was in a party conversation once with kind of respectable people, and I think I was discussing my views on discomfort, actually, they were disagreeing, much like you are, and I said in a very non joking voice, "I have PTSD, I get nervous when I'm not uncomfortable."

    Now, I was being kind of provocative because I knew it would be taken that way, but in a manner of speaking it was true. Everybody went silent, my friend shook her head, she's So first and she knows me well, and then came the desert course of awkward silence.

    However...

    Clarification question: How are you showing that you're a very friendly person, by not being friendly? How would they know that, unless you showed that side of you earlier in your interactions with them? If you didn't, then you weren't actually showing them who you are.
    I show people facets of myself. I am not always friendly, it doesn't mean that I'm mean, but I can be that to the right people. It doesn't matter to me what I lead with as long as I show some range. I appreciate people who can appreciate that. And the truth is, I am incapable of being 'on' on demand, even if I wanted to do it. As an ENFP, I am aware of it, though. I guess that's why I think showing that straight up is important.

    Well if other people are cool with that, then more power to them. I personally don't relate, but I understand that a lot of people do. e.g. others in this thread who've posted about creating awkwardness for fun.

    Just to show how far I am on the opposite end of the spectrum: 99% of the time I'm very stoic when I watch movies and TV -- I've only cried in a handful of movies in my entire life -- but when scenes are extremely awkward, I usually leave the room until they're over. I don't do that with sad scenes, violent scenes, or anything else. It's like nails on a chalkboard for me.
    That's adorbs.

  4. #44
    Stansmith
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    @EJCC

    I'll consider it...Sp/Sx seems fitting from an archetypal standpoint, although I've never considered myself to be good at dealing with Sp-related things (besides my immediate physical comfort, the long-term stuff is what I have trouble with)..Sx/Sp seems a bit too intense for me also.

  5. #45
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nights and Days View Post
    That sounds exactly like something @prplchknz would say^
    Haha, I was actually thinking that.

  6. #46
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    If you eat awkward silence you should hang out with me. lol Interesting reaction. Although I might get paranoid in response. I'd think you were trying to play mind tricks on me. Which you would be. So maybe we shouldn't hang out.

    Yeah that's nice. But it takes awhile ime.
    We'd be fine hanging out. I do make certain people paranoid, though, only those people who find it important to know what I think of them. I'm a hard read, and it never occurs for people just to ask. I'm working on my side of it, though.

  7. #47
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    Ah, I'm glad you think it's socially acceptable, and I'm sure @Hard would think so as well. But the things is, I disagree with him, and probably you :P in principal. I'll give you another example, occasionally I'll say very awkward things. I was in a party conversation once with kind of respectable people, and I think I was discussing my views on discomfort, actually, they were disagreeing, much like you are, and I said in a very non joking voice, "I have PTSD, I get nervous when I'm not uncomfortable."

    Now, I was being kind of provocative because I knew it would be taken that way, but in a manner of speaking it was true. Everybody went silent, my friend shook her head, she's So first and she knows me well, and then came the desert course of awkward silence.
    Ah. Okay. Yeah, I don't even relate to that. Can't help but agree entirely with Hard regarding this sort of thing -- but again, that's because I loathe awkwardness with such a passion. It would go against my values to treat other people that way when I know that it would anger me so much if the reverse were to occur. Plus, my friend group, for the most part, would be similarly bothered by things like that, just to clarify that this is not entirely projection.

    I can only understand Fours so much. (I don't think this is an ENFP thing, since my ENFP friend is incredibly focused on "the group", is a 2w3, and is only defiant when there's Te-Fi "correcting" to be done. Which narrows it down to Four.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    I show people facets of myself. I am not always friendly, it doesn't mean that I'm mean, but I can be that to the right people. It doesn't matter to me what I lead with as long as I show some range. I appreciate people who can appreciate that. And the truth is, I am incapable of being 'on' on demand, even if I wanted to do it. As an ENFP, I am aware of it, though. I guess that's why I think showing that straight up is important.
    In fairness, there's middle ground between fakery and needless defiance -- i.e. even when you aren't "on", you can function socially without pissing off a large portion of the group. But I digress.

    On the one hand, I suppose your usual modus operandi would ward off the type of people who you wouldn't like anyway. But on the other hand, if I'd never met you and interacted with you irl in a similar situation, I might've had the same reaction as @Hard and put you on my list from the get-go.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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    want to ask me something? go for it!

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by FLD View Post
    Anyway, lots of people there were socially awkward in one way or another. It was a sizable percentage, sometimes even the majority at a given event. Silent types; overly excitable, voluble types who spit all over everyone as they talked; people dressed in worn, torn clothing; people who looked like the Unabomber (wild eyes and big ratty beards with food in them); and so on.
    @Qlip

    Based on the OP I thought you were saying that you liked playing at being "the silent guy." But from your last couple posts it sounds like you're "the head games guy"--the guy who likes testing people for laughs or even petty revenge. A lot of ENFPs and ENTPs stake out that territory. Very Ne-rich territory.

    Nothing wrong with it. I like ENFPs, and I like their Ne-first approach to things. But what I said in my earlier post still applies. Playing "the head games guy" can become a developmental rut and result in isolation, if you get too comfortable in that role.

    Just sayin'.

  9. #49
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nights and Days View Post
    That sounds exactly like something @prplchknz would say^
    O no!! she's eaten my brain, nooooo I must get rid of parasetic ways.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  10. #50
    ndovjtjcaqidthi
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    Quote Originally Posted by prplchknz View Post
    O no!! she's eaten my brain, nooooo I must get rid of parasetic ways.
    She stole your skin. See how it feels?

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