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  1. #21
    Senior Member Ene's Avatar
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    @Sanjuro it is a thought-provoking questionnaire. I had to dig deep and really think about it. For a long time I couldn't identify my motivational fear so I assumed I didn't have one, but recently I've discovered that nothing unnerves me more than being seen as unintelligent or incompetent. I don't mind admitting what I don't know and I don't mind admitting when I'm not good at something, but when my expertise is swept under the rug, that I mind. So, I think my motivational fear is to be seen as stupid or incompetent, or rather to be treated as such.

    How did I arrive at this? I analyzed some sudden and unidentified feelings I've recently experienced. No one saw on the outside, because I compartmentalized them so they wouldn't interfere with anything, but when I was alone, I took them out and worked through them. That's when I realized where they were coming from. I was unnerved because I felt a person I trusted and respected had asked someone else to do something based on the assumption that I wasn't capable of doing it. That stung me so deeply that I realized that at the core I want to be valued for my intelligence, for my knowledge and for my efforts toward an endeavor.
    A student said to his master: "You teach me fighting, but you talk about peace. How do you reconcile the two?" The master replied: "It is better to be a warrior in a garden than to be a gardener in a war." - unknown/Chinese

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=61024&page=14

  2. #22
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    @Sanjuro Thanks for the questions I'll answer them too See what comes out of it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjuro View Post
    I've recently re-thought my type--I've mistyped for about 15 years because I'm not a typical version of my type.
    Out of curiosity; What did you mistype as and what's your real type?


    Tracing behaviors only helps so much, because we often use the defenses of our wings, our connecting points, or another fix. Again, I don't really behave in half the ways my core type is supposed to. Also, I've observed that sometimes we've been conditioned to behave like one type, and it turns out there's another one underlying it. Because I recently went through this very thing, I'll pass along some advice.
    That makes a lot of sense!


    So the questionnaire...

    - It helps to establish a "baseline mood"--when you're at home staring at the walls, where are you at mentally and emotionally? (For example, many 4s report that their baseline is "melancholy").

    Staring at the walls, if that's to be taken literally, then I have an empty mind, no emotions either. It's actually a pretty good state for me, just staring at the wall thinking of nothing. My way of meditation really.

    This is my default state too, calm state, no emotions, no nothing, not thinking of much, some fleeting thoughts here and there. Like some fleeting clouds on the sky. A bit of feeling of readiness.


    - Where were you as a little kid? Was there any perception you remember having that you can't find any reason for?

    I don't understand the "where".

    I did have some interesting things/perceptions... I'm not really sure what this question is getting at. I'm going to mention some randomly remembered perceptions that I didn't quite find reasons for, they just simply "were" and I thought to myself at the time "oh interesting that it is this way / interesting that I feel this way / interesting that I see this like that".

    My very first memory of myself at age 3, I wanted to play with a needle and when I was told it was dangerous I thought to myself I was perfectly able to handle that. My little kid friend wanted to marry later in life, I looked at him for a second and coldly and matter-of-factly thought to myself "we are not going to marry, we are just kids and later it's just not going to happen", then I said okay, why not; we were 6 year olds. My father would talk to me when I was 5, about some stuff and I thought to myself that this wasn't realistic stuff. I was surprised one day at around age 8 that a memory I recalled felt viscerally so much like it just happened the previous day and I decided to maintain and not forget these memories.

    As for what I was like more generally, I was a loner pretty much though I was capable of feeling excited for friends, in this blissful way, free of any negative stuff that came later. So always had 1-2 friends here and there but still I wandered around a lot alone. I was the smartest kid in class but I had a terrible temper and could not be persuaded otherwise if I wanted something. I would fight kids as well for whatever I wanted or just out of anger, in elementary/middle school, I had a terrible manner interacting with them in general and naturally I was an "outcast" in school (in kindergarten I wasn't yet, I was just simply a loner there). Teachers I didn't respect either though I liked one of them with the same enthusiasm that I had for friends. I really didn't like to be a kid overall, I always wanted to be a grown up so I could be in control.

    A few other things that just came to mind that seemed characteristic of me back then. I was still in kindergarten (5 years old) when I decided to hate my father after he beat up my sister for nothing. Hate without real emotions, on principle. I figured out some - of course really basic - math on my own in kindergarten, at 5-6 years old. I couldn't sleep when it was time for afternoon sleep in kindergarten so I thought up adventure stories instead. I would do drawings of stuff very well and in a very realistic way and looked down on kids who didn't manage to do it in a realistic way. At age 3, my mother came for me early to take me home (from "pre-kindergarten" thingie), surprise, I was so truly glad and enthusiastic, happy to see her! didn't care when she told me to say thanks to the nurse for letting me take a little cloth home.

    - If you are very familiar with the enneagram, you can generally see yourself in the surrounding types--and if you pay attention, you should be able to see how both influence you all day long.

    You mean wings of my supposed type? Supposed type is 7 or 8. I don't see the 6 much, I sometimes see something 9-ish though, it's when I just zone out and think of nothing and maybe this is what's meant by "being asleep". Well maybe that's not it but I associated it with 9 for some reason... I can also be lazy as fuck. Sometimes I am seen as mediator when people start a fight with each other.

    - What is your super-ego always telling you? I read Maitri recently, and she suggests writing out a conversation between your id, ego, and super-ego. When I did so, my type became very obvious. Listen to the ways you think you "should" be, and the things you've done to live up to that image.

    Lol interesting. I don't have a constantly active super-ego telling me "should". Sometimes yes, I think to myself, ok, I should get up and do this task, should do that task before deadline (...I brush this aside very easily). Less often I get the following; Should be more polite to people, talk to people more in a social way, say "hi" to everyone and don't be argumentative. Should open up and talk about issues to friends. Should be loving (...can't do it, block). Should detach from wanting things so much (no!). Should take responsibility for what I've done (bad things).

    I am not sure where ego is in all that. I do see the id

    I have not really done anything to live up to these things.

    - What is your ego ideal? I mean, how would you ideally be if given the chance (you don't necessarily have to live up to it--I certainly fail at living up to mine, lol).

    Being given the chance requires nothing short of a miracle* so I'm gonna pass on this one. (*: This is not enneagram related)

    Alright, alright, I don't like to dream unnecessarily, but I would be very social in this intense expansive way and would be everywhere messing with everything doing shit. Influence on people, as much impact as possible.

    Actually, maybe if given the chance I still wouldn't be like this but I have this one bit of snapshot of this in the back of my mind for some reason

    - What pisses you off for others to observe in you? You should have some sort of ego reaction against people attacking your defenses and get angry or feel "hurt".

    1st question - If they try to observe my motivations. Reaction: uh, just doesn't feel good? I'll probably protest

    For the 2nd question - Uh it wasn't really an attack on my defenses but I recently got very angry over someone refusing something on the basis of personally not liking me enough. Guess it touched me on some point but I'm not sure if that's enneagram related. I just think these things should be decided impersonally. My reaction was telling him in a terribly honest way as to what I thought about all this, placing a lot of blame on him in the process as well. Telling him off as well, aiming to make him feel less "perfect" about his ways. (He's this idealistic I-know-it-all-and-will-support-you type)

    I'm sorry maybe this isn't the sort of stuff the question was aimed at... couldn't think of anything better for example for "feeling hurt".

    - What "felt sense" do you have of your childhood? Were you deprived? Wronged? Abandoned? If you're not sure, write a short autobiography and try to determine what you are upset about.

    Deprived or Abandoned (not sure which): when I was a small kid, by my mother for periods (she was away traveling). My father not showing interest or not in a way I could notice. When I was not so small anymore, no such things.
    Wronged: by my father, beating up us kids. By some stupid teachers/classes (as a whole class yes, no problem if it was just individual kids), in school, as small kid and as teenager too.
    Other things I was upset about: not placing so good in one contest (alright I didn't prepare enough ;p). uhh whatever else, can't remember more now.

    But really I was just upset about being a kid in general. Sometimes about being an "outcast" in school. (Someone else instead was seen as "leader".) Sure, sometimes by my father. By the fact that I was the youngest kid in the family.

    I'm not upset about most of these things in retrospect. This all was such a long time ago. My father and I got okay later, much later. Still upsetting memory of some teachers/classes (see "wronged" section above) but I don't think of the past often.

    I think that it was a result of all that, that I had the feeling I was left to deal with life on my own. I never thought of talking about problems with family or anything really or even getting truly involved in family life. Let alone school life etc. I think this is a good summary of "felt sense" in my childhood.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenhetlee View Post
    It seems that enneagram type is largely focused on the primary fear which motivates someone's actions. In my opinion this seems like an incredibly difficult thing to do. I cannot seem to find out what my fear is.

    Is there a way in which people out there, who know their enneagram type, found out the fear that motivates their actions?
    Yes, I relate to your difficulties I like this thread!

    I sometimes seem to hit upon something but it's so elusive. Something that resembles enneagram 7's issue with deprivation if I interpret it right. I dunno, enneagram 8 is the other type considered for me, but I can't feel the issues of that type as real fears in a literal sense. I am not feeling afraid of being controlled or manipulated or losing control etc. If I feel anything over those in life situations, it's anger, not fear.

    So with the type 7's deprivation thing, I wouldn't want to feel suffering for no reason (for no reason = I get nothing out of it, no goal, no nothing). I'm not afraid of normal pain itself but I had a stressful period where I had OCD-like fears of illnesses or of losing things in my life etc.

    Though I can do exactly that sort of reaction out of any important situation where I don't have control over things and I have to wait for things to develop their course, so the illnesses thing is maybe just one example of that category. Just when it isn't involving illness or death, it's not actual fear felt. I mean, I still act it out the same way, just without the explicit anxiety-ish thing.

    It's also unpleasant to think of submission though it's hard to call it an explicit fear. It's just very unpleasant thinking of that sort of thing. So that's as far as I get with type 8 fears.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Sanjuro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Out of curiosity; What did you mistype as and what's your real type?
    I've mistyped, or considered, pretty much everything over a 15 year period, other than 1, 2, or 3.

    I don't currently like to say my real type because a) it tends to take a lot of flak, and b) you'd get the wrong idea about me. I'm having a hard time believing it, actually, because of all the times I've acted contrary to it.

    I think I'm on the same axis you are, however.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjuro View Post
    I've mistyped, or considered, pretty much everything over a 15 year period, other than 1, 2, or 3.

    I don't currently like to say my real type because a) it tends to take a lot of flak, and b) you'd get the wrong idea about me. I'm having a hard time believing it, actually, because of all the times I've acted contrary to it.

    I think I'm on the same axis you are, however.
    Eh, I don't really try to form an image of anyone just because they have a type according to whatever system.

    Same axis hmm, gut type or Id type or harmonic triad or object relations triad or whatever? :p

    Though going by your signature, you meant being in the reactive one :p

  6. #26
    Senior Member Sanjuro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Eh, I don't really try to form an image of anyone just because they have a type according to whatever system.

    Same axis hmm, gut type or Id type or harmonic triad or object relations triad or whatever? :p

    Though going by your signature, you meant being in the reactive one :p
    Definitely reactive. That's my tritype too. I am a reactive type, that eliminates 2/3 of the enneagram right there!

    Anyway, all I can attest to is that I actually did have an image of people of my type before figuring out I was one (mind you, I don't know anyone of my type--it was all theory). So basically, I don't want to perpetuate that in anyone's mind (not necessarily your mind; the general public). I'll come out of the closet one day. You may figure me out before then.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjuro View Post
    Definitely reactive. That's my tritype too. I am a reactive type, that eliminates 2/3 of the enneagram right there!

    Anyway, all I can attest to is that I actually did have an image of people of my type before figuring out I was one (mind you, I don't know anyone of my type--it was all theory). So basically, I don't want to perpetuate that in anyone's mind (not necessarily your mind; the general public). I'll come out of the closet one day. You may figure me out before then.
    I see. Well, let's see if I figure you out heheh

  8. #28
    Senior Member Sanjuro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Animal View Post
    I'm going to take your advice and answer these
    Quote Originally Posted by WhoCares View Post
    @Sanjuro, okay I'll play...
    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    @Sanjuro I guess I might as well try this too considering how many times I've been mistyped.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ene View Post
    @Sanjuro it is a thought-provoking questionnaire.
    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    @Sanjuro Thanks for the questions I'll answer them too See what comes out of it.
    Since you guys earlier expressed interest, I made a more refined version. It's in the Type Me section, but you can find it here:
    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...tionnaire.html

    I don't claim it to be perfect, but it seems better to hash out how responders identify/don't identify with things than to simply create type me threads with no structure.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjuro View Post
    Since you guys earlier expressed interest, I made a more refined version. It's in the Type Me section, but you can find it here:
    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...tionnaire.html

    I don't claim it to be perfect, but it seems better to hash out how responders identify/don't identify with things than to simply create type me threads with no structure.
    Thank you

  10. #30
    Senior Member entpersonal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenhetlee View Post
    It seems that enneagram type is largely focused on the primary fear which motivates someone's actions. In my opinion this seems like an incredibly difficult thing to do. I cannot seem to find out what my fear is.

    Is there a way in which people out there, who know their enneagram type, found out the fear that motivates their actions?
    It is difficult to do. I went in reverse, by reading the profiles, and confirmed my type via Naranjo's Character and Neurosis.

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