The drug triad

[Ginkgo]

counter-phobic 6s do a lot of drugs...8 seem very inaccurate in this drug thread. I can't imagine, that the person who strives the most to have the control and power over himself and his enviroment would eventually take drugs to loose it.

A new angle - someone else attempts to take an 8s personal freedom away by limiting their potential to do drugs -> opposite reaction.

 

[Animal]

Not true, I only do a little bit of drugs.

I don't do any drugs. I'm pretty much as pure, innocent, and boring as they come. AND I've got a 6 and 8 in my tritype. XD

I am not implying that every 4 does drugs. I have also been squeaky-clean for eight years; I don't even drink. But I've done more drugs in my hayday than most of my friends, with very few exceptions. Two friends from college made my drug use look like 'dabbling' in comparison, and it just so happens both of them are 4s. The only other friend who has done a lot more drugs than me in our hayday was a 7w6. Beyond that, look at Marilyn Manson, Tori Amos, Elliott Smith, Kurt Cobain etc; your typical tortured 4 rockstar stereotype does drugs, more so than the 6, 7, or 8 stereotype. No generalization will apply to all 4s, all 6s, all 7s etc.

True, they are a core reactive type.

Not only core reactive, but also stereotypically introspective, tortured, masochistic, frustrated, artists, musicians, tortured artists etc. All of which are reasons to do drugs. On any music or art scene you have to make a concentrated effort to avoid drugs. I've never been a 'scene' person and did most of my drugs alone with my art, alone with my music, etc; but the impetus to be creative and 'expand my mind' and 'challenge my limits as an artist' was a big motivator, along with 'experiencing all my emotions to the fullest' and 'gaining control over my vulnerable emotions,' 'mind control' and 'self-exploration.' And being known by others as a musician, artist, etc; I was offered a lot of drugs, so I had access.

 

[Elfboy]

counter-phobic 6s do a lot of drugs...8 seem very inaccurate in this drug thread. I can't imagine, that the person who strives the most to have the control and power over himself and his enviroment would eventually take drugs to loose it. Though I can imagine cocaine for them... 4s are the most prone to taking drugs of all the enneagram types. Sensitive, dreamers who are prone to depressions and self hate are the perfect target for drugs. 5s might use drugs to get away from the overwhelming enviroment around them. It's been said, that 7s are prone to addiction, but they are not the clasical drug users as they fear of pain, hangover, and unpleasent experiences that might come with drug using. On the other hand 7w8s can be into harsh and exciting expriences that come with drugs. I think 9s are also very prone to drug using... easily manipulated, strive for peace and harmony, but the reality might seem to fast and overwhelming for them, so they might decide to escape it and find their comfort most likely in weed, or other inhibiting drugs.

Self Preservation 8s are less likely to get involved in drugs, but Sexual 8s are very much thrill seekers who have a tendency to flood themselves with stimulation (in this case, drugs). Johnny Cash is a good example of this

 

[Ginkgo]

Self Preservation 8s are less likely to get involved in drugs, but Sexual 8s are very much thrill seekers who have a tendency to flood themselves with stimulation (in this case, drugs). Johnny Cash is a good example of this

Yeah honestly there's probably a higher correlation between instinctual stackings and tendencies for long-term drug use than there are correlations between enneagram types and long-term drug use.

 

[Elfboy]

Yeah honestly there's probably a higher correlation between instinctual stackings and tendencies for long-term drug use than there are correlations between enneagram types and long-term drug use.

yeah. Sp doms overall are probably the least likely and Sx/So is probably the most likely (Sx/Sp can go either way. personally my Sp is really strong so I would be less likely to do lots of drugs)

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I've been a few places myself....

 

[skylights]

And I bet hella 3s pop [adderall] like candy.

Yeah. And kids from pressuring parent households or peer groups in general.

Success is in keeping a dosage as low as possible and taking regular vacations from it to reset yourself. Once my child psychiatrist decided to titrate it so high that I had a psychotic episode coming down from it, and that was really bad times. It's been a long time since I took it.

 

[brainheart]

that could work
[MENTION=7991]chana[/MENTION]
maybe an unhealthy 3, but average/healthy 3s are much more aware of what will/won't get in the way of their goals, work habits and productivity, so I can't see them getting super addicted to drugs in most instances
Edit: oh, missed the "it keeps you up and keeps you productive part" in which case, yeah, maybe

Er, what healthy people of any type get 'super addicted' to drugs?

 

[Elfboy]

Er, what healthy people of any type get 'super addicted' to drugs?

well, plenty of average range people get addicted to drugs. of them. not many are 3s, because most average 3s are disciplined, productive and would not allow themselves to get pulled into something that would get in the way of their goals

 

[Chad of the OttomanEmpire]

Very much disagree with this. I think both rich and poor people do more drugs than people in the middle.

All I can speak from is my personal observations of my peers moaning about how they did drugs due to how "boring" their lives are. Haven't lived in the upper class bracket, so I can't comment. Living in near-poverty currently, it seems like most people are more concerned with making it through the day than trying to escape their shit lives or anything. But that's just my narrow, asocial experience.

I'd also say Sx/So is the most likely to do drugs (along with anything else that could get them killed ASAP )

I'm still a sx/soc 4, and I'm still drug-free. This is why I never believed I was sx/soc incidentally--I'm not batshit insane.

It's been said, that 7s are prone to addiction, but they are not the clasical drug users as they fear of pain, hangover, and unpleasent experiences that might come with drug using. ...

I think 9s are also to fast and overwhelming for them, so they might decide to escape it and find their comfort most likely in weed, or other inhibiting drugs.

Sevens are said to have "addictive" personalities, but this doesn't have to be drug addiction. It's possible to be addicted to chocolate, food, gambling, shopping, you name it.

My step-father's a 9 and is addicted to a lot of prescription drugs. They're generally things to keep him awake and help him get to sleep. Not "true" addictions, but last I checked, the whole family thought he needed to detox.

well, plenty of average range people get addicted to drugs. of them. not many are 3s, because most average 3s are disciplined, productive and would not allow themselves to get pulled into something that would get in the way of their goals

A 3 could get addicted to a stimulant, however--something that helped them accomplish MORE. Or a steroid, if they were an athlete.

I am not implying that every 4 does drugs. I have also been squeaky-clean for eight years; I don't even drink. But I've done more drugs in my hayday than most of my friends, with very few exceptions. Two friends from college made my drug use look like 'dabbling' in comparison, and it just so happens both of them are 4s. The only other friend who has done a lot more drugs than me in our hayday was a 7w6. Beyond that, look at Marilyn Manson, Tori Amos, Elliott Smith, Kurt Cobain etc; your typical tortured 4 rockstar stereotype does drugs, more so than the 6, 7, or 8 stereotype. No generalization will apply to all 4s, all 6s, all 7s etc.

Come to think of it, my sister is a drug addict, and she types as 4 as well. In her case, it was this stupid "poor pathetic me with two parents, a shitload of friends, and numerous boyfriends, who all love me in my comfy middle class existence where everything is provided for" sort of self-pity, in which she believed she had "issues" and therefore needed to self-medicate, if I understand the situation correctly. Not experimental art.

However, I'm still not a drug user, and I am a confirmed 4. I think circumstances count a lot.

Actually, I'm lying a bit. I did eat some of my sister's adderalls in high school basically to finish all final projects after working without sleep for 3 days straight. But that's it.

Not only core reactive, but also stereotypically introspective, tortured, masochistic, frustrated, artists, musicians, tortured artists etc. All of which are reasons to do drugs. On any music or art scene you have to make a concentrated effort to avoid drugs. I've never been a 'scene' person and did most of my drugs alone with my art, alone with my music, etc; but the impetus to be creative and 'expand my mind' and 'challenge my limits as an artist' was a big motivator, along with 'experiencing all my emotions to the fullest' and 'gaining control over my vulnerable emotions,' 'mind control' and 'self-exploration.' And being known by others as a musician, artist, etc; I was offered a lot of drugs, so I had access.

It's a very different perspective than I think most of us have on drug use. No one ever talks about exploration.

 

[Chad of the OttomanEmpire]

Oh, and.

Folks keep posting this link, but here's the excerpt where it's convenient:

Type 1 The Reformer
Excessive use of diets, vitamins, and cleansing techniques (fasts, diet pills, enemas). Under-eating for self-control: in extreme cases anorexia and bulimia. Alcohol to relieve tension.

Type 2 The Helper
Abusing food and over-the-counter medications. Bingeing, especially on sweets and carbohydrates. Over-eating from feeling "love-starved;" in extreme cases bulimia. Hypochondria to look for sympathy.

Type 3 The Achiever
Over-stressing the body for recognition. Working out to exhaustion. Starvation diets. Workaholism. Excessive intake of coffee, stimulants, amphetamines, cocaine, steroids or excessive surgery for cosmetic improvement.

Type 4 The Individualist
Over-indulgence in rich foods, sweets, alcohol to alter mood, to socialize, and for emotional consolation. Lack of physical activity. Bulimia. Depressants. Tobacco, prescription drugs, or heroin for social anxiety. Cosmetic surgery to erase rejected features.

Type 5 The Investigator
Poor eating and sleeping habits due to minimizing needs. Neglecting hygiene and nutrition. Lack of physical activity. Psychotropic drugs for mental stimulation and escape, narcotics for anxiety.

Type 6 The Loyalist
Rigidity in diet causes nutritional imbalances ("I don't like vegetables.") Working excessively. Caffeine and amphetamines for stamina, but also alcohol and depressants to deaden anxiety. Higher susceptibility to alcoholism than many types.

Type 7 The Enthusiast
The type most prone to addictions: stimulants (caffeine, cocaine, and amphetamines), Ecstasy, psychotropics, narcotics, and alcohol but tend to avoid other depressants. Wear body out with effort to stay "up." Excessive cosmetic surgery, pain killers.

Type 8 The Challenger
Ignore physical needs and problems: avoid medical visits and check-ups. Indulging in rich foods, alcohol, tobacco while pushing self too hard leads to high stress, strokes, and heart conditions. Control issues central, although alcoholism and narcotic addictions are possible.

Type 9 The Peacemaker
Over-eating or under-eating due to lack of self-awareness and repressed anger. Lack of physical activity. Depressants and psychotropics, alcohol, marijuana, narcotics to deaden loneliness and anxiety.

Definitely guilty of the whole "rich foods" thing.

 

[ceecee]

counter-phobic 6s do a lot of drugs...8 seem very inaccurate in this drug thread. I can't imagine, that the person who strives the most to have the control and power over himself and his enviroment would eventually take drugs to loose it. Though I can imagine cocaine for them...

I never did cocaine, although I can see the attraction and I've had a similar experience with some prescription meds. That said I agree, 8's seem very unlikely to do drugs but, I can see them drinking and drinking heavily at times, it seems to go with the eating. Not so much overeating as really indulgent, high end foods. The only people I know that do drugs on a regular basis are all 6's and all smoke pot. I pretty much limit myself to caffeine and drinking is more seasonal as I get older. Summer time cocktails are my favorite.

 

[Elfboy]

[MENTION=18576]Sanjuro[/MENTION]
good point about steroids (esp a Sexual 3)

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

As an 8, loosing control can be the most liberating thing there is.

 

[ceecee]

Oh, and.

Folks keep posting this link, but here's the excerpt where it's convenient:



Definitely guilty of the whole "rich foods" thing.

Ah, I didn't see this before I posted. Rich foods, definitely. I'm a food snob and I'm very good with that. I use to avoid the doctor, it was an invincible feeling more than ignoring. This isn't the case any longer.

 

[Redbone]

A new angle - someone else attempts to take an 8s personal freedom away by limiting their potential to do drugs -> opposite reaction.

This was one of the reasons my NTJ/8 sister cited for trying drugs. She decided she wanted more and pursued a career in it for nearly two decades with some pauses of not using in between. She said she never felt out of control, she was doing exactly what she wanted to do (and she was utterly ruthless about it). When she lusted after something, telling herself "no" didn't enter in her mind. When she had her fill of that lifestyle and got tired of it, it occurred to her that she could do other things, so she quit cold turkey with no problem. She also quit smoking at the same time.

I don't know too many people that could have put themselves through what she put herself and come out as well, though. She appears unbreakable even though I know she's not.

Both of my parents were alcoholics (dad--6, mom--2). My other sister (a 7w6) was abusing sleeping meds for a while. I used to drink a lot as a teen but stopped once I hit college...well traded it to try other stuff. And I don't like the feeling of being drunk very much. It'd be really super easy for me to get hooked on something like dilaudid--I like that stuff a lot. Anything that can make my head slow down and feel good at the same time? Sounds great to me...

But the price is just too high for me. I'm always stuffing my own lust for pleasure in a box...it's just better if I tell myself 'no'.

 

[011235813]

Yeah, 3s definitely strike me as the cocaine-snorting investment banker type.

 

[Animal]

Come to think of it, my sister is a drug addict, and she types as 4 as well. In her case, it was this stupid "poor pathetic me with two parents, a shitload of friends, and numerous boyfriends, who all love me in my comfy middle class existence where everything is provided for" sort of self-pity, in which she believed she had "issues" and therefore needed to self-medicate, if I understand the situation correctly. Not experimental art.

However, I'm still not a drug user, and I am a confirmed 4. I think circumstances count a lot.

Actually, I'm lying a bit. I did eat some of my sister's adderalls in high school basically to finish all final projects after working without sleep for 3 days straight. But that's it.


It's a very different perspective than I think most of us have on drug use. No one ever talks about exploration.

In my experience with 4s most are drug users more for the reasons you named with your sister. As for experimentation, I shared this approach with my type 7 friend. We both did a lot of LSD to expand limits & experiment. However, he also did a lot of other drugs to run away from himself & preferred those to LSD, whereas I liked the raw vulnerability of LSD and the inner struggles and facing all my demons with the intensity on tenfold. I cannot help but see my motives and approach as being a result of my tritype, however, I don't think that drug use in and of itself, is necessarily related to one's enneagram type. E-type might dictate how you approach it, what angle you take, but most people do drugs because they don't feel whole or they are dissatisfied in one way or another. Since 4s are most in touch with that sense of dissatisfaction, 4 is the type I can see as being MOST LIKELY to do drugs - aside from 8 or 7 for gluttony/lust reasons, because of the envy of a better life, something more extreme and intense, self-pity, love for emotional intensity and self-indulgently exploring one's own emotions, and feeling depressed and in pain.. etc. Drugs are just another mechanism which you can 'wallow' in, and then create a more tragic story for yourself so that someone wants to rescue you from yourself.

I think [MENTION=5684]Elfboy[/MENTION]'s distinction was right... I am Sx/Sp and while I did a lot of drugs, I did them responsibly. I imposed limits on myself in terms of use.. I went to all my classes on time.. did great in school. Work hard, and I would say "party hard" except it was more of intense inner digging than partying in my case. Meanwhile my 7 So/Sx friend was absolutely limitless; he would "pyramid' and take more and more and more and then go to school . Crazy motherfucker


But that being said.

How can someone argue that a MASOCHISTIC PERSONALITY is NOT the most likely personality to develop a drug addiction??? Seriously?? I commend any 4 who avoided this - truly - but I still think 4 is the mOST LIKELY TYPE to self-indulge when it comes to drugs.

Type 4 cultural icons include: Tori Amos, Kurt Cobain, Elliott Smith, Marilyn Manson, Johnny Depp. Regardless of the variants, wings, and tritype, find me a type 4 cultural icon who does NOT have a serious drug addiction, and for each one, you will find 10 famous 4s who do.

 

[The Great One]

I never did cocaine, although I can see the attraction and I've had a similar experience with some prescription meds. That said I agree, 8's seem very unlikely to do drugs but, I can see them drinking and drinking heavily at times, it seems to go with the eating. Not so much overeating as really indulgent, high end foods. The only people I know that do drugs on a regular basis are all 6's and all smoke pot. I pretty much limit myself to caffeine and drinking is more seasonal as I get older. Summer time cocktails are my favorite.

I bet you have a 3w4 fix.

 

[Animal]

I never did cocaine, although I can see the attraction and I've had a similar experience with some prescription meds. That said I agree, 8's seem very unlikely to do drugs but, I can see them drinking and drinking heavily at times, it seems to go with the eating. Not so much overeating as really indulgent, high end foods. The only people I know that do drugs on a regular basis are all 6's and all smoke pot. I pretty much limit myself to caffeine and drinking is more seasonal as I get older. Summer time cocktails are my favorite.

My type 8 friend is like that. He was very very sparing with his drug use during our hayday. He actually did less drugs than anyone else who was around during that time. He hung out, tripped here and there, but he never made a lifestyle of it. He's very into health and fitness nowadays, and mixed martial arts, and he would never poison his body with any of this stuff. But he is very into healthy - but tasty - food.

That being said he's Sp-first if I've ever seen one.