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The Hardest Type to be in The Enneagram

Azure Flame

Permabanned
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Messages
2,317
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ESTP
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8w7
I envy their ability to be awesome regardless of circumstances. I'm only awesome when things are going my way.

Its a facade. Most types live behind a facade of some kind.

Also, I can't imagine living life as an E1. One can only hate oneself so much.
 

Evo

Unapologetic being
Joined
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Messages
3,160
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XNTJ
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1w9
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sp/sx
1 leaves first after drinking a glass of water. The 3, the 7 and the 8 leave with every hot girl in the bar within 1 minute of walking in. The 4 leaves to work on his novel, the 5 pulls out a copy of Ayn Rand, the 2 leaves to buy a present for his sister in law's baby shower after having a pleasant platonic conversation with the female bar tender, the 9 is not affected by the situation and the 6 awkwardly stares at a glass.
omfg i am Dying laughing ...this is awesome.....holy fuck..cant breathe...its cause the fuckin ppl i know fit this exactly. Lmfao phew

Ehem...back to business lol

[MENTION=8413]Zarathustra[/MENTION] I would like a complete guide to getting a better understanding of this...i was wondering if u would be so kind as to list a breif explaination of ur impressions of each level of health of the enneagram types...cause i see that my subjective view of them is different from yours...im asking genuinely...if u find it to be too much i understand...im looking for ur words tho...not sum crap off of a site. An example would be: 6 unhealthy paranoia,average having occasional anxiety, healthy no anxieties and feeling fulfilled. Something of that sort

[MENTION=10984]DJ Arendee[/MENTION] i understand where ur comin from...u can only know what its like to be an eight If ur an eight.

But i dont give respect to clumsy initiative...thats what i see with the 8 i wrk with....thats makin fuckin mistakes where they could have been avoided...

i also know what u mean about being able to shine better in a postion of power vs not...being an entj...thats all i want... But the 6s u know r not like me...bein an entj i can tell u what person should be doing what and how...its what makes a good leader...building on the teams strenghths....

so i know that the 8 is good at somethings and not at others....i would not want her to be in charge...she is a bitch...and just cause shes got power doesnt mean shes gonna all of a sudden shine...

I guess its different for boys...prolly more direct with social situations...

where with the rest of us girls will just appease the damn 8 and then do our own thing anyway....and then avoid contact wit the bitch...

She imposes...u dont gain respect by imposing u lose it.....

Especially with me a 2 and a 4 ....we give trust in the beginning....then eventually trust dimishes over time with ppl like that
 

Zarathustra

Let Go Of Your Team
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
8,110
[MENTION=8413]Zarathustra[/MENTION] I would like a complete guide to getting a better understanding of this...i was wondering if u would be so kind as to list a breif explaination of ur impressions of each level of health of the enneagram types...cause i see that my subjective view of them is different from yours...im asking genuinely...if u find it to be too much i understand...im looking for ur words tho...not sum crap off of a site. An example would be: 6 unhealthy paranoia,average having occasional anxiety, healthy no anxieties and feeling fulfilled. Something of that sort

*is about to feel like Jaguar*

If you haven't read it, then get this book.

It goes into a phenomenal amount of depth about each level.

http://www.amazon.com/Personality-Types-Using-Enneagram-Self-Discovery/dp/0395798671
 

Evo

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sp/sx

Zarathustra

Let Go Of Your Team
Joined
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Messages
8,110
should i be getting the hint that ur losing ur patience..i appologize im on a wretched phone so im not gonna look up all of jaguars posts to get a gist of that reference.

No no no...

It's... it's just inside joke forum humor...

Was mostly meant to be between me and Jag...

He just did something along those lines to me a long time ago...

I will read the book thanks

No worries
 

Chad of the OttomanEmpire

Give me a fourth dot.
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1,053
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NeTi
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478
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sx/so
The fact that therapists say that they're sick of seeing so many 4s and 5s, that they rarely if ever get better, and that they're giant frickin pains in the ass, is just one, but one pretty significant, piece of evidence that 4s and 5s, in some sense, have it the hardest (and I think 6s kinda belong in there too). There are others. Some have been mentioned in this thread. Others have not. You don't necessarily have to believe it, but to not consider where that evidence points and consider it a realistic possibility, and instead just level the field and say all is the same, is a flabbily relativistic move, and comes from excessive preference for Fi over Te (which is not to say it couldn't be true, but, as a method, it is not following the evidence very keenly, and is rather flabbily and conveniently throwing around the relativism stick).
Wait, what? Where did you get that information? Do you know that many therapists who use the enneagram??? All I can say is that this 4w5 has refused all therapy and psychiatric treatment while her 9w1 stepfather has been in for at least the last 20 years, with the therapist giving up on him.

Sorry for throwing around my Fi, btw. My personal experiences and viewpoints prove nothing.

Am I the only person who thinks Bruce Willis is a total dork?
No, you're not.

I don't think being an 8 gives people the power that some imagine. I think in a healthy 8 it just gives them a very solid leadership quality, like they're unshakable...not that they are imposing, or superior or any of that kind of stuff.
I think you're right about this, and I get kind of annoyed at the 8-idolization that goes on on English-speaking enneagram forums. The 8s I've met have basically just been normal people, not rulers with phenomenal powers or anything.
 

Salomé

meh
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Messages
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INTP
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5w4
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sx/sp
They make the whiniest threads, that's for sure.
 
W

WALMART

Guest
My therapist was frustrated by my refusal to engage with my issues. I kinda just sat in my chair, looked at my feet, and said things like "No, IDK" and "meh" for the first three months, haha. So I can see how 9s can be annoying in therapy.

Yeah, my mom made me see a therapist in high school, just because, I guess.

It was pretty much thirty minutes of small-talk, every time...

Maybe it would be more accurate to say that the types on the bottom are more acutely aware of their suffering? I don't really think anyone suffers more or less, or that it's even possible to measure or compare. But I do think it would be right to say that 4s with their difference, 5s with their isolation, and 6s with their anxiety tend to be very focused on their perceived problems. That does not necessarily mean we actually experience more suffering, but probably that we are more aware of the how, when, where, and why of it.

I disagree. I believe nines are acutely capable of rationalizing internal states against the happenings of reality, leading to the rapid metabolization of emotional reactions they are known for.

Understanding is the key to absolution. If those types truly understood the depths of their concerns to the breadth you ascribe, they would be absolved of the characteristic worry they feel. I feel it is a core motivation of the Enneagram nine to seek and destroy every shred of concern in their body as quickly as possible, while many other types (head center, particularly) externalize their concerns, as I mentioned earlier in the thread, never really getting to the purest underlying concerns of the psyche.

But maybe not. I'm just recanting Buddhism 101.
 

wolfy

awsm
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Jun 30, 2008
Messages
12,251
I disagree. I believe nines are acutely capable of rationalizing internal states against the happenings of reality, leading to the rapid metabolization of emotional reactions they are known for.

I was thinking about all of what was said about nine in this thread today. I feel that I don't hide from my emotions or whatever. Also I don't dwell on them or express much either, they seem just a part of being human. That is my understanding of the truth will set you free. Acceptance.
 

Azure Flame

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8w7
I think you're right about this, and I get kind of annoyed at the 8-idolization that goes on on English-speaking enneagram forums. The 8s I've met have basically just been normal people, not rulers with phenomenal powers or anything.

They're not talking about enneagram 8's. They're talking about THE CONQUERERS! (estp's) Alexander the great, ghenghis khan, Atilla the Hun...

All those ENTJ's you hear about who want to rule the world? Those are actually ESTP's.

Someday... Someday, I will join our modern kings in Singapore.

*sighs*
 

skylights

i love
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so/sx
I disagree. I believe nines are acutely capable of rationalizing internal states against the happenings of reality, leading to the rapid metabolization of emotional reactions they are known for.

Understanding is the key to absolution. If those types truly understood the depths of their concerns to the breadth you ascribe, they would be absolved of the characteristic worry they feel. I feel it is a core motivation of the Enneagram nine to seek and destroy every shred of concern in their body as quickly as possible, while many other types (head center, particularly) externalize their concerns, as I mentioned earlier in the thread, never really getting to the purest underlying concerns of the psyche.

But maybe not. I'm just recanting Buddhism 101.

It's a good point... clarifies a difference in the experience of cognition.

My thought from the POV of a 6 is that I don't necessarily seek to completely understand the nature of the internal concern itself, but I desperately try to guard against the concern, turning it from a typically minor issue into a major source of stress. It's a focus on the concern as I perceive it, but not on the concern as it is in reality, removed from my internal state of mind... I don't tend to leave the box of my own reactive thought without a conscious struggle. Whereas with what you're saying with 9, 9 seems to have a better grasp of the difference between internal state and reality, and is more readily able to put that concern into perspective.

I would agree that part of the whole reason 4s, 5s, and 6s can't let go of their problems is because they don't try to get rid of them from the roots and instead address them as fixed realities. In some ways those three types all "expand" negatives as a way of addressing them.
 

Evo

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Yeah, my mom made me see a therapist in high school, just because, I guess.

It was pretty much thirty minutes of small-talk, every time...



I disagree. I believe nines are acutely capable of rationalizing internal states against the happenings of reality, leading to the rapid metabolization of emotional reactions they are known for.

Understanding is the key to absolution. If those types truly understood the depths of their concerns to the breadth you ascribe, they would be absolved of the characteristic worry they feel. I feel it is a core motivation of the Enneagram nine to seek and destroy every shred of concern in their body as quickly as possible, while many other types (head center, particularly) externalize their concerns, as I mentioned earlier in the thread, never really getting to the purest underlying concerns of the psyche.

But maybe not. I'm just recanting Buddhism 101.

Well thank the universe, that at least a 6 integrates to nine....sighs....at least there's hope.

Cause the way u describe it you almost have a passionor like a really strong urge to get rid of "concern"....

I want to get rid of it of course.....but I don't know if my motivation is as strong as yours....almost as if it's clouded or something.

I know it used to be much stronger for me.
 
S

Stansmith

Guest
It's a good point... clarifies a difference in the experience of cognition.

My thought from the POV of a 6 is that I don't necessarily seek to completely understand the nature of the internal concern itself, but I desperately try to guard against the concern, turning it from a typically minor issue into a major source of stress. It's a focus on the concern as I perceive it, but not on the concern as it is in reality, removed from my internal state of mind... I don't tend to leave the box of my own reactive thought without a conscious struggle. Whereas with what you're saying with 9, 9 seems to have a better grasp of the difference between internal state and reality, and is more readily able to put that concern into perspective.

I would agree that part of the whole reason 4s, 5s, and 6s can't let go of their problems is because they don't try to get rid of them from the roots and instead address them as fixed realities. In some ways those three types all "expand" negatives as a way of addressing them.

How exactly does this work for 5s? They just seem like 9s who like to read books and study physics.
 

Evo

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It's a good point... clarifies a difference in the experience of cognition.

My thought from the POV of a 6 is that I don't necessarily seek to completely understand the nature of the internal concern itself, but I desperately try to guard against the concern, turning it from a typically minor issue into a major source of stress. It's a focus on the concern as I perceive it, but not on the concern as it is in reality, removed from my internal state of mind... I don't tend to leave the box of my own reactive thought without a conscious struggle. Whereas with what you're saying with 9, 9 seems to have a better grasp of the difference between internal state and reality, and is more readily able to put that concern into perspective.

I would agree that part of the whole reason 4s, 5s, and 6s can't let go of their problems is because they don't try to get rid of them from the roots and instead address them as fixed realities. In some ways those three types all "expand" negatives as a way of addressing them.

OMG...YES! I should have read this before I replied! lol

But that's exactly what I'm doing. trying to guard against the concern...
[MENTION=15886]superunknown[/MENTION] do you think a nine is less preemptive about their "seeking and destroying" a concern than a 6? Like less worried about it until it gets there (sounds like Se)...instead of a 6 worrying about everything so that it doesn't get to them?

I mean there is a correlation between enneatype and MBTI...I just forget the probability of a 9 NOT being a sensor.

And in that case I think it may have to do with functions.
 

skylights

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How exactly does this work for 5s? They just seem like 9s who like to read books and study physics.

The competency thing. 5s feel like they're not up to the challenge so they retreat to observe, learn, and (where 5 moves into 6) prepare. But they also use their hyperfocus on perceived competency in a certain area to replace other areas of life.

EnneagramInstitute said:
The irony is that no matter what degree of mastery they develop in their area of expertise, this cannot solve their more basic insecurities about functioning in the world. For example, as a marine biologist, a Five could learn everything there is to know about a type of shellfish, but if her fear is that she is never going to be able to run her own household adequately, she will not have solved her underlying anxiety.

:shrug: I dunno. Theorizing theorizing theorizing
 

Starry

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May 22, 2010
Messages
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Would you mind expanding on this?

Oh I'll expand alright... <--I think that may be one of the weirdest things I've ever said on the internet.

I will expand when I have more time but first...am I expected to...





Where did you get this from?

I think I used the wrong word (introspection). I should have probably used the word 'fantasy.'
You probably understand these things better than I do. There's some sort of conflict between the external focus of the e7 and the intimate focus of the sx-dom...that comes together and apparently creates an e7 that is especially dreamy. They are Idealists x 1000. And unlike what you would expect to find under other points on the enneagram...we are more 'introverted' than the e7 sp (I'm typing this very fast so...) We enjoy intense experiences...but the thing is we don't need them because...we can create anything we want...any *world* we want in our heads. We can escape pain and negative thoughts in our head and are less inclined to be reckless in the way you describe. Now, I've smoked a lot of pot in my day...but unless you're like Tom Hardy or Jason Momoa...the thought of having cheap sex with someone is repulsive to me. What else... we're sorta the revolutionists because we are always mindful of 'what could be.' How things should be...


I think it talks about it somewhere in here maybe...?



totally don't have time to edit this so...my apologies...
 

Lady_X

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ENFP
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784
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sx/sp
Yeah agreed... I'm never hedonist in ways I find empty or superficially meaningless.

Not at all interested in casual hook ups and the fact that I'm a six wing and have that sp second... I care about protecting myself from dangerous situations.

Plus I'm very fi and have a great deal of self respect and treat myself better than all that.

I don't like the idea of living an unhealthy lifestyle.

And don't escape in such ways.
 
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