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  1. #261
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lexicon View Post
    I relate to essentially all of this (eerily so), except the part toward the end- I don't really feel "disdain for" or a sense of superiority over more emotionally reactive people. I do empathetically feel where they're coming from, and sure, ideally, it'd be wonderful if people could pause, and think more often before reacting.. but I accept this is no easy feat, and that perhaps I may be at a deficit at times for remaining stoic, as well. I'm also not a 100% robot, either, so who am I to judge? I can feel quite drained/frustrated by the reactivity, however, and I suppose some of that comes from being more analytic when it comes to intense emotions.
    Disdain probably wasn’t the best word (projection on my part, herp derp) but I was describing that as coming from a 5 who would think their detachment is a “superior” perspective to the “inferior” one of more emotive people.

    I am also extremely, extremely drained by reactive people as well, but it seems to manifest in me as an impatient, silent rage. Emotive, reactive people I feel are so not contained it can sometimes make me very agitated a weird way that’s difficult for me to explain. I almost feel burdened and responsible for their states, and feel either they or I need to control it. Again, it’s a projection of my needs to be contained and not a burden that I unconsciously expect others to have that same need.



  2. #262
    Temporal Mechanic. Lexicon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    Disdain probably wasn’t the best word (projection on my part, herp derp) but I was describing that as coming from a 5 who would think their detachment is a “superior” perspective to the “inferior” one of more emotive people.

    I am also extremely, extremely drained by reactive people as well, but it seems to manifest in me as an impatient, silent rage. Emotive, reactive people I feel are so not contained it can sometimes make me very agitated a weird way that’s difficult for me to explain. I almost feel burdened and responsible for their states, and feel either they or I need to control it. Again, it’s a projection of my needs to be contained and not a burden that I unconsciously expect others to have that same need.

    Makes sense. I suppose my exhaustion mostly comes from that aux Fe drive to connect, and neutralize the issue. Logically I'll see the futility from miles away, but the drive remains, and I sort of end up soaking in all that reactivity, trying to dissect it, regardless. If I've managed to be helpful, however, it's not tiring at all, in retrospect. Being able to help kind of reminds me that I can be useful because of my detached perspective, reinforces some sense of competence, I guess. Also reminds me that I too, am human. And that it's all right to be so (sometimes).
    03/23 06:06:58 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:06:59 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:21:34 Nancynobullets: LEXXX *sacrifices a first born*
    03/23 06:21:53 Nancynobullets: We summon yooouuu
    03/23 06:29:07 Lexicon: I was sleeping!



    04/25 04:20:35 Patches: Don't listen to lex. She wants to birth a litter of kittens. She doesnt get to decide whats creepy

    02/16 23:49:38 ygolo: Lex is afk
    02/16 23:49:45 Cimarron: she's doing drugs with Jack

    03/05 19:27:41 Time: You can't make chat morbid. Lex does it naturally.

  3. #263
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    wrong thread

  4. #264
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lexicon View Post
    Also reminds me that I too, am human.
    Come on. Embrace it!




  5. #265
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    Disdain probably wasn’t the best word (projection on my part, herp derp) but I was describing that as coming from a 5 who would think their detachment is a “superior” perspective to the “inferior” one of more emotive people.

    I am also extremely, extremely drained by reactive people as well, but it seems to manifest in me as an impatient, silent rage. Emotive, reactive people I feel are so not contained it can sometimes make me very agitated a weird way that’s difficult for me to explain. I almost feel burdened and responsible for their states, and feel either they or I need to control it. Again, it’s a projection of my needs to be contained and not a burden that I unconsciously expect others to have that same need.
    you know...i do that too. i often have little patience for intense negative reactions...like dramatic emotional responses...and can be quite steely in response.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  6. #266
    TypologyBentral.Bom chickpea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stansmith View Post
    At least you heart types get to be naturally sexy. 4w3s can't open a can of Pabst Blue Ribbon without looking graceful as hell. Every single body movement a 4w3/3w4 makes looks like human perfection
    that's the 3 wing though.. 4w5s are pretty much fucked.

  7. #267
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    you know...i do that too. i often have little patience for intense negative reactions...like dramatic emotional responses...and can be quite steely in response.
    That sounds like it correlates to 7.

    7's can get overwhelmed by negative states and therefore distance themselves...I do this too and I only have a wing of seven

    I wonder if it's cause a 7 is integrating to 5 or something?
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
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  8. #268
    Freyja's Amargith's Avatar
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    I wonder though @Lexicon, @JocktheMotie and @Lady X

    What if that other person, the one that is in that reactive state of mind reassures you that they can handle and prefer those emotions? That you aren't 'responsible' for managing it, that they can do that fine on their own?

    I mean...I get the reflex to feel like you have to manage and that you have to take care of it for the other person and frankly...it is one of the hardest things I've had to learn, but I'm at the stage where I can see someone in emotional turmoil, and after having stepped in to help them stabilise, also recognize when the point has come that they need to do the rest - even if they are still in pain and struggling. It's kind of like the father who eventually has to let go of the bike his kid is trying to master, and let them... well, crash if that is what they need to do. It's terrifying, it feels powerless, but ultimately, its the only way they will learn

    It won't help them to go be angry or frustrated at them, or even panic and get sucked into the turmoil yourself. They need to be focusing on regaining control, not you being pissed at them or needing help yourself. So you shout directions from the sideline, or play cheerleader instead, I find. Emotions generally don't kill you, it can just take a while to learn how to ride that wave. And yes, it can feel like you are drowning, but truthfully, that person is in no real danger.

    I sometimes have other people trying to manage my emotions coz they seem too out of control for them and then seeing them freak at how they are going to manage, and I end up resenting them for having to curb what for me is just..well fun to tinker with and for them seems to be something they cannot leave alone and get sucked into and panic at. It is kind of tiresome on the other end too, tbh.
    It's like a surfer riding the highest wave and enjoying himself, suddenly having someone climb onboard and go 'OMG, we're going to die! What are you doing, man????' to then frantically start steering the board for me. Wtf dude, get off my board already!
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





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  9. #269
    Temporal Mechanic. Lexicon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    I wonder though @Lexicon, @JocktheMotie and @Lady X

    What if that other person, the one that is in that reactive state of mind reassures you that they can handle and prefer those emotions? That you aren't 'responsible' for managing it, that they can do that fine on their own?

    I mean...I get the reflex to feel like you have to manage and that you have to take care of it for the other person and frankly...it is one of the hardest things I've had to learn, but I'm at the stage where I can see someone in emotional turmoil, and after having stepped in to help them stabilise, also recognize when the point has come that they need to do the rest - even if they are still in pain and struggling. It's kind of like the father who eventually has to let go of the bike his kid is trying to master, and let them... well, crash if that is what they need to do. It's terrifying, it feels powerless, but ultimately, its the only way they will learn

    It won't help them to go be angry or frustrated at them, or even panic and get sucked into the turmoil yourself. They need to be focusing on regaining control, not you being pissed at them or needing help yourself. So you shout directions from the sideline, or play cheerleader instead, I find. Emotions generally don't kill you, it can just take a while to learn how to ride that wave. And yes, it can feel like you are drowning, but truthfully, that person is in no real danger.

    I sometimes have other people trying to manage my emotions coz they seem too out of control for them and then seeing them freak at how they are going to manage, and I end up resenting them for having to curb what for me is just..well fun to tinker with and for them seems to be something they cannot leave alone and get sucked into and panic at. It is kind of tiresome on the other end too, tbh.
    It's like a surfer riding the highest wave and enjoying himself, suddenly having someone climb onboard and go 'OMG, we're going to die! What are you doing, man????' to then frantically start steering the board for me. Wtf dude, get off my board already!
    Ah, for me- I mostly meant when people are being emotionally reactive at me, specifically, coming to me with problems they repeatedly refuse to resolve/make any effort to do so- freaking out about it like it's new information.. or confrontation of some unreasonable sort. Not just regular run-of-the-mill getting overwhelmed, but things going beyond that, into the more "emotionally unstable (/damaging)" realm, if y'know what I mean. I get drained from that, trying to neutralize it, somehow. So, I guess I should've said emotionally unstable. Typical reactivity does give me pause, but it's not stressful/draining for me to deal with/just exist near without getting deeply involved. I can kinda stay detached unless they really want me to engage, if that makes sense. (I just woke up, I probably should've waited for coffee before trying to.. make words)
    03/23 06:06:58 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:06:59 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:21:34 Nancynobullets: LEXXX *sacrifices a first born*
    03/23 06:21:53 Nancynobullets: We summon yooouuu
    03/23 06:29:07 Lexicon: I was sleeping!



    04/25 04:20:35 Patches: Don't listen to lex. She wants to birth a litter of kittens. She doesnt get to decide whats creepy

    02/16 23:49:38 ygolo: Lex is afk
    02/16 23:49:45 Cimarron: she's doing drugs with Jack

    03/05 19:27:41 Time: You can't make chat morbid. Lex does it naturally.

  10. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    I like how you mention the acuteness of the suffering; it's an important notion. To me even the idea of an acute emotion conjures up feelings and fears of becoming engulfed in that emotion and the immediate defense is to use the evil machinery of my mind to strip that emotion of that kind of power. It's so powerful a reflex that I don't know if I can even answer the "acuteness" question honestly.

    But I'll try. At the core, I think the "suffering" is felt (and occurs) at a slower, deeper level that resembles more the lengthy process of erosion rather than the some sort of acute impact. Over time, the difficulty/fear of crossing the "distance" between the 5 and the world can wear away both the desire to reach out and one's confidence in their ability to do so. The 5 starts feeling that they cannot really share themselves effectively with the world and so they retreat. And this distance slowly increases until the 5 can feel that life, the world, their desires, a relationship; these things aren't really available to them anymore. I think all 5s feel, at times, with varying frequency based on health, incapable of and/or confined by true connection with the world and with people. It is fundamentally an erosion of will and agency, a suppression of some pretty basic needs.

    The 5's detachment certainly makes them feel safe and they feel like it's the only way they can objectively analyze and prepare for experience and emotion. But saying it makes them superior? I think they can view "engulfed" beings with disdain because they watch these people experience these turbulent emotions and think that if they were properly prepared/detached/intelligent enough they would have avoided the emotion entirely, which as far as the 5 is concerned, is of utmost importance. So that's where that might come from.

    I'm not sure if that answers the question, or is descriptive enough. But I can certainly expand.
    Thanks for explaining why many fives irritate the bejeezus out of me. You guys think it's superior. I think its repression and possibly emotionally disturbed.

    Lex is an exception and a fine example of why all 5s should be INFJs. Natural therapists all of them, im sure.

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