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  1. #41
    Senior Member Silveresque's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vizzy View Post
    @21% - For me, being called "average" is nearly the same as being called a "failure". If I'm not outstanding, notable or above average in what I'm doing, then I've failed. I haven't done well enough.
    I agree with this. I feel horrible when I'm "average", and in some ways I actually feel that either extreme is better than being average. Not only is average not living up to my standards, but it's ordinary and boring as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vizzy View Post
    You can't seperate being called weird and being called an idiot? I was a bit shocked when I read this. It's definitely something worth looking into and I'm sure it'd help in sorting out your Enneagram.

    Before I go on giving my definitions, would you mind elaborating on what you said above?
    What makes those two words synonymous for you?
    Being weird makes you feel like an idiot?
    Well, generally when I do something weird, it's also dumb. Like when I say something that makes no sense or I dress oddly (by accident), so I'm referring to mistakes that make me look weird or stupid. Or if I start a thread and nobody responds, I'll think it's because people thought it was weird or stupid.

    I don't know, I guess I'm mainly self-conscious about doing or saying stupid things rather than just weird. Being a recluse probably makes me weird, I guess, but I wouldn't mind if people considered me weird for that. Maybe I just have a weird definition of weird? :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Vizzy View Post

    Do you honestly think that's a weird point of view? Can you relate to it at all?
    I can relate to wanting to be unique, but I'm generally too self-conscious to feel good about being weird. I do kind of like being an asexual atheist loner because it increases my uniqueness, but I wouldn't be able to wear odd clothing because I would feel too self-conscious. I want my appearance to be "normal", and I want to sound normal as well, but I like having unique and interesting ideas and opinions.

  2. #42
    Senior Member Silveresque's Avatar
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    ^In case that didn't make sense, I think I've figured it out. I try to be "normal" to avoid looking stupid and making dumb mistakes in social situations. "Normal" to me means not taking unnecessary risks which make me stand out and thus feel vulnerable. But I want to express myself, so occasionally that desire leaks through the mask of "normal", and often I end up feeling like an idiot when that happens (because I'm putting myself out there and that's dangerous), even though the other person might not see anything wrong with it.

    I hope I didn't just confuse you more.

  3. #43
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    ^ Well if that says anything, it says more about instinctual variants than your actual Enneagram type, imo -- definitely So first, maybe So/Sp.
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    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
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  4. #44
    Senior Member Silveresque's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    ^ Well if that says anything, it says more about instinctual variants than your actual Enneagram type, imo -- definitely So first, maybe So/Sp.
    Really? I can't see myself as an So first...Shouldn't being reserved, private, and cautious in order to protect against feeling vulnerable go with Sp?

    EDIT: And it sounds to me more like 5 than 9, since I think a 9 would be reserved to preserve the peace rather than protect against vulnerability...But it may not necessarily be type related.

  5. #45
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevlisZero View Post
    Really? I can't see myself as an So first...Shouldn't being reserved, private, and cautious in order to protect against feeling vulnerable go with Sp?
    "Social" is a misleading word in this context -- it has a lot more to do with being aware of how people relate to each other (i.e. social dynamics), and where you stand in relation to other people, than it has to do with actually being a "social" person. Otherwise the So instinct would overwhelming be attributed to extroverts, and that's not the case!

    I actually related a lot to elements of your post, because of being So/Sp. I absolutely hate hate HATE being embarrassed, and I am the most embarrassed when I feel like I've violated a social norm, when I feel people's eyes on me and imagine them thinking "What a freak" or "What an idiot" -- just like what you were saying about combining "weird" and "dumb", or whatever your word choice was. The thought process is: I must have been an idiot to have violated that social norm. But a lot of people don't think that way, you know? A lot of people honest to god don't care (or notice!!) where they stand with other people.
    EDIT: And it sounds to me more like 5 than 9, since I think a 9 would be reserved to preserve the peace rather than protect against vulnerability...But it may not necessarily be type related.
    Hard to know. I can think of very few types that wouldn't consider protecting against vulnerability to be a priority. But then again, my type (both MBTI and Enneagram) is like that to the max, so I dunno how it is with other people.


    EDIT: You could easily be Sp/So also... but I feel like the fact that your vulnerability coincides with feeling "weird" by social standards is very very So.
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    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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    want to ask me something? go for it!

  6. #46
    Senior Member VagrantFarce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevlisZero View Post
    Really? I can't see myself as an So first...Shouldn't being reserved, private, and cautious in order to protect against feeling vulnerable go with Sp?
    Social types are simply preoccupied with how they relate (or don't relate) to groups. You can still be private and reticent. Being a social type doesn't automatically make you gregarious. You might want to be, deep down...
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  7. #47
    Senior Member Vizzy's Avatar
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    Interesting views from everyone.

    About saying weird things (weird, not stupid) and behaving different, some might say that a 5 just wouldn't worry too much about that sort of attention/judgement from others.
    They worry more about other things.
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  8. #48
    Senior Member Silveresque's Avatar
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    I'm actually leaning toward sp/sx. I seem to have a sort of push/pull relationship where on one hand, I want to express myself and share my inner world with my thoughts and feelings, but on the other hand, I feel vulnerable whenever I do this, so I often remain reserved and private in order to protect myself. I've been quite expressive and self-revealing in some of my posts, especially in my blog. I think for an sp/so or so/sp, the motivation to come out of the protective sp mode would be the desire to be successful socially...which doesn't appeal to me in the slightest.

    I think anyone would be embarrassed when they mess up in front of a group, whether so first or last. But for me, the focus often isn't on the group, but on one person I respect who I feel must have a low opinion of me because of this stupid mistake I made. I sometimes do worry about how the things I say will affect my reputation I guess, but when I'm thinking about my reputation I tend to focus in on the perspective of one other person (e.g. this person must think I'm a complete idiot now...how will I ever be able to interact with this person again? ). I don't know if this is different from so or not.

  9. #49
    Senior Member VagrantFarce's Avatar
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    Being SP-dom has nothing to do with being private or reserved or quiet. Would you call Steven Spielberg private or reserved? Or Alan Sugar?

    The self-preservation instinct is meant to reflect people who are most drawn to their own sense of comfort & familiarity (or lack thereof), just like the social instinct is meant to reflect people who are most drawn to their place within groups of people (or lack thereof), and the sexual instinct is meant to reflect people who are most drawn to intimacy and significant others (or lack thereof).

    I think you're confusing your own Five-ish tendencies (being emotionally guarded, reviewing and obsessing over mistakes) with the SP instinct.
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  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    Being SP-dom has nothing to do with being private or reserved or quiet. Would you call Steven Spielberg private or reserved? Or Alan Sugar?

    The self-preservation instinct is meant to reflect people who are most drawn to their own sense of comfort & familiarity (or lack thereof), just like the social instinct is meant to reflect people who are most drawn to their place within groups of people (or lack thereof), and the sexual instinct is meant to reflect people who are most drawn to intimacy and significant others (or lack thereof).

    I think you're confusing your own Five-ish tendencies (being emotionally guarded, reviewing and obsessing over mistakes) with the SP instinct.
    Can you please elaborate on the lack thereof part? I dismissed SO dominance because of the lack of the group-orientedness but I seem to be highly aware of group dynamics.

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