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  1. #1
    Member Black Hole Sun's Avatar
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    Default Introverted Enneagram + Introverted MBTI = A socially hot mess person?

    I've read and research on enneagram stating that 4,5,6 and 9 (and maybe 1 I don't remember) are all introverted enneagrams and I think my enneagram is 4w5 and tritype is 4-6-9 so if this is true then no wonder I don't do big crowds of people and die in social settings. Oh I believe I am a INFJ too. So I like really being to myself it is amazing, But I was wondering if there were a 4 with tritype of 4 5 8 would there be any significant differences to how that makes the 4 view the world? Idk if this makes sense, but I was thinking about that.

    Any answers?

  2. #2
    Member Bamboozle's Avatar
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    I'm still not an expert on Enneagram so I can only speak from my experience/limited knowledge.

    I think it depends on the way your tritype is balanced. Depending on how strong the 8 pull is, I think you could indeed get a very different looking 4. I think the different types can reinforce inclinations as well as contradict one another (creating a push/pull effect). It also depends on the instinctual variant. The sexual and social instinct seem to draw people outward; the self-preservation instinct, inwards.

    I offer myself as an example.

    I'm 3-5-1 (or 5-3-1?) sx/so, INTP. I'm inclined to introversion and protecting my space. But I also have the need to come out of that space every so often. I'll try to show how I think the different factors stack and reinforce/contradict one another in my world-view and behaviour:

    MBTI-wise I feel like I am always doing battle with my Si. It is my tertiary and I know that there is some part of me that would prefer the security of the things I know. Knowing this, I will consciously make the decision to make myself uncomfortable in order to obtain new information (often about myself and people—Fe inferior pull, I think).

    Enneagram type-wise: There is a conflicting push/pull between 5 and 3. 5 wants to go in; 3 wants recognition. In order to get recognition, I have to make myself comfortable amongst people. But since I feel safest and most at peace when I am detached, going out to meet people all the time drains me a whole lot. Reconciling my detached, safe haven inside my head with the demands of the world outside is a perpetual battle. I think in terms of bridges—I live on an island but am compelled to build bridges to the outside world. I think this is the result of 3/5 modifying one another.

    Furthermore, I see 3s described as having a diminished idea of who they 'really' are. I do not identify with that. Perhaps this is because I am 3w4 but I think the 5 comes into play, too. In my detached world, I do not need to explain who I am to anyone.

    Enneagram and instincts: Finally, the preference for sexual instinct—again. A pull out to people and the environment. I want a connection. I don't want to have to go through all the small talk-y things. I hate that. But I love it when I click with someone and feel compelled to go out and find compatible people. I pull them into my inner circle if they let me. If the connection is just right, they are no longer a drain and my pull both inwards and outwards reaches an equilibrium. Thus, I have very few actual friends. I feel threatened so easily. It is no surprise that my partner is a fellow INT(J) and has a 5 in their tritype.

    I hope that was informative…and not just tl;dr :P.
    3 INTP

  3. #3
    Ruler of the Stars Asterion's Avatar
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    I'm an INTP 5, possibly the most introverted combination around, but I can still be somewhat social. It usually feels like a waste of time for me though, I feel that I would have been better off staying home working at my latest hobby, or studying in isolation. I think it's most important for 5s to come out of their shell, and connect to the rest of the world socially, but sometimes I have tried, but I've usually felt disappointed, fake and bored.
    5 3 9

  4. #4
    Member Black Hole Sun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamboozle View Post
    I'm still not an expert on Enneagram so I can only speak from my experience/limited knowledge.

    I think it depends on the way your tritype is balanced. Depending on how strong the 8 pull is, I think you could indeed get a very different looking 4. I think the different types can reinforce inclinations as well as contradict one another (creating a push/pull effect). It also depends on the instinctual variant. The sexual and social instinct seem to draw people outward; the self-preservation instinct, inwards.

    I offer myself as an example.

    I'm 3-5-1 (or 5-3-1?) sx/so, INTP. I'm inclined to introversion and protecting my space. But I also have the need to come out of that space every so often. I'll try to show how I think the different factors stack and reinforce/contradict one another in my world-view and behaviour:

    MBTI-wise I feel like I am always doing battle with my Si. It is my tertiary and I know that there is some part of me that would prefer the security of the things I know. Knowing this, I will consciously make the decision to make myself uncomfortable in order to obtain new information (often about myself and people—Fe inferior pull, I think).

    Enneagram type-wise: There is a conflicting push/pull between 5 and 3. 5 wants to go in; 3 wants recognition. In order to get recognition, I have to make myself comfortable amongst people. But since I feel safest and most at peace when I am detached, going out to meet people all the time drains me a whole lot. Reconciling my detached, safe haven inside my head with the demands of the world outside is a perpetual battle. I think in terms of bridges—I live on an island but am compelled to build bridges to the outside world. I think this is the result of 3/5 modifying one another.

    Furthermore, I see 3s described as having a diminished idea of who they 'really' are. I do not identify with that. Perhaps this is because I am 3w4 but I think the 5 comes into play, too. In my detached world, I do not need to explain who I am to anyone.

    Enneagram and instincts: Finally, the preference for sexual instinct—again. A pull out to people and the environment. I want a connection. I don't want to have to go through all the small talk-y things. I hate that. But I love it when I click with someone and feel compelled to go out and find compatible people. I pull them into my inner circle if they let me. If the connection is just right, they are no longer a drain and my pull both inwards and outwards reaches an equilibrium. Thus, I have very few actual friends. I feel threatened so easily. It is no surprise that my partner is a fellow INT(J) and has a 5 in their tritype.

    I hope that was informative…and not just tl;dr :P.
    Thank you! I forgot to put the instincts that was suppose to be part of my explanation, this was very informative and helpful, especially how you still remain to yourself and have an underlining to connect with people.

    For me I am a 4-6-9 Sp/So INFJ I believe so mostly I don't like really like mingling with people for some of the same reasons fake, draining and I don't ever really do small talk I don't know how too lol. For me if I have time to think and relax and be comfortable it is so amazing, I think I still have a want to make a connection with people, but I wanna bypass all the falseness that start when you meet someone. If I knew the people around weren't evil and like having meaningful conversations then I would, but I feel very introverted and very contradicting too.

    Thank you so much.


    Quote Originally Posted by King-Of-Despair View Post
    I'm an INTP 5, possibly the most introverted combination around, but I can still be somewhat social. It usually feels like a waste of time for me though, I feel that I would have been better off staying home working at my latest hobby, or studying in isolation. I think it's most important for 5s to come out of their shell, and connect to the rest of the world socially, but sometimes I have tried, but I've usually felt disappointed, fake and bored.
    I agree I feel as if my Fe draws me too people, but my Ni-Ti doesn't really want too, so I usually don't, but can in little brief moments, and I rather stay home and watch tv or lay down and think for a while.

    Thank you.

  5. #5
    Member Bamboozle's Avatar
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    You're welcome, @Black Hole Sun . Happy to hear it was informative.


    Quote Originally Posted by Black Hole Sun View Post
    For me if I have time to think and relax and be comfortable it is so amazing, I think I still have a want to make a connection with people, but I wanna bypass all the falseness that start when you meet someone. If I knew the people around weren't evil and like having meaningful conversations then I would, but I feel very introverted and very contradicting too.
    Quote Originally Posted by King-Of-Despair
    sometimes I have tried, but I've usually felt disappointed, fake and bored.
    I agree with both. If I am to socialise, I find that I have to balance two things: my interest in the other person and the person that I am with other people. If I feel too fake around someone, I feel compelled to spend less time with them. If I like them enough, though, I might override my instinct to run and just put up with it :P, awkwardness and all. I tend to do this for INFJs, incidentally.
    3 INTP

  6. #6
    Senior Member Richardsen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Hole Sun View Post
    But I was wondering if there were a 4 with tritype of 4 5 8 would there be any significant differences to how that makes the 4 view the world? Idk if this makes sense, but I was thinking about that.

    Any answers?
    458 here!!
    The 458 Its a very withdrawn type, especially with the 4 or 5 in the core type.
    With the 5 and 8 you will get a very misanthropist 4, more tough minded, more stubborn.

    With the 4 and 5 I often choose to withdraw in mysellf, and the 8 to me is a aggresive, realistic and steady "father". I consider myself extremely intense, volatile, and complex ( Sx/Sp is a factor too).
    I dont have a need to conect with people too much, in fact Im very detached and cynical with most of the people, except from my intimate ones. My view of the world it's pretty cynical I think.
    I had some problems in my childhood with the world, my father always tell me that I sometimes scared him with my rageful - withdrawn attitudes.
    More hermetic than withdrawn 4...
    Kurt Cobain is a 548 that comes to mind (but with 5 in the core). Nick Cave is another with the 4 as main type.


    6w5(sw5w4) Sx/Sp
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    "Some people never go crazy... What truly horrible lives they must lead"- Charles Bukowski


  7. #7
    libtard SJW chickpea's Avatar
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    i'm a hot mess socially and otherwise. i'm 459 or maybe 479, but either way, being sx-first is probably the only thing stopping me from being a total recluse.

  8. #8
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    extroversion is overrated. being the strong and silent type leaning against the wall in the corner is so much more bad ass.
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  9. #9
    Member Black Hole Sun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richardsen View Post
    458 here!!
    The 458 Its a very withdrawn type, especially with the 4 or 5 in the core type.
    With the 5 and 8 you will get a very misanthropist 4, more tough minded, more stubborn.

    With the 4 and 5 I often choose to withdraw in mysellf, and the 8 to me is a aggresive, realistic and steady "father". I consider myself extremely intense, volatile, and complex ( Sx/Sp is a factor too).
    I dont have a need to conect with people too much, in fact Im very detached and cynical with most of the people, except from my intimate ones. My view of the world it's pretty cynical I think.
    I had some problems in my childhood with the world, my father always tell me that I sometimes scared him with my rageful - withdrawn attitudes.
    More hermetic than withdrawn 4...
    Kurt Cobain is a 548 that comes to mind (but with 5 in the core). Nick Cave is another with the 4 as main type.

    This is very interesting thank you so much for your insight, I feel very withdrawn too, but like I feel cynical yet optimistic in the same time. Thanks again.

  10. #10
    Blind Guardian Haven's Avatar
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    The most typically withdrawn types are 4,5 and 9. 6s can go either way. That doesn't mean that if you are socially awkward or hermetic you must be one of those types, especially if you're young. Anyone can be eccentric
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