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  • 2w3

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  • 3 (w2 or w4)

    3 50.00%
  • 4 (w3 or w5)

    0 0%
  • 6w7

    1 16.67%
  • 7w6

    2 33.33%
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  1. #51
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post

    hm. i would definitely say i'm 3w4, if i'm a 3, but i don't do that reverting to polish thing... when i get nervous i get very self-conscious. it's not like going into a shell as much as being too open, really. i've had to work a lot on maintaining professionalism, because i tend to open up and be gushy (i mean i am an ENFP). when i'm really stressed out i can be kind of cold to others and very avoidant, which i associated with 9, but i dunno. i definitely do try to be seen in a good light, but i almost feel like it's more like the 6's desire for inclusion than the 3's need to be on top. though i do have this sort of embarrassing habit of checking up on the most successful students at my high school, to make sure they're not doing "better" than me (succeeding at things i would like to succeed at). i can't tell if it's a sort of 6 thing or a 3 thing though, because in some ways i'm looking for what direction i should take... for example, the most achieving girl in my high school is now a business consultant, and suddenly i really am not as envious of her anymore, because i would really hate that job. i mean it still annoys me a little, because i know she's continuing to overachieve and will probably be a CEO and philanthropist by 30 (she is DEFINITELY a 3w2), but her job kind of takes the edge off because it's not the direction i want to go in. but at the same time, that's kind of unfortunate, because that doesn't help me at all figure out what i want to do. she can't be a sort of guidepost for me anymore. i guess because i tend to idolize people like that, i have this tendency to feel like i'm always running after someone in my accomplishments. i don't know. the more i think about it the more i relate to 6, but i have a strong connection to both types. i've seen 3s called vain though, and i'm really not. i'm actually quite insecure, at least lately. whatever it is in the enneagram that i grow to, i become much more self-assured and self-centered when i grow. if i had to choose a neurosis i would probably be dependent or histrionic. that's why i'm so confused about integration/disintegration, because if i could make my own pattern, i'd say i'm a 6 who integrates to 3 and disintegrates to 9
    Most of the things you describe here could actually be called "struggle for identity", right ? you explain how you cant relate to overachiever's girl choices/identity which makes you confused, you are searching your identity outside of yourself, that is what 3s do. What is officially the biggest issue of feeling (2,3,4) triad? Identity.


    but her job kind of takes the edge off because it's not the direction i want to go in. but at the same time, that's kind of unfortunate, because that doesn't help me at all figure out what i want to do. she can't be a sort of guidepost for me anymore
    yeah, at the same time she used to represent to you whats accepted, wanted, whats The Best, and what culture accepts, but at the other side that's simply not you, you have your personal desires etc. that are not exactly like cultures/hers so you cant look up to her if you want to be yourself.


    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche
    From I have read, with 3s, a very short time separate thought from action. While 6s have hard time to be engaged in a project, not because they are less energetic or competent, but because they doubt of their capacities or the value of the project. 3s avoid doubting, the more they doubt, the more they try to avoid doubting by cramming their agenda. 3s have as much difficulties to stop than 6s have difficulties to continue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interview with Helen Palmer
    Will you, as an example, pick a type and its vice and talk about some of the things a person with this type might experience in trying to convert it to a virtue?
    For example, one of the two general types, not of the seven tendencies, is the Performer. The Performer is based on deception, that's the vice, and that's not named in the seven capital tendencies of spiritual tradition, but it is in Dante's Purgatorio, recognized as the component that's necessary to form a type. What it means is, you become your role or your image, become identified with it. The focus in deception isn't on lying, the deception is a form of self-deception, where the child has been praised for performance, product, goals and results, and that becomes a lasting impression. In order to get that validation in childhood, that you are a successful performer, that you can produce goals, make the project happen, "there are no cookies for losers," you only get recognition when you're outstanding. So the kid learns to ace the piano recital, to be photographed, get his/her picture on the bulletin board, to be known, to be seen, and to be applauded. A great many public figures are of this persuasion, where it's very important to be number one and it's terrible to be number two. So there is an urgency which is much more outstanding in the Performer type than in the other eight, to be that winner, that leader, and to get up on stage. Pertinent to that, a whole lifestyle is organized around status, performance, recognition, material manifestations like money, title, and appearance. Those kinds of matters are important to everyone, but outstanding to this type. Everyone has it, but this one has it in spades. So, that central preoccupation doesn't seem deceptive, it just seems like the American ideal. But you deceive yourself when you are inhabiting an image that you are that winner. There is a lot riding on other people's approval. You can deceive yourself by thinking you are the image when you are projecting this appropriate persona. So, the THREE becomes a chameleon. They can sense what is wanted, adjust, alter themselves to fit the prototype, get the job done, and believe that that's who they are. In that sense it's a deception. You believe your role, you believe your image, you believe your persona is who you really are. And this is devastating [to the Performer] if this [image] is dismantled, like through a job loss; often it's a mid-life or health crisis, when feelings that are genuine start to arise. When you are projecting an image to get a job done, your personal feelings about what you really want, not what others want, is suspended. Feelings are suspended in the interest of getting the job done. The job is the image that you hold up to the world, and that's what you think you are. This is the summation of this type.

    Now, to dismantle this, and we all know people who are stars, and who insist on being stars, and they probably are outstanding, but there's so much riding on it. We can see this throughout life. We can see the difference between the persona a person projects, and who they really are. So the conversion has to be recognition on the part of this THREE of their own feelings, when their feelings are different than their image, when they don't want to perform, when they are sad, when they have their own emotions that stand in the way of success and efficiency. This transformation process is not always pleasant. This is why it is often difficult. Often, the THREE comes into the Ennegram work, or any kind of therapy, when there has been a breakdown of some kind, when they just can't keep the pose up any longer. Losing a job, becoming ill, and then their feelings come up. That can be devastating, but it has also been described as a very transformational time for many THREE's. They observed their tendency to please others, get approval, be the winner, but then they start to let it go, and become more themselves.

    The power of the Enneagram is in the shape of the interacting lines. Paradoxically, the more secure the life situation is for a THREE, like a job that really works, or a relationship that really works, the more the Performer becomes fearful, moving into their security point, which is at the SIX, what I call the Trooper, or Devil's Advocate.That position is uncomfortable for a Performer because feelings come up. They become afraid, "Maybe people won't like me as I really am, so let me impress them further." Paradoxically, in this secure life situation, the Perfomer becomes more tentative and afraid because they have to be seen for themselves, not for their produced image. Under stress, on the other hand, moving in the direction of the other arrow, the THREE moves in the direction of a NINE, or the Mediator. So when one says, "Which type am I?" I would have to say he or she is made up from three different types. There are three basic aspects to one's personality. The way you are under stress, the way you are when you're secure, and the way you are normally. The placement of the types on the nine pointed star gives very precise predictions about this.

    I see in the bolded part of Palmer's interview exactly what Skylights's been explaining about her own case, that anxiety about "who am i?".
    Not all 3s are always 3s, some 3s become 6 and 9s. In my own case, I am a 3, but for example my older sister is an ESTJ and a 3. She took all the lime light, which is one of the reason why I am not so much in 3, I could achieve but my sister was dominant and would get more apraisal, which makes me move more to 9. How I know I am a 3 is that I am incredibely achievement oriented, and it's my Top priority, but achievements wont make me happy by themselves, motives need to be genuine, but I always Ltry to "save myself" by planning big come backs. Nothing can make me more miserable than feeling like a "failure", which is not the case with some of my friends, you can see a clear difference; example INFJ-9.... he is not so vain about success as i am, i dislike letting know my "enemies" my failures sick. then a 5 friend - he can not believe how obsessed with success I am... it became obvious isince i wasnt as successful in everything, while i was the best in my eyes, i wasnt aware how imp it is for me D


    I also think that being a 3 doesnt mean neccessary being ingenuine, after all, 3's gift is "truthfulness".

    .....but a healthy Three for example, actually just has an amazing love of integrity, they've seen through their game, ..do you understand, it's "i dont want to do that anymore, i am sick of doing that, and actually have a passion for integrity, more than most people... - Richard Rorh, at Oprah radio.

    Example of ENFP and 3. "Transformed"

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIhaa7U1NWA"]3[/YOUTUBE]

  2. #52
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    I see in the bolded part of Palmer's interview exactly what Skylights's been explaining about her own case, that anxiety about "who am i
    Paradoxically, the more secure the life situation is for a THREE, like a job that really works, or a relationship that really works, the more the Performer becomes fearful, moving into their security point, which is at the SIX, what I call the Trooper, or Devil's Advocate.That position is uncomfortable for a Performer because feelings come up. They become afraid, "Maybe people won't like me as I really am, so let me impress them further."
    I also think that being a 3 doesnt mean neccessary being ingenuine, after all, 3's gift is "truthfulness".
    The anxiety about "who I am" is usually felt when the 3 is connected to 6, wich is theorically the security point. The thing is that the security point is often what we avoid. I mean, and this is what I've read from Palmer, that when 3s are in security they can doubt about the genuine of their life and their achievements, and they usually don't want that, and so they try to avoid secured situations, craping their agendas and go further, as you put in your post. They can allow themself to move to 6 when they truly feel secured but other than that, they still in their impression that they are human doing and not human being, and seek to activities to alway still busy and avoid their security point, the 6, until they disintegrate in 9 and become totally unaware of their true self, but at the same time, feel rather happy because they are succesfull and everything seems cool.

    We can see the difference between the persona a person projects, and who they really are. So the conversion has to be recognition on the part of this THREE of their own feelings, when their feelings are different than their image, when they don't want to perform, when they are sad, when they have their own emotions that stand in the way of success and efficiency. This transformation process is not always pleasant. This is why it is often difficult. Often, the THREE comes into the Ennegram work, or any kind of therapy, when there has been a breakdown of some kind, when they just can't keep the pose up any longer. Losing a job, becoming ill, and then their feelings come up. That can be devastating, but it has also been described as a very transformational time for many THREE's. They observed their tendency to please others, get approval, be the winner, but then they start to let it go, and become more themselves.
    So, that part of your post relate to what I said about the difficulty for 3s to stop. It's quite different from what Skylight said I think, she said that she was hesitant and reluctant about jump to success, and tend to withdrawn from this. I think that relate to type 6 even if some of them are obssessed with success also, especially from the Sexual "Strength & Beauty" variant. 6s in their ego typically experiment frequent difficulties to finish projects, and sabote themselves to avoid success. If they find something wich can make them think "I am not true to my self with that success", they would be afraid to be considered as a traitor, or to be stuck and lose themselves, and so to give up, while 3s in their ego would chase that type of thought and pursue the work until the end.

    The challenge of the 6 is faith, they want and have difficulties at the same time to believe that they can be and allow them to be powerfull in their life and trust their success without fear the next danger or to not be authentic, while 3s want and experiment difficulties to be genuine and follow authentic success. Wich is very different. This is the perpetual balance between the mental fixation and the holy idea. I must admit that I am myself chronically obsessed with success, but I think finally understood the difference between the 3 style who compulsively identify to potential success and the 6 style who compulsively worry about the potentials wrong aspects of success, and of life in general. Egotic 3s avoid the doubting behavior of the 6 by being more active while 6s avoid the laid back and going with the flow behavior of the 9 by being more doubting, wich very different I think.
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    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  3. #53
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petra Pan View Post
    This will be my last attempt to explain

    You have to be careful about 3. Threes are the types that question their type the most; because profiles describe people who cant have anything lower than PhD before 23, and who are incredibly narcissistic, and because 3-ish attitude is so well accepted that you think "oh, the fact that i am image conscious doesnt prove anything, everybody is". Yes, everybody is because of culture, not ever Hollywood celeb is a Three, but many many are, that is what they ask for you.
    Also a thing to be careful is that if you are a 3, YOU will relate to ALL OTHER TYPES IF you wish to relate. If you think it'd LOOK cool to be a 7, you will take over some 7's characteristics, if you think 5s are so wise you will take over 5, it happens so unconsciously that most 3s spend their whole lives living in roles and not avare of it. It's typical 3.
    What I am saying here is what King-of-Despair realized in his own example while he was posting here, you can browse his posts, he was between 7,5,9,7,5,3,7 switching back and forth and I told him immediately he is a 3, because he vibes this way, months later he said he thought he is a 7 because he values some of seven's attitude so tried to take over that, but realized he is only 3, not a mix.
    And if someone even remotely relates to taking over something as their own identity - he is very likely a Three.

    All people are to a degree image conscious and take over roles because that's requiered in world, you have you business self, your private self, but 3s do it much more and much better, and they cant not do it (unless they are no longer fixated).
    I'm quite sure all the center types question their type a lot. The only reason why I settled with 9 was because my scores were scattered from 4-7 (who knows, maybe my true type is actually a 6.)



    I mean, take these descriptions of type 9, for example.

    http://www.ocean-moonshine.net/e1428...position=36:36

    The really crucial problem for type Nine individuals is that they tend to have an inadequate sense of self. This leads to a tendency on the part of Nines to both downplay their own significance and to borrow a sense of significance from others. There is, in fact, a sort of paradox at the heart of the type Nine fixation. At a largely subconscious level, Nines intuitively grasp that the constructed personality, the personality with which most of us identify, is not the true self; it is not who they are. This is, in fact, a very deep truth; the constructed personality is simply that - a construct through which consciousness operates, much of it built out of defenses and reactions to dangers which are no longer present; it is, in a sense, both a limitation and an obscuration. But the constructed personality also serves a necessary function; it gives the individual a base from which to operate, a sense of self, however ultimately flawed and partial. While the constructed self is not ultimately who we are, it is a necessary step towards the development of true individuality. Gurdjieff has this to say: "For inner growth, for work on oneself, a certain development of personality, as well as a certain strength of essence are required. An insufficiently developed personality means that...a man cannot begin to work on himself, he cannot begin to study himself, he cannot begin to struggle with his mechanical habits."

    http://mindheart.org/junction/oldcj/ep/types/9/9.html
    Type nine people care more than most about maintaining a comfortable, undisturbed life. They can become trapped by compulsive avoidance of upsetting circumstances. One of their talents is an intuitive ability to melt into another person's being.
    http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/TypeNine.asp
    We have sometimes called the Nine the crown of the Enneagram because it is at the top of the symbol and because it seems to include the whole of it. Nines can have the strength of Eights, the sense of fun and adventure of Sevens, the dutifulness of Sixes, the intellectualism of Fives, the creativity of Fours, the attractiveness of Threes, the generosity of Twos, and the idealism of Ones. However, what they generally do not have is a sense of really inhabiting themselves—a strong sense of their own identity.

  4. #54
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    i found some enneagram tests i'd never taken this morning, and tried to do the "blindly" - not trying to figure out what the questions were asking, just going through it as quickly as i could and answering on my knee-jerk reactions.

    Type 3 - 10.7
    Type 7 - 10
    Type 9 - 9
    Type 4 - 7.3
    Type 6 - 5
    Type 2 - 2

    Wing 3w4 - 14.4
    Wing 4w3 - 12.7
    Wing 7w6 - 12.5
    Wing 7w8 - 12
    Wing 3w2 - 11.7
    Wing 9w8 - 11
    Wing 6w7 - 10
    Wing 9w1 - 9.2
    Wing 4w5 - 8
    Wing 2w3 - 7.4
    Wing 6w5 - 5.7
    Wing 2w1 - 2.2

    Type 7 SX
    Type 4 SX
    Type 3 SX
    Type 2 SX
    Type 8 SO
    Type 6 SX
    Type 9 SX
    Type 1 SO
    Type 5 SX


    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    Yes, but actually, we tend to adopt negatives sides of both 9 and 3 when we disintegrate, and positives sides of both 9 ans 3 when we integrate. But the wing lead us to take more negatives trait from one specific point than from the other when we integrate eand disintegrate. I mean that 6w5 disintegrate more in 3 than in 9 under stress, hard working, accumulating competence and knowledge and focuseed on one specific point but integrate more in 9 than in 3 in security, economise their energy, allow them to be more opened and warm, stay in their comfort zone and love it. While for 6w7 it is the contrary, they sisintegrate more in 9, conformist, going with the flow and trying to disarm others with personal warmth, and integrate more in 3 in security, are achiever and energetic, often glamorous. We move in the two direction with both wings, but the wing lean a global preference. A coloration.
    huh. interesting. i would definitely be 6w7 based on that.

    I relate on this totally. Hard working, trustworthy, etc, is my potential and ideal self, but and don't realize it often because I'm too much hesitant, fearful and distrusting, don't know how to use my energy.
    my only difference, is that my reasons for not fulfilling those ideals is that i get bored and/or distracted. i don't know if i'm just in a particularly e7 mood today because i have the day off, but i'm not:
    reliable - because i'm more interested in something else i'm doing and don't feel like doing the other thing
    hard-working - unless i REALLY have a reason to get into whatever i'm doing. then i kick ass, i work fast and hard and finish asap
    responsible - well, i am responsible. never mind on that one
    trustworthy - ehhh. i tell secrets by accident sometimes. i don't realize, i just want to get in close with whoever i'm with, and say things about other people that are less than charitable. i mean if you TELL me to keep a secret, i'll keep it, but... i think how trustworthy i am depends on the person we're talking about and how much i rely on them (god, i sound like i use people) - but like, if we're talking an SO, i'll be VERY trustworthy, but someone who is entranced with me that i don't really like that much, well, less trustworthy probably...

    7w6 are primarly oriented to positive options and trust spontaneously the positive potential of life, as long as they are not stuck in an option, they also tend to embellish their reality. 6w7 are primarly oriented to possibles danger and emphase the world spontaneously with disquietude and see positive possiblities as a secondary source of information that they can't really take seriously or trust.
    i seem more 7ish this way... i don't know though. i've always had anxiety issues - had panic attacks when i was younger - how do i tell the difference between being a non-6 with some anxiety and a regular 6? are all anxious people sixes? i tend to trust in the far future being awesome but i get situationally anxious about the near future (will the crowd like me, what if i'm late, what if i can't get out, etc). i see more distrust in my dad (e5w6) than me, though... i tend to get kinda happy-go-lucky IT'LL BE FINE! even though i'm kind of anxious too. i dunno.

    i'm just all over the place personality wise

    Yeah sure, Brittany Murphy was ENFP also.
    makes sense. sad she died

    This don't relate very much to 3. Even as Ps, they have hard time to stop working while 6s have difficulties to finish project and still motivated. They are very good to avoid success, often say that they are interested with another thing and/or that they see a falure in the project wich justify to give up, that kind of thing.
    yeah. well and i LOVE starting projects, i have a million going at once, but it's the damn follow-through that gets me. usually i only follow through because i need to for a good grade, or i want to please someone. i don't worry about projects failing, though, i have total confidence that i can do just about anything (my worries are much more about how others will react to me than about how i will fail). it's really funny, i've almost worked out a system for creating extrinsic motivation, i somehow wiggle things around so that i need to do something that will improve me by linking it to someone whose opinion i really care about, like so that they know i'm working on it, so i have motivation to finish all the way though


    see, and it would be so easy to just say i'm a 7w6 (it would make so much sense), but what about all this 3ish stuff? i don't know. maybe i just seem 3ish because i'm socially anxious and because i have a hangup with self-improvement. or maybe i'm a confused 6w7. lol.

    [quote[From I have read, with 3s, a very short time separate thought from action. While 6s have hard time to be engaged in a project, not because they are less energetic or competent, but because they doubt of their capacities or the value of the project. 3s avoid doubting, the more they doubt, the more they try to avoid doubting by cramming their agenda. 3s have as much difficulties to stop than 6s have difficulties to continue. [/quote]

    crap, yeah, i don't tend to doubt either myself or the project. i just think of other things i would rather be doing - new projects to start, other things to take care of, etc. i'm so project oriented, i have projects running all the time. i finish maybe 30% of them, but it seems pretty productive because i have so many. and because i lie to make myself sound more productive. haha. i suck.

    I've read also that people on the triangle, 3-6-9 are the ones who have the most difficulties to identify their type. 3s because they are transformist and can be whatver type they wan to be, or to believe they are the type they want to be, 9s because they don't know themselves and emphasise with each enneatype and 6 because they perpetually fall in constant auto-contradiction and doubting. I know what I mean, I followed that path.
    hmmm. so here's what i'm thinking right this second: i want to be like a 3, for reasons i don't really know (i mean who doesn't want to be successful), and i try for that in my life, but i'm not convinced that's my baseline. i'm anxious but i'm not really dutiful or committed... but i seem entirely too ok with conflict to be a 9. i don't like to numb out of life at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Petra Pan View Post
    Most of the things you describe here could actually be called "struggle for identity", right ? you explain how you cant relate to overachiever's girl choices/identity which makes you confused, you are searching your identity outside of yourself, that is what 3s do. What is officially the biggest issue of feeling (2,3,4) triad? Identity.
    yes, biggest struggle in my life for sure. who i am, what i will become, how i will be important. i know i want to be important. i want to matter. i think that's my biggest fear in life, not mattering. though if mattering is boring... i don't know. it's the whole 7 pleasure thing, i want to have fun and be an achiever, both. it was so easy when i was younger because i liked school, loved learning. there wasn't a separation. achieving meant i would get better treatment so school was more fun, and doing schoolwork was fun so i would achieve more. they were all tied up in one another, they were the same thing!

    yeah, at the same time she used to represent to you whats accepted, wanted, whats The Best, and what culture accepts, but at the other side that's simply not you, you have your personal desires etc. that are not exactly like cultures/hers so you cant look up to her if you want to be yourself.
    yeah, exactly. she represents who i want to be but who i am not. i guess i should want to be who i am, but i feel like i should be able to be anything i want, so i should be able to be like her, even though i'm not like that naturally. she's a J and i wish wish wish i was a J.

    and she's a 3, lol, so how confused am i? maybe i'm a 7 who wants to be a 3, but what does wanting to be a 3 say about me? do 7s want to be 3s? i don't know! lol! whatever type i am, i think i kind of fail at it.


    I see in the bolded part of Palmer's interview exactly what Skylights's been explaining about her own case, that anxiety about "who am i?".
    Not all 3s are always 3s, some 3s become 6 and 9s. In my own case, I am a 3, but for example my older sister is an ESTJ and a 3. She took all the lime light, which is one of the reason why I am not so much in 3, I could achieve but my sister was dominant and would get more apraisal, which makes me move more to 9. How I know I am a 3 is that I am incredibely achievement oriented, and it's my Top priority, but achievements wont make me happy by themselves, motives need to be genuine, but I always Ltry to "save myself" by planning big come backs. Nothing can make me more miserable than feeling like a "failure", which is not the case with some of my friends, you can see a clear difference; example INFJ-9.... he is not so vain about success as i am, i dislike letting know my "enemies" my failures sick. then a 5 friend - he can not believe how obsessed with success I am... it became obvious isince i wasnt as successful in everything, while i was the best in my eyes, i wasnt aware how imp it is for me D
    hmm. yeahhh i try to plan big comebacks too. i've been doing it ever since i was fairly young. i would plan how i would change myself over the summer and come back to school really awesome and popular and great in the fall. i hateeee people seeing my failures too. it's the most embarrassing thing, i freak out. i feel like i know what you mean about moving to 9 too. being in the presence of someone who continually overachieves beyond me pushes me to just not care about stuff. i feel like internally i'm pretty obsessed but i don't think anyone would know it externally. i mean i've always gotten high honors and stuff but i don't think it looks like i try, lol. sometimes i don't really, i just get lucky and know how to manipulate a bit.

    Example of ENFP and 3. "Transformed"
    i like her, she annoyed me at first but made me smile towards the end she seems totally like a J though. i symphatize, i would go in there worried about what i'd slacked off on, concerned that she'd talk about that. whatever i've screwed up on. i definitely know what intimacy is though :/ interesting how she appears to have a lot of mental chatter though, me too. i thought 3s weren't supposed to have that because they're not head types.

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    The anxiety about "who I am" is usually felt when the 3 is connected to 6, wich is theorically the security point. The thing is that the security point is often what we avoid. I mean, and this is what I've read from Palmer, that when 3s are in security they can doubt about the genuine of their life and their achievements, and they usually don't want that, and so they try to avoid secured situations, craping their agendas and go further, as you put in your post. They can allow themself to move to 6 when they truly feel secured but other than that, they still in their impression that they are human doing and not human being, and seek to activities to alway still busy and avoid their security point, the 6, until they disintegrate in 9 and become totally unaware of their true self, but at the same time, feel rather happy because they are succesfull and everything seems cool.
    huh. i feel like that makes a 3 and 7 sound the same... once you've acheived something / locked something in, you start doubting. when you're in a project or doing stuff it's okay though because you're working towards something. maybe i've misunderstood disintegration though. hm.


    So, that part of your post relate to what I said about the difficulty for 3s to stop. It's quite different from what Skylight said I think, she said that she was hesitant and reluctant about jump to success, and tend to withdrawn from this. I think that relate to type 6 even if some of them are obssessed with success also, especially from the Sexual "Strength & Beauty" variant. 6s in their ego typically experiment frequent difficulties to finish projects, and sabote themselves to avoid success. If they find something wich can make them think "I am not true to my self with that success", they would be afraid to be considered as a traitor, or to be stuck and lose themselves, and so to give up, while 3s in their ego would chase that type of thought and pursue the work until the end.
    well, not reluctant to jump to success - i love the limelight - but confused as to knowing which direction to go in. it was hard for me to choose electives in high school, hard for me to choose a college, hard for me to choose a major. i'm good at succeeding at what i choose but i have a hard time knowing what i want. i don't sabotage myself because i don't want success... but i do have trouble finishing things sometimes because i stop being interested in them. i see all their problems and i see other things i might want instead. more i'm thinking i'm a 7, sorry about your kidney petra :/

    The challenge of the 6 is faith, they want and have difficulties at the same time to believe that they can be and allow them to be powerfull in their life and trust their success without fear the next danger or to not be authentic, while 3s want and experiment difficulties to be genuine and follow authentic success. Wich is very different. This is the perpetual balance between the mental fixation and the holy idea. I must admit that I am myself chronically obsessed with success, but I think finally understood the difference between the 3 style who compulsively identify to potential success and the 6 style who compulsively worry about the potentials wrong aspects of success, and of life in general. Egotic 3s avoid the doubting behavior of the 6 by being more active while 6s avoid the laid back and going with the flow behavior of the 9 by being more doubting, wich very different I think.
    yeah it's very hard to see the difference

    i think i have doubt in who i am more than what i can do. i trust what i can do generally. i assume that i will be competent at whatever i try... i've never really been wrong about that. like choosing a career, i'm sure i can be good at whatever i choose. but will it be right? will i like it? will it fit me? will it reflect who i am? dunnooo

    Quote Originally Posted by Petra Pan View Post
    What I am saying here is what King-of-Despair realized in his own example while he was posting here, you can browse his posts, he was between 7,5,9,7,5,3,7 switching back and forth and I told him immediately he is a 3, because he vibes this way, months later he said he thought he is a 7 because he values some of seven's attitude so tried to take over that, but realized he is only 3, not a mix.
    i think i'm the opposite of king of despair... a 7 who wants to be a 3... wtf O_o;

    Quote Originally Posted by Takeru View Post
    I'm quite sure all the center types question their type a lot. The only reason why I settled with 9 was because my scores were scattered from 4-7 (who knows, maybe my true type is actually a 6.)
    yeah. i thought i was a 9 at first because i couldn't decide what type i was. but to be honest i really don't sound like a 9 at all either

  5. #55
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
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    think i'm the opposite of king of despair... a 7 who wants to be a 3... wtf O_o;
    7s dont do that! they are perfect as they are, so why wish to be something else?
    3s do it subconsciouslly..

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    lol!

    so on the bright side, i've marked off 1, 2, 4, 5, 8, and 9. those are not my types.

    my current hangup: i feel like i'm a 7w6 the majority of the time, in day-to-day operation. i'm practically an archetypal ENFP: i'm open, enthusiastic, warm, compassionate, happy, problem-solving, distractable, adaptable. i am an excellent planner, only happy if i have a new adventure coming up in the concrete future, and a little on the anxious side, especially socially. i read all this stuff about 3s being polished, driven, hard-working, ambitious, narcissistic... nah, i'm none of those things. i mean, i can work hard, but it's not all that often that i do. i try to be polished, always put decent clothes on makeup on, but i'm also an SP fail. plus i wish i was all of those things, but i guess i don't wish it hard enough for them to influence every single moment of my life. and my sins definitely lie more in the realm of deception in terms of lying to others to save face, as opposed to convincing myself i'm awesome. but then i have all those weird 3-ish hangups of really needing external approval. i mean, it's totally possible i'm just a 7 who was raised in environments that caused me to look for external approval.

    also there's this whole matter of liking to waste the day on the computer when i am not engaged in other things. see, i feel very lazy by my mom's ESxJ standards, i think, because of it... though i feel like i've always been doing things on the internets, drawing on art boards or making websites or participating in forums or... well yeah. this is why i'm not a 9, even though i can disappear away from the real world. i've always been a part of internet communities. sometimes they're better than IRL because you can be totally open on the internets and it's anonymous. i've also been into personality quizzes (what color are you?!) ever since i was really young, but i could never really decide what color i was, i liked all of them at different times, hah.

    i swear i'm a 7w3.

    i suppose my question is simply how do i reconcile my 7ness if i'm a 3, and how do i reconcile my 3ness if i'm a 7? unless i'm mistaking w6 for 3ness.

    oh and here are my deadly sins, i took a quiz lol:

    Gluttony: High
    Envy: High
    Sloth: High
    Pride: Medium
    Greed: Medium
    Lust: Medium
    Wrath: Low

    thanks to everyone who's (still) reading this

    and petra mostly for placing her kidney on the line

    geez what does all my whining say about my enneagram?! lol

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    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    oh and here are my deadly sins, i took a quiz lol:

    Gluttony: High
    Envy: High
    Sloth: High
    Pride: Medium
    Greed: Medium
    Lust: Medium
    Wrath: Low
    interesting, could you hook me up with a link to this quiz?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    interesting, could you hook me up with a link to this quiz?
    yeah! http://www.4degreez.com/misc/seven_deadly_sins.html

    tell me you don't love the hellfire and brimstone background.

    it seems like kind of a stupid quiz superficially, but i actually think it's pretty good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    yeah! http://www.4degreez.com/misc/seven_deadly_sins.html

    tell me you don't love the hellfire and brimstone background.

    it seems like kind of a stupid quiz superficially, but i actually think it's pretty good.
    Greed: Low
    Gluttony: Medium
    Wrath: Medium
    Sloth: High
    Envy: Low
    Lust: Low
    Pride: Medium

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    yeah sloth

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