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Thread: 7w8 or 8w7?

  1. #1
    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    Default 7w8 or 8w7?

    I realize I am one of these two. Problem is whenever I take an online test I tie with these very highly. I resonate a lot with eight internally but on the outside I would say 7 fits. I test as a 5 frequently (last time I took the test I got 5w6. I get 8 for superficial tests a lot) but seven and eight resonate more with me that 5w6 does when I read the description.

    So I'm here to ask people of each of those types to describe themselves. I have searched online and I can't place a difference between the two types and wings.
    ~luck favors the ready~


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  2. #2
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    what about 5w6 felt off to you? also, i don't think i've ever seen a non etj 8w7. sx/sp 7w8s might feel more like 8 type, but usually people forget to think about what they were like when they were younger from puberty to 20 or so to determine their first type. 8s have a more controlling presence. rely less than 7w8 on charisma and more on pure threat of force.

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    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    For what it's worth I am an sx/sp/so. I know that much. The description of anxiety and suspiciousness isn't really me. I don't have problems with those things and I can't relate to that. I should also mention that my results vary almost every time I take the enneagram test. Some combination of 5, 7 and 8. I know they are tied together. Does this denote a balance? Schizophrenia? (joke).
    ~luck favors the ready~


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    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Let me ask you this, babe: What were you like *naturally* as a child? Without all the hammering and buffeting you about. What are you like when you aren't under pressure or having to fight back?

    I thought I was a 2, though it never felt right. 3w2 would have been me if left to my own malignant devices (the con artist is still in there though I find it repulsive and only access it when I'm feeling mercenary and aggressive). I have a persona but am not obsessed with it. When I arrived at 4w3, it hit me between the eyes. I'm a moody little bastard. It all made sense. I suspect that my ENFJ friend, Taco, is a 3w4.

    Do you use your 8 muscle against the world? Are you like that in private when all is well? Do you feel more light-hearted when given the chance? Do you prefer gaining power, or being empowered?
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

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    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    I'm an 8w7 sx/sp who has 5 traits. As a child, no one ever bullied me or if they tried (male or female), they never did it again. Considering how tiny I am, it's pretty funny. If you can relate to this, you might be an 8w7. We're more serious than our 7w8 brethren.

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    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    Domino your post got me thinking. As a child I was distinctly 5. When I'm relaxed I'm a 5.

    So I started reading online about 5w6 wings (maybe I missed something). I came across counterphobic and phobic 6 wings and I believe I'm a 5w6 (counterphobic). This would make perfect sense as to why 8 makes so much sense to me and I identify with it so much and why I test as such on occasion.

    The last two paragraphs of the first main "page" says it perfectly.
    http://books.google.com/books?id=B7j...page&q&f=false

    case closed. Thanks guys.
    ~luck favors the ready~


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    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDP2525 View Post
    Domino your post got me thinking. As a child I was distinctly 5. When I'm relaxed I'm a 5.

    So I started reading online about 5w6 wings (maybe I missed something). I came across counterphobic and phobic 6 wings and I believe I'm a 5w6 (counterphobic). This would make perfect sense as to why 8 makes so much sense to me and I identify with it so much and why I test as such on occasion.

    The last two paragraphs of the first main "page" says it perfectly.
    http://books.google.com/books?id=B7j...page&q&f=false

    case closed. Thanks guys.
    Excellent news. Nice to get settled into better-fitting shoes, eh?

    That was an interesting read, btw. Very insightful. You attack your fears by confronting them. Aggressing the aggressor.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
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    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

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    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Domino View Post
    Excellent news. Nice to get settled into better-fitting shoes, eh?

    That was an interesting read, btw. Very insightful. You attack your fears by confronting them. Aggressing the aggressor.
    Yeah but then he'll start being afraid of himself, and turn schizophrenic and avoidant

    LOOK AT WHAT YOU VE DONE!
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    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

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    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDP2525 View Post
    I realize I am one of these two. Problem is whenever I take an online test I tie with these very highly. I resonate a lot with eight internally but on the outside I would say 7 fits. I test as a 5 frequently (last time I took the test I got 5w6. I get 8 for superficial tests a lot) but seven and eight resonate more with me that 5w6 does when I read the description.

    So I'm here to ask people of each of those types to describe themselves. I have searched online and I can't place a difference between the two types and wings.
    Look behind the label.
    It is not the thing.

  10. #10
    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    I have done more research and I believe I'm a counterphobic 6w5. It just makes more sense than any other enneagram. Eerily so.

    I never knew this counterphobic or phobic thing existed and most 6 descriptions do not describe 6 well at all. I had to search but what I did find was pretty amazing. Until I read up on it. I also don't think describing 6's as fear based is accurate to those who are sixes. I don't think of my life in terms of being driven by fear. Yet. Everything I've ever done in life was because I was afraid of doing it. That was the core point of it. I looked at it as a mastery of fear not being mastered by it. But I suppose if you are fighting against control it is controlling you nonetheless. Eh. Whatever. Here are some things which I identify with:


    People of enneatype Six are essentially insecure, as though life has never quite provided them with a proper footing, as though there existed nothing, either internally or externally, which could serve as a solid foundation. The type Six fixation is therefore deeply and fundamentally existential, and there exists at the core of enneatype Six a tight knot of anxiety, an essential disquietude, and a deep seated desire to find something or someone stable enough in which to place some trust. Given this essential dynamic, it is not surprising therefore to find that Sixes have core issues centering around the contrast between faith and scepticism, trust and distrust, and the legitimate exercise of authority versus the abuse and misuse of power. All Sixes share these core issues, but they respond to them in quite a wide variety of ways, making type Six the most variegated of all the enneatypes and the most difficult by far to describe with specificity.

    Sixes are essentially thinking types and tend to utilize their minds in their attempt to find a solid foundation. Sixes are looking for something in which to believe or someone in whom they can place their trust. At a level which barely reaches consciousness, Sixes feel that if they can find "one sure thing," they can quiet their restlessness, and achieve some semblance of much needed "peace of mind." This desire for some solidity, combined with their general suspiciousness, gives rise to a complicated relationship to those they view as authorities. The side of the Six which is looking for something to believe in, is often very susceptible to the temptation to turn authority over to an external source, whether it be in the form of an individual or a creed. But the Six's tendency towards distrust and suspicion works against any sort of faith in authority and often even presents as anti-authoritarianism. Thus, two opposite pulls exist side by side in the personality of enneatype Six, and will assume different proportions in different individuals, frequently alternating in the same individual.

    Some Sixes never find a system or an authority which satisfies their questioning nature. These tend to root themselves in more personal loyalties - loyalties to family, especially children, or to their friends or causes. Sixes, in general, tend to form strong personal bonds. One of the more appealing aspects of the type Six personality is the trueness they can show to those they love. Feeling essentially unsure themselves, they find some comfort in being true to others, in being steadfast. Sixes can show real perseverance when it comes to their personal relationships and they can give of themselves selflessly - without expectation of reward and with little need of special recognition. The loyalty of type Six is something of a two edged sword however, as Sixes are sometimes prone to stand by a friend, partner, job or cause long after it is time to move on.

    These various strategies of coping with the core issues of type Six are obviously quite different in their presentation, but they are all manifestations of the same underlying uncertainty and it is the intensity of the energy with which the Six confronts these issues which differentiates type Six from other types who, after all, also want to find something or someone in which to place their trust, something in which to believe. The issues which confront type Six, are then, in some fundamental respect, elemental concerns which confront all human beings. It is the fate of enneatype Six to be forced to address these issues most centrally. The integrity with which this is done, is determined by the extent to which the Six overcomes fear or succumbs to it.

    Many Sixes are naturally prone to doubt and self-questioning. In some Sixes, this internal dynamic is projected outwards, and Sixes are notorious for adopting the position of the "devil's advocate." Many Sixes are, thus, prone to questioning and challenging the motives and beliefs of those around them. Sometimes this strategy succeeds in forcing the Six's interlocutor to clarify his or her position or to seek common ground with the Six. Other times however, it only serves to turn the Six's interlocutor into an opponent who feels justified in responding aggressively to what they understandably perceive as an attack. Thus a pattern which is essentially defensive from the point of view of the Six, is often perceived as an assault by those on the receiving end. Sixes who adopt this approach are frequently perplexed by the amount of animosity they arouse. They are far harder on themselves, they reason, so they fail to understand why others are "over reacting." In general, Sixes tend to be very aware of the reactivity of others and considerably less so of their own. As they are being driven by their own inner uncertainty, they tend to be unaware that they are behaving in an aggressive fashion and alienating those whom they might well like to befriend.

    The doubting nature of type Six can be turned to good stead when the Six uses it to discover what is wrong or missing. Sixes rightly suspect that there is more going on in any given situation than what is presented on the surface, and they want to know what lies beneath. Sixes frequently have the capacity to detect what is hidden. They ferret out the potential danger in a situation; they intuitively seek the weakness in an argument or the flaws covered by the pleasing exterior. They often have an almost "sixth" sense in this regard. This means that Sixes are typically good trouble shooters, gifted debaters, or the stalwart players who form the defensive line. Sixes tend to feel that if they are aware of all the inherent dangers in a situation, they can arm themselves against them. Once again, this vigilance is essentially a defensive maneuver. On the down side, the tendency to look for problems can lead to unnecessary worrying, catastrophising or, in extreme cases, paranoid ideation. If this tendency to focus on what might go wrong is left unchecked, the Six will experience many needless hours of misery. In addition, others in the Six's life might well experience the Six as being unnecessarily negative.

    Sixes are attuned to power relations and to underlying power dynamics. They sense who has power, who wants it, who will use it, who will misuse it, and they are often the ones who sense an imbalance or injustice where others simply see the status quo. As they easily tend to feel like victims themselves, they often identify with the underdog and can even devote themselves to the cause of redressing what they see as injuries done to those without power. These Sixes are, perhaps, union organizers, or feminists, or perhaps even those who defend the rights of the unborn, as, like all the types, Sixes can be found on all ends of the political spectrum. It is not so much that all Sixes are politically motivated, but, as Sixes do tend to be oriented to power dynamics, they often take decisive positions when it comes to social issues or causes.

    Sixes are quite sensitive as children and can be seriously wounded by abuses of power visited against them by their parents or teachers. As power abuse against children is almost universal, it is the rare Six who isn't forced to confront core issues head on at a very vulnerable age. Something of the unfairly punishing authority tends to stay with Sixes long after they have moved into adulthood and serves to color all of their subsequent intimate relationships, especially those in which there is a perceived imbalance of power which disfavors the Six.

    It is typically at a quite young age then, in response to the illegitimate or insensitive exercise of authority, that Sixes adopt their fundamental strategy for dealing with their underlying anxieties and for handling imbalanced power relationships. Some Sixes adopt a basically phobic approach. Phobic Sixes are generally compliant, affiliative and cooperative. They strive to avoid undue attention and to defuse tension by appearing to be "harmless." They thereby strive to avoid triggering aggression in others. Other Sixes adopt the opposite strategy of dealing with anxieties and become counterphobic, essentially taking a defiant stand against whomever or whatever they find threatening. This is the Six who takes on authority or who adopts a dare devil attitude towards physical danger. Counterphobic Sixes can be aggressive, and frequently adopt a rebellious or anti-authoritarian demeanor. Such Sixes are often unaware of the fear which motivates their actions. For counterphobic Sixes, the inner tension of living with their anxiety is greater than the fear of any external threat they might be facing, so they adopt an oppositional attitude and throw themselves into action. This approach sometimes succeeds in obscuring from the counterphobic Six's line of vision the fear which is actually at the root of their behavior. Consequently, counterphobic Sixes frequently deny being anxious. Interestingly, some phobic Sixes are also unaware of their underlying anxiety, an anxiety which is often readily apparent to others. Because anxiety serves as the backdrop to all their emotional states, some Sixes are unaware of its existence, as they have nothing with which to contrast it.


    Sixes with the Five wing generally tend more towards introversion than do those with a Seven wing. They characteristically withdraw under stress and typically have a few trusted friends to whom they can turn in times of trouble. They are often drawn to systems of thought, whether religious, political or philosophical which help them explain their experiences and which provide them with a framework which confers on them some semblance of control and prediction.
    ~luck favors the ready~


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