User Tag List

12 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 17

  1. #1
    Ruler of the Stars Asterion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5 sp/sx
    Posts
    2,334

    Default Enneagram and Spirituality

    ...the spiritual agenda is paramount, which is this conversion process. Whether we know it or not, we're all transforming, because we're hungry for the opposite of our vice. Even if we don't know about our vice, we suffer from lack of its opposite tendency. --Helen Palmer, of the Oral Tradition
    It's weird that people see the enneagram as a spiritual thing. It doesn't seem very spiritual, but I can understand that people could attribute psychological growth to 'spiritual' growth... but what is it that ties the two together?
    5 3 9

  2. #2
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,204

    Default

    well i think the spiritual in enneagram context means nothing more than growing, and becoming more yourself.

    btw. do you have palmer's book? is it good?

  3. #3
    Ruler of the Stars Asterion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5 sp/sx
    Posts
    2,334

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chloee View Post
    well i think the spiritual in enneagram context means nothing more than growing, and becoming more yourself.

    btw. do you have palmer's book? is it good?
    Unfortunatly not, I might look for it though

    It might be because of it's multiple connections to religion, some link it to The Tree Of Life (Kabbalah), the Christian Nine Fruits of the Spirit +others that I can't be bothered finding...

    Spirituality does seem to include introspection and contemplation. I wonder if MBTI has the same kind of connection? Maybe it's just more modern?
    5 3 9

  4. #4
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,204

    Default

    so do you mind the spiritual look at enneagram?? i mean, if you're kind of repulsed by it..

    btw. yeah i've read palmer is the best in the field... (and also one of first who started separating enneagram from MBTI)
    maybe i'll order her book:/

  5. #5
    Ruler of the Stars Asterion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5 sp/sx
    Posts
    2,334

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chloee View Post
    so do you mind the spiritual look at enneagram?? i mean, if you're kind of repulsed by it..

    btw. yeah i've read palmer is the best in the field... maybe i'll order her book:/
    I'd have to take a minimum 2 hour bus trip to get it lol, which I'm gonna do soon anyway thankfully.

    Spirituality is usually irrational, and it has a connection to religion, which I see as a means of controling people (which it mostly isn't), which repulses me.
    5 3 9

  6. #6
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,204

    Default

    yeah, exactly my case. except for some weird reason i'm not repulsed by it in enneagram, i guess because i didnt see yet connection to religion or anything irrational.. if i ran into some religious gibberish in enneagram i'll just avoid that author...

  7. #7
    Senior Member compulsiverambler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/so
    Posts
    446

    Default

    The Enneagram has been combined with non-denominational spiritual beliefs by some of its most prominent authors and teachers. Personally, I tend to take the advice and information that is put in to a spiritual context, and reframe it into psychology. Even the mindfulness advice, which I love and think is the most valuable thing, I don't see as necessarily involving anything that can't be easily explained by current scientific knowledge, like souls or gods. I'm just trying to make my brain work more to my advantage. If the authors and Buddhists etc. who talk about mindfulness see it as getting more in touch with God, or with their soul, or whatever, I don't really care, as long as what they're doing works and they're experienced and skilled enough with it to show others how it's done.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Gerbah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Enneagram
    5w4
    Posts
    433

    Default

    I think in the context of the Enneagram specifically, the spiritual aspect of it isn't to do with any religion in the sense of a particular system of structuring life that you believe is prescribed by God. According to what I've read, it's more about using the Enneagram to open your eyes to reality. When you apply it to yourself, then this is to do with getting to know the reality of yourself. Then there is the reality beyond your own personality.

    The authors I've read on the topic are Sandra Maitri and A.H. Almaas. They say that the personality isn't the ultimate truth of who you are because personality is basically just the way your ego consciousness is constructed. So it's a set of mental ideas and images that you've identified with as who you are, although lots of them are false or inaccurate because they're outdated or mistaken, so how can some inaccurate ideas really have existence. For them, there is the Enneagram that points to the nine basic worldviews that shape the psychological personality (and its suffering), but there is another layer which is the nine aspects of your true being beyond personality.

    These other nine aspects are commonly shared by many religions and belief systems as aspects of the nature of God, which is I think why you can find different religions using the Enneagram in their teachings.

    If you're interested, you can find videos of Maitri and Almaas speaking about spirituality and the Enneagram on YouTube.

  9. #9
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by King-Of-Despair View Post
    ... I can understand that people could attribute psychological growth to 'spiritual' growth... but what is it that ties the two together?


    That is an odd question to me; my entire spirituality in life has always been intertwined with psychological growth, so I did not realize others might not see it that way. It's all about becoming more who you are (self-actualization) and having the healthiest and most productive interactions with other people (behavior) in order for everyone to be most fulfilled. Jung was a good mesh of spirituality and psychology himself.

    The Enneagram directions of (dis)integration seem to be very much a spiritual journey, in terms of self-improvement and the process of personal and interpersonal actualization.

    Even the diagram itself is Sufi in origin, isn't it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chloee View Post
    btw. yeah i've read palmer is the best in the field... (and also one of first who started separating enneagram from MBTI)
    maybe i'll order her book:/
    Meh. I dislike Palmer.

    I always recommend Riso and Hudson, from a systematic viewpoint. They have the most "coherent" vision of the Ennegram. Palmer seems to be partly cobbled together by hearsay and astrological-style commentary. But with their background Catholicism, you're going to see spirituality and psychology intertwined.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #10
    Senior Member Gerbah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Enneagram
    5w4
    Posts
    433

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Even the diagram itself is Sufi in origin, isn't it?
    Sufism is similar in that it is more about inner, individual work rather than Islam as such. There was a famous Christian Sufi, I don't know the name, who made it clear she (I think she) was both Christian and a Sufi. My husband was talking about it the other day. As long as you see an inherent unity and order in all things and that you as an indvidual are not the centre of the universe, you can make use of the spiritual Enneagram.

Similar Threads

  1. [Enne] The Enneagram and Spiritual Growth
    By Mal12345 in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-16-2014, 12:04 PM
  2. Replies: 125
    Last Post: 01-23-2013, 09:13 PM
  3. MBTI, enneagram and self improvement
    By Ilah in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 08-12-2008, 10:45 AM
  4. mbti, enneagram and self-change
    By sleepless in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-03-2008, 09:37 AM
  5. Enneagram and Hormones
    By Metamorphosis in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 02-01-2008, 03:52 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO