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Poll: What Personality Type is Pope Francis, the Laughing Pope?

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  1. #11
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephano View Post
    Pope Francis isn't almighty and powerful, he's like Obama trying to pass gun laws. If it all is just made up why is half of the church going against him right now. They're not professionally trained actors, at least that's nothing I ever heard of. Addressing the problem , talking about it, is yet probably the most advanced step the church has taken IMO, since the conventional way was sweeping it under the carpet.
    Pope Francis is the last absolute Monarch. I don't know how many priests who have boasted to me, and somewhat threatened me, by saying The Church is not a democracy.

    Pope Francis violates the human rights of women and children, bans contraception and abortion, and exercises power in the world as Head of State. And made Head of State by the Italian Fascists.

    The Pope was made Head of State by the Italian Fascists because the Papacy publicly and in writing enthusiastically supported Fascism in Europe from Spain to Croatia.

  2. #12
    Senior Member BlackDog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Pope Francis is the last absolute Monarch. I don't know how many priests who have boasted to me, and somewhat threatened me, by saying The Church is not a democracy.

    Pope Francis violates the human rights of women and children, bans contraception, and exercises power in the world as Head of State. And made Head of State by the Italian Fascists.

    The Pope was made Head of State by the Italian Fascists because the Papacy publicly and in writing enthusiastically supported Fascism in Europe from Spain to Croatia.
    Abdullah of Saudi Arabia?

    Francis is out of step with the morals of modern liberal societies, but he is by no means someone who we should spend time on criticizing. The RCC hates change; the fact that Francis has done anything at all is fairly amazing.
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  3. #13
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    His belief is rooted in a book written by heavily misinformed and largely ignorant people thousands of years ago. Sex has no purpose, unless you think nature was designed and evolution is being directed by someone who can endow their processes with purpose. Yes, sex is the act by which we (usually) reproduce, but it is much more than that.

    You have to admit, though, that is somewhat absurd that Francis receives praise for being almost as morally enlightened as the average civilized (wo)man.
    If we are talking about the same definition of evolution here namely the way Darwin understood it, you have to explain to me what you mean by saying sex is more than just our way of reproduction. Do you mean it has an emotional or even spiritual significance? Because sex is the only way humanity and of course all other multicellular organisms can obtain the survival of their species. Indeed sex produces the most intense and awesome feeling in the world (after love IMO) but after all these pleasures are just a chemical process which developed for only one reason: That we fuck each other.
    Now, yes Pope Francis has a conservative approach on sex, but overall his election to pope was an improvement for the church. He's a moderate christian out of a bunch of intellectual rednecks and I'm saying this as a moderate right-wing anti-theist.
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  4. #14
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LION4!5 View Post
    Abdullah of Saudi Arabia?

    Francis is out of step with the morals of modern liberal societies, but he is by no means someone who we should spend time on criticizing. The RCC hates change; the fact that Francis has done anything at all is fairly amazing.
    Exactly. There are much more countries on the list including Burma and most recently Russia.
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  5. #15
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephano View Post
    If we are talking about the same definition of evolution here namely the way Darwin understood it, you have to explain to me what you mean by saying sex is more than just our way of reproduction. Do you mean it has an emotional or even spiritual significance? Because sex is the only way humanity and of course all other multicellular organisms can obtain the survival of their species. Indeed sex produces the most intense and awesome feeling in the world (after love IMO) but after all these pleasures are just a chemical process which developed for only one reason: That we fuck each other.
    Bonobos use sex not only for reproduction but also to strengthen group cohesion, relieve stress and as a fun activity. One point is that sex, like walking, dancing, seeing, smelling, is more than the tool used for the most basic biological task of survival. The other point is that purpose requires creational intent, which, as an anti-theist you will agree, is lacking in nature.

  6. #16
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Bonobos use sex not only for reproduction but also to strengthen group cohesion, relieve stress and as a fun activity. One point is that sex, like walking, dancing, seeing, smelling, is more than the tool used for the most basic biological task of survival. The other point is that purpose requires creational intent, which, as an anti-theist you will agree, is lacking in nature.
    I wouldn't say that. The purpose of our eyes is that we can see light reflexions, ergo an image of the world around us. I don't understand the term purpose as something with a creational intent but as the result of the complex set of laws of nature that we yet have to fully understand. So, when early forms of life developed photo receptors this wasn't done by creational intent but by adaption to the environment which can be called intentional, conceivably.
    However, the reason sex even came into being was because of the benefits genetical variety provides. The positive side effects you named are an additional reason or spur for complex beings like us to do it as often as we can. Very intelligent animals like primates or dolphins do it also for their own pleasure (like you said) and without an intent to reproduce, but that's just us getting ahead of our instincts and controlling the unconscious part of our brain more and more.
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  7. #17
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephano View Post
    I don't understand the term purpose as something with a creational intent but as the result of the complex set of laws of nature that we yet have to fully understand.
    Then what does it matter what purpose sex has? And why would someone who believes in a creator care?

  8. #18
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Then what does it matter what purpose sex has? And why would someone who believes in a creator care?
    Because he isn't a creationist, he's a theologist who interprets the bible figuratively. "The theories of evolution and the Big Bang are real and God is not a magician with a magic"Link

    I would even say he has agnostic tendencies just like the average European citizen. Maybe that's why he's so popular, because he is representing said average European citizens so well.
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  9. #19
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephano View Post
    Because he isn't a creationist, he's a theologist who interprets the bible figuratively. "The theories of evolution and the Big Bang are real and God is not a magician with a magic"Link
    He is not a creationist, but he does believe in a creator god. He would have a hard time being the pope if he did not, at least in public.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephano View Post
    I would even say he has agnostic tendencies just like the average European citizen. Maybe that's why he's so popular, because he is representing said average European citizens so well.
    I think that is what his ministry for propaganda would like us to believe. Look at disparity between the title of the article you linked and what it actually says, for instance: "He created human beings and let them develop according to the internal laws that he gave to each one so they would reach their fulfilment. [...] The Big Bang, which today we hold to be the origin of the world, does not contradict the intervention of the divine creator but, rather, requires it." He is not that different. He is just more casual about it.

    Going back to the initial point, his opposition to homosexual sex being rooted in a certain understanding of the purpose of sex per se, it would make sense for him to oppose it if there were a creator god who had designed and designated it so, but obviously there is not, so his belief is wrong under the premise he himself would accept and irrelevant to his argument under yours.

  10. #20
    literally your mother PocketFullOf's Avatar
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