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  1. #131
    Male johnnyyukon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Yeah, I did -- although since i was at work, I did some Googling just to get the wording right on a few items.

    Since they've introduced the Vergers early on, I wonder if we'll see Francis Dolarhyde before Season 4.
    I didn't even make that connection. I only saw the movie with the Vergers (Hannibal?) And I only remember that one of the vergers cut his own face off at hannibal's request and was a parapalegic and pedophile? And fed people/bodies to hogs. I don't remember much else.

    I had no idea what the tear drop martini was, or who the lady was with the broken arm, or who did that (episode said her brother), or who the lady the tear drop was collected from was (was it the lady with the broken arm?). I think I was dipping my pizza in ranch during that scene.
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  2. #132
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyyukon View Post
    I didn't even make that connection. I only saw the movie with the Vergers (Hannibal?) And I only remember that one of the vergers cut his own face off at hannibal's request and was a parapalegic and pedophile? And fed people/bodies to hogs. I don't remember much else.

    I had no idea what the tear drop martini was, or who the lady was with the broken arm, or who did that (episode said her brother), or who the lady the tear drop was collected from was (was it the lady with the broken arm?). I think I was dipping my pizza in ranch during that scene.
    I actually got confused during that sequence -- my streaming vid quality wasn't good to start with during that segment, and I had no idea what was going on or who those people were. I figured her out when Lecter was talking to her in his office, in standard face shots.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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  3. #133
    Ginkgo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riva View Post
    I was a bit bored watching the last episode. That was a hannibal first.

    But i am okay with it. In any good series that has to be expected.

    However when watching the trailer i had high hopes. It was completely misleading. The convo between crawford and will shown in the trailer was completely misleading. They had us thinking they were talking about hannibal about trapping him.
    I'm starting to feel like the less focus there is on Lector's murders, the more the viewer is expected to build resentment for his deception and current involvement with Bloom. Without the tension of conflict between what the main characters represent, my interest level deflates. Furthermore, the more antagonists they introduce who possess similar inclinations as Lector, the more the (already slim) amount of realism crumbles. Basically, the significance of the original narrative fades and we're left with a full-fledged freakshow with a paradoxically small about of vibrancy.

    I mean, I'll continue watching, but the preview of the next episode seems kind of cheesy and excessive.

    /plagueofgripes

  4. #134
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    need to start watching, but I'm going to guess that Hannibal Lechter is an INTJ 8w7 Sp/Sx going into it
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  5. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    need to start watching, but I'm going to guess that Hannibal Lechter is an INTJ 8w7 Sp/Sx going into it
    Something like that.

    I know @simulatedworld said that Will Graham was an INFP, but while I get where Graham comes from, I'm seeing him more as an INFJ ph 6w5.

  6. #136
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    ehhh.... How often do INFJ's code as 6w5? Just curious.

    I'm more apt to see him as INP w/ Ni skillz, if we want to MBTI him. I just don't see him as J, and clearly not in the sense Hannibal is.

    .....

    anyway, back to the show itself: Friday's episode was kind of ... different. I keep wondering what crazy things they'll introduce, that's been one of the odder ones.

    I do like that Will and Lecter keep dancing around each other and sometimes mirroring each other's moves. Now they're "even steven" in Will's words. Hmmm....

    Also not sure what Margo Verger wants exactly with him. At the moment, just comparing notes, but later....? And where is Alana?
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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  7. #137
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riva View Post
    I thought,

    Hannibal - intj 5w6 sx/sp (pretending to be a sp/so)
    Graham - infj (he has little or no fi)
    Jack crawford - entj
    Chilton - e3 (not sure about the mbti type)

    Gideon - entp? (It's funny to even look at him)

    Will is incredibly Fi and that's why he has so much trouble dealing with everything that's happening to him. He has to slowly reconstruct his ethical perspective, which is waaaaay harder for an INFP than it would be for an INFJ.

    Hannibal's therapist (Gillian Anderson) is an INFJ.

    Crawford seems more ESTJ to me but that could go either way.

    Chilton and Gideon actually both seem ENTPish.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    Something like that.

    I know @simulatedworld said that Will Graham was an INFP, but while I get where Graham comes from, I'm seeing him more as an INFJ ph 6w5.
    I know I initially mistyped you as INFJ, but I have a pretty high level of certainty on Will Graham as an INFP. The only reason he can't bring himself to kill Hannibal in the name of Goodness (which just about every ethical bone in his body is telling him to do) is that he's starting to realize Hannibal is the only one that can help him understand his own dark side, and he desperately needs someone to relate to in that regard.

    Also I imagine you guys are probably looking at the scenes where he reconstructs the method and purpose of Hannibal's murders by envisioning them himself as obvious evidence of Ni, but imho this is actually just Si.

    People did the same thing with Dexter's preoccupation with blood (in fact Dexter is ISTJ, not INTJ or INFJ or INTP or whatever people--myself included--said at the time), and I've seen the same "oh he must be Ni because symbolism" mistake made with Kurt Cobain (another clear INFP) because of his weird abstract lyrics about the symbolism of various body functions and so on--basically because people don't understand weird private FiSi stuff very well. (Hint: Ni doesn't have a monopoly on symbolism; it's kind of just a more cerebral/abstract and less physical/guttural version of Si.)
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  8. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    ehhh.... How often do INFJ's code as 6w5? Just curious.

    I'm more apt to see him as INP w/ Ni skillz, if we want to MBTI him. I just don't see him as J, and clearly not in the sense Hannibal is.


    (Made by BlackCat. Take it with a grain of salt, if you wish. However, in theory, I don't think it's hard to grasp how Ni may play a part in inducing the same kind of anxieties 6's must cope with. How the other functions of an INFJ, in particular, converge with 6 tendencies seems more open to interpretation.)

    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Will is incredibly Fi and that's why he has so much trouble dealing with everything that's happening to him. He has to slowly reconstruct his ethical perspective, which is waaaaay harder for an INFP than it would be for an INFJ.

    Hannibal's therapist (Gillian Anderson) is an INFJ.

    Crawford seems more ESTJ to me but that could go either way.

    Chilton and Gideon actually both seem ENTPish.




    I know I initially mistyped you as INFJ, but I have a pretty high level of certainty on Will Graham as an INFP. The only reason he can't bring himself to kill Hannibal in the name of Goodness (which just about every ethical bone in his body is telling him to do) is that he's starting to realize Hannibal is the only one that can help him understand his own dark side, and he desperately needs someone to relate to in that regard.

    Also I imagine you guys are probably looking at the scenes where he reconstructs the method and purpose of Hannibal's murders by envisioning them himself as obvious evidence of Ni, but imho this is actually just Si.

    People did the same thing with Dexter's preoccupation with blood (in fact Dexter is ISTJ, not INTJ or INFJ or INTP or whatever people--myself included--said at the time), and I've seen the same "oh he must be Ni because symbolism" mistake made with Kurt Cobain (another clear INFP) because of his weird abstract lyrics about the symbolism of various body functions and so on--basically because people don't understand weird private FiSi stuff very well. (Hint: Ni doesn't have a monopoly on symbolism; it's kind of just a more cerebral/abstract and less physical/guttural version of Si.)
    Yes, I recognize that Si often functions as a repository for symbolic information.

    And while I think Will frequently makes decisions as an INFP would, he suffers from so much dissociation (off and on the job) that it's hard for him not to look like a Pi dom. Sure, he searches for himself as an INFP would, but I think the typical INFP has the puzzling tendency to simultaneously show a robust sense of self. Or at least attempt to, in whatever fashion they see as most fitting, sometimes regardless of how truthful it is. But the most I see of that in Will is by way of his principles. Principles I could see as byproducts of Ti.

    We also see Will drawing conclusions with very little information on hand (even when he's not in his "zone"). Are we to say his offhand insights stem from Si as well? His years of education and training?

    In any case, I interpreted Will's hesitation to kill Hannibal not just being motivated by his desire to understand himself, but also to apprehend Hannibal in the most honorable way possible. Do you still see INFPs as that self serving, that they would let a killer go just for the sake of personal introspection?

  9. #139
    Riva
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Will is incredibly Fi and that's why he has so much trouble dealing with everything that's happening to him. He has to slowly reconstruct his ethical perspective, which is waaaaay harder for an INFP than it would be for an INFJ.

    Hannibal's therapist (Gillian Anderson) is an INFJ.

    Crawford seems more ESTJ to me but that could go either way.

    Chilton and Gideon actually both seem ENTPish.




    I know I initially mistyped you as INFJ, but I have a pretty high level of certainty on Will Graham as an INFP. The only reason he can't bring himself to kill Hannibal in the name of Goodness (which just about every ethical bone in his body is telling him to do) is that he's starting to realize Hannibal is the only one that can help him understand his own dark side, and he desperately needs someone to relate to in that regard.

    Also I imagine you guys are probably looking at the scenes where he reconstructs the method and purpose of Hannibal's murders by envisioning them himself as obvious evidence of Ni, but imho this is actually just Si.

    People did the same thing with Dexter's preoccupation with blood (in fact Dexter is ISTJ, not INTJ or INFJ or INTP or whatever people--myself included--said at the time), and I've seen the same "oh he must be Ni because symbolism" mistake made with Kurt Cobain (another clear INFP) because of his weird abstract lyrics about the symbolism of various body functions and so on--basically because people don't understand weird private FiSi stuff very well. (Hint: Ni doesn't have a monopoly on symbolism; it's kind of just a more cerebral/abstract and less physical/guttural version of Si.)
    Well the reaeon why i don't think he is a infp is because he lacks fi. And ginkgo seem to agree that he is a infj too (his being an infp coukd probably relate if he is indeed an infp).

    It's not inly hard for fi doms to reconstruct their ethical perspectives. Others would find it hard too, especially if it's such a drastic shift. Ethics aren't limited to fi users and fe users aren't fickle with their ethics either though fe loathing fi advocates would like to think so.

    I would't say that is the only reason he can't bring himself to kill hannibal. That was a bold assumption to support your claims .

    Brb work.....

    Edit -

    Taking your own point of why will not killing hannibal (look above) sounds quite anti fi. He needs to prolong what he 'has' to do because the person he 'has' to kill is the only one who could help him and he 'would' prolong the matter until he gets what he wants doesn't sound very fi does it?

    I wouldn't say it sounds fe either but fe could take a breather and adapt until the right circumstances are available to take action. Actually Je would. Not just Fe.

    There is a dexter thread. I would like to see your arguments taken there. Most people think dexter is a istj because.of his code.

    However i must confess that envisioning the scenarios is the second reason i assumed ni.

  10. #140
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riva View Post
    Well the reaeon why i don't think he is a infp is because he lacks fi. And ginkgo seem to agree that he is a infj too (his being an infp coukd probably relate if he is indeed an infp).

    It's not inly hard for fi doms to reconstruct their ethical perspectives. Others would find it hard too, especially if it's such a drastic shift. Ethics aren't limited to fi users and fe users aren't fickle with their ethics either though fe loathing fi advocates would like to think so.

    I would't say that is the only reason he can't bring himself to kill hannibal. That was a bold assumption to support your claims .

    Brb work.....

    Edit -

    Taking your own point of why will not killing hannibal (look above) sounds quite anti fi. He needs to prolong what he 'has' to do because the person he 'has' to kill is the only one who could help him and he 'would' prolong the matter until he gets what he wants doesn't sound very fi does it?

    I wouldn't say it sounds fe either but fe could take a breather and adapt until the right circumstances are available to take action. Actually Je would. Not just Fe.

    There is a dexter thread. I would like to see your arguments taken there. Most people think dexter is a istj because.of his code.

    However i must confess that envisioning the scenarios is the second reason i assumed ni.
    None of this appears to refute anything I've said except by means of meaningless simple contradiction. I am not at all convinced you understand what you are talking about function-wise.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

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