User Tag List

12 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 13

  1. #1
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,488

    Default Entertainers and the Benefit of the Doubt

    I don't want to dislike these people, but they gave me no choice. By law, they're not guilty of anything (so far) but I know I've had lower opinions of people who I suspected to do low and perfectly legal things.

    Michael Jackson
    Woody Allen
    Bill Cosby

  2. #2
    Entertaining Cracker five sounds's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    729 sx/sp
    Socionics
    IEE Ne
    Posts
    5,634

    Default

    i think it's good to keep perspective on celebrities as human. people idolize artists and entertainers for what they contribute, but i think the kind of freedom that comes with the public's wildly blind approval can give people a feeling of license to do whatever they want.

    there are tons of unfamous people who contribute so much good to the world, and are held to a higher moral standard only because they don't have celebrity.

    also, the flip side, entertainers who are thrown into the fire by the public (think lindsay lohan) because of of their wayward wandering get that kind of attention disproportionately as well. i don't entirely blame famous people for having more messed up patterns of behavior because i really believe they live in some weird bubble so far removed from reality that it actually is much more difficult to remain grounded and feel accountable for their actions. they should still be held accountable to the law, and the degree to which they're not just makes that bubble's membrane stronger and stronger.

    it's a messed up existence to be famous, and i really don't think it's good for the average person.
    You hem me in -- behind and before;
    you have laid your hand upon me.
    Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
    too lofty for me to attain.

  3. #3
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    9w1 sx/so
    Posts
    18,086

    Default

    agreed nic.

    What did bill Cosby do? And I don't know if I buy the woody Allen thing. Mia may be full of shit. And if so omg what an awful human being to do that to him and to their daughter.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  4. #4
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,488

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    agreed nic.

    What did bill Cosby do? And I don't know if I buy the woody Allen thing. Mia may be full of shit. And if so omg what an awful human being to do that to him and to their daughter.
    There's a link to an article on his name in the OP. LadyX, judge as you like. I guess I just think there's something very wrong with how we view celebrities, they have so much power and are given so much license to people who by profession deal in presenting an image of themselves. I guess I'm opting out of the Cult of Celebrity, and looking at them as people. People with the power to get away with a lot, and who often do get away with a lot

    My first instinct on watching Manhattan was that Woody was skeezy, with the 16 year old Muriel Hemmingway as a love interest and how the relationship and her character was portrayed. His other works brought me around and my blinders went on to his personal activities. I think with a lot of art, this doesn't matter as much, it should be judged on its own accord, but in the case of Celebrity part of the art is their image. I starting to feel this is very wrong.

    As @five sounds mentioned there is also the opposite effect, where we judge celebs harshly. It seems that as soon as you're on TV, you are put to a different set of standards altogether. All these young train wrecks can't have their teenage spaz outs in their privacy, no kid should live their lives on national news, even *if* they want to.

    My first awareness of this was back when Chelsea Clinton had the only claim to fame as being the President's teenage daughter. All of a sudden this gave the world license to judge her as people feel free to judge anybody in the news. Not only did this seem wrong, the standards were completely different. So many people called her ugly, when A) she was a perfectly cute girl by all normal measures and B) WTF does that matter??.

    The people of the world who aren't scrambling to eat and find a roof to live under, keep this celebrity universe in shrines in their homes on glowing screens put on pedestals. I'm not saying that the entertainment industry doesn't have anything valuable to offer, but I think it and its idols need to be viewed in a more reasonable context.

  5. #5
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    9w1 sx/so
    Posts
    18,086

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    There's a link to an article on his name in the OP. LadyX, judge as you like. I guess I just think there's something very wrong with how we view celebrities, they have so much power and are given so much license to people who by profession deal in presenting an image of themselves. I guess I'm opting out of the Cult of Celebrity, and looking at them as people. People with the power to get away with a lot, and who often do get away with a lot

    My first instinct on watching Manhattan was that Woody was skeezy, with the 16 year old Muriel Hemmingway as a love interest and how the relationship and her character was portrayed. His other works brought me around and my blinders went on to his personal activities. I think with a lot of art, this doesn't matter as much, it should be judged on its own accord, but in the case of Celebrity part of the art is their image. I starting to feel this is very wrong.

    As @five sounds mentioned there is also the opposite effect, where we judge celebs harshly. It seems that as soon as you're on TV, you are put to a different set of standards altogether. All these young train wrecks can't have their teenage spaz outs in their privacy, no kid should live their lives on national news, even *if* they want to.

    My first awareness of this was back when Chelsea Clinton had the only claim to fame as being the President's teenage daughter. All of a sudden this gave the world license to judge her as people feel free to judge anybody in the news. Not only did this seem wrong, the standards were completely different. So many people called her ugly, when A) she was a perfectly cute girl by all normal measures and B) WTF does that matter??.

    The people of the world who aren't scrambling to eat and find a roof to live under, keep this celebrity universe in shrines in their homes on glowing screens put on pedestals. I'm not saying that the entertainment industry doesn't have anything valuable to offer, but I think it and its idols need to be viewed in a more reasonable context.
    oh i completely agree. i just don't have whatever piece that is that makes me glorify the celebrity or view them as different. i know it's all made up bs. i get that all it is is having a sense of "knowing and being familiar with" people you don't actually know...which in itself is weird ish but i don't treat them differently or see them differently...except for the odd feeling of knowing who they are without them knowing me.

    but yeah i think they're should be laws against the paparazzi stalking them and taking pics. i think they ought to be allowed to walk around without getting hounded. no one should have to live like that...and it's kinda sick to want it or contribute to it imo.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  6. #6
    libtard SJW chickpea's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    4,960

    Default

    I figure as long as I'm pirating their material and not paying to see it, it's okay to enjoy their work regardless. Like I watched Blue Jasmine and liked it, but I wouldn't have seen it in a theater and I was looking for fucked up elements of his character that sneak in. Like that movie he made with Larry David was pretty creepy and gross.

    I guess I did pay to see R. Kelly trapped in the closet at a movie theater, and it was so worth it I still love him even though I know I shouldn't.

  7. #7
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    9w1 sx/so
    Posts
    18,086

    Default

    just read the bill cosby thing yah i had no idea about any of that but i can't say i'm terribly surprised. he seems like a narcissistic pervy type to me.

    and the thing about woody may be true always kind of thought it was until just reading some things last week and wondering if it was actually possible that mia is just completely screwed up.

    but...marrying your gfs daughter doesn't seem like a viable option to most normal minded folks so it certainly makes it easier to believe....but...just yuck! your daughter?? a tiny lil girl...i mean how is it possible that ever happens?? i don't want to believe it.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  8. #8
    Stansmith
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by chana View Post
    I figure as long as I'm pirating their material and not paying to see it, it's okay to enjoy their work regardless. Like I watched Blue Jasmine and liked it, but I wouldn't have seen it in a theater and I was looking for fucked up elements of his character that sneak in. Like that movie he made with Larry David was pretty creepy and gross.
    I think his character in Manhattan dates a 17 year old...

  9. #9
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,488

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stansmith View Post
    I think he dates a 17 year old in 'Manhattan'...
    He doesn't just date, he has an adult/mature/sophisticated sexual relationship with her. I read Lolita, which has a much more dire situation and I found great value in it. What I found disturbing is that Muriel Hemmingway's character was one dimensional, and not even a hint of the age she was portraying, or anything more than a superficial examination of such a relationship was part of her characterization. She seemed like a justification, a wish fulfillment. This was my read on it before I was aware of Allen's history.

  10. #10
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    MBTI
    yupp
    Posts
    29,781

    Default

    Here's what happens, people have always needed someone to blame for the state of the world. Humans are rarely happy with how the world is, they're always finding a reason why society is crashing. and I'm not saying it's not, but with people constantly in the public eye it allows them to blame someone else for the world's decline, without accepting the responibility they played. Like you can hate a celebrity, that's fine celebrities are just people, but by giving them attention, even negative attention it keeps them in the public eye. If you were to ignore the bullshit certain celebrities do they'd probably quit doing those things. especially the ones seeking attention, unless you know they're very very very sick and aren't doing it for attention, but I think most actors and actresses have borderline,histronic traits. I'm not condoning the behaviors, just that I ignore celebrity culture because a.)I don't care and b.)putting people no matter how rich or how famous is a recipe for disaster
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

Similar Threads

  1. Is having a tendency to give someone the benefit of the doubt associated with F?
    By /DG/ in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 11-04-2015, 10:23 PM
  2. critique and the evolution of entertainment
    By WALMART in forum Arts & Entertainment
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 09-22-2012, 07:17 AM
  3. Replies: 8
    Last Post: 11-14-2010, 04:52 PM
  4. [MBTItm] The Costs and Benefits of Thinking and Non-thinking
    By Provoker in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-14-2009, 09:48 PM
  5. [MBTItm] NFs, do you get tired of giving people "the benefit of the doubt"?
    By chatoyer in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: 07-30-2009, 05:57 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO