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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    Dude, I obviously offended you. .
    If you knew me you'd know that this is far from the case.


    As for the first video "HTFU".

    You say it sounds cultish and the fact is the creators made it that way to illustrate SATIRE.

    Do you know who those people in the video are?

    They're game developers, Nerds. They're the game developers for the MMO, Eve Online.

    I will let you connect the dots on your own from there.

  2. #32
    Senior Member durentu's Avatar
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    high time preference - it speaks to their impulsivity
    "People often say that this or that person has not yet found himself. But the self is not something one finds; it is something one creates." - Thomas Szasz

  3. #33
    Senior Member Wolfie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UniqueMixture View Post
    People who are safe in their little cocoons of entitlement like to imagine that they are as tough as anyone exposed to the grimmest of stressors.
    What she said.

    I think with the expansion of communication, we have access to a lot of different stuff. I have noticed that among white youth especially there is a co-opting of different cultural and social aspects, usually to appear different, unique or experienced. There is a rather large hipster movement in my town, young rich kids running around the ghetto playing poor, like it's a fun game. And it's like the worst thing in the world to remind them that they're actually privileged. That's why they tend to not actually hang out with poor people, just other rich kids pretending to be poor. I just have a hard time respecting a lot of my piers for that reason in particular.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfie View Post
    What she said.

    I think with the expansion of communication, we have access to a lot of different stuff. I have noticed that among white youth especially there is a co-opting of different cultural and social aspects, usually to appear different, unique or experienced. There is a rather large hipster movement in my town, young rich kids running around the ghetto playing poor, like it's a fun game. And it's like the worst thing in the world to remind them that they're actually privileged. That's why they tend to not actually hang out with poor people, just other rich kids pretending to be poor. I just have a hard time respecting a lot of my piers for that reason in particular.
    That's a big part of why it doesn't appeal to me. It glorifies a lifestyle that some people were forced into because of dire situational urban poverty, and it seems like ...um...a shitty goal in life, to emulate people who are impoverished and desperate who must turn to violence and crime in order to survive.

    Not only that, but a lot of times with young white men in particular it comes across as obnoxious and stupid, like all they really need a good slap across the face, a belt, and a full-time job.

    I think glorifying the gangsta rap culture in particular (as opposed to just hip hop) is detrimental to society, and it should be examined as a social ill that should be changed, like um we should do something about this, as opposed as to yeah we should go pretend to be like these people (but avoid them IRL because that would be too scary or depressing).

    It's been going on as far as I can tell since the 90's, and my intellectual understanding of it has increased, but my emotional or aesthetic understanding of it still hovers in the range of about zero.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    My guess is because it's exotic with some element of danger. Allows them to vent their teenage angst in an otherwise boring suburb that lacks diversity.

    You should give em some credit though, rap/hip-hop culture that is. It's not all hardcore tough-guy front. Some speak about universal struggles. Basically what @Zarathustra said.

    The problem of course being is that as a result of "release of teenaged angst" there's now a trend toward irresponsible or impulsive gun use and treating young women like un-paid prostitutes.

    Gangsta culture should not be made in anyone's mind as synonymous with "being black" because it's based in a very particular urban struggle, not with African-Americans in general.

    So I don't see anything epically wonderfully multi-cultural about this, it's a bunch of shit, if you want to embrace African-American culture, go listen to soul, jazz, hip hop, or rap that isn't about killing people and raping women.

    The reason why it irritates me is because it's caused a massive social impact on young people, and not in a healthy way, and I honestly don't think it does a goddamn thing to portray African Americans in a positive light, if anything it makes stereotypes worse.

    With most young white men who emulate it, yes it is a "tough guy front" and not based in reality at all, which is why it's so obnoxious and absurd - it's claiming status or power with nothing to back it up, because in truth you're a little whiner who still lives with your mom and plays X Box all day, and this one time in a public place you decided to shoot off a gun for no apparent reason to be cool.

    Some people say it's because "white culture" has become too "feminized" and these boys are looking for something masculine to identify with, but I have a hard time believing this is true, as all black people don't act this way, either.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ü View Post
    I'm more curious as to why people adopt emo/screamo culture? I could understand why people would idolize being tough, but why idolize weakness and suicidal behavior?
    This I do not relate to at all. I think when you're young and want to fit in, and filled with complex emotions you want to express those passionately and find other people who do (thus making you and your emotions "cool").

    And it's a lot easier to glorify misery and anger than to actually psychologically process it in healthy ways, and change yourself and your life. Laziness. In a young person excusable, but in older people annoying.

  7. #37
    Symbolic Herald Vasilisa's Avatar
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    Default Manhood in a Bottle?

    I liked this documentary, it is several years old now, though



    The bit specifically about the corporatization of gangsta rap is at 40:05

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfie View Post
    I have noticed that among white youth especially there is a co-opting of different cultural and social aspects, usually to appear different, unique or experienced. There is a rather large hipster movement in my town, young rich kids running around the ghetto playing poor, like it's a fun game. And it's like the worst thing in the world to remind them that they're actually privileged. That's why they tend to not actually hang out with poor people, just other rich kids pretending to be poor. I just have a hard time respecting a lot of my piers for that reason in particular.
    Does that come from a mindset that the wealth that they come from is illegitimate? Could that be what compels hollow gestures?
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  8. #38
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    I love hip hop, rap, R&B, jazz, and some soul. I especially like the typical offensive popular stuff on the radio. I have kind of a philosophical idea about it. Where to start?

    First, @Zarathustra, yes I agree with all that. I'm a child of the 90's (27) as well. (Ah, the nostalgia...) And I thought you were a robot INTJ. You get like 1000 cool points. @Marmie Dearest, I think you have a lot of good things to say about it, but I think the truth has multiple sides.

    I think there are a lot of universal sentiments expressed in rap and hip hop. Most of it is in fact about being tough, but also about being yourself. African Americans in particular have had to deal with being an oppressed race historically, so that permeates the culture. While glorifying the ghetto is definitely counter productive, developing an assertive attitude is healthy. This is something anyone can benefit from. Most of the music I think, is more about the attitude than bragging about violent actions. Any person, particularly young people who aren't super rich, can identify with feeling oppressed in some way. Since there isn't really any law in these urban areas, it's more of a primal environment. Most white people have repressed their rebellious and aggressive sides, and don't have healthy outlets for it. We need to get in touch with this primal part of ourselves, and face our dark sides. We need to accept our anger and positively express it. Music is a good way to do that. Imagining you are in a situation in which you might be violent allows you to develop your assertive side; once you have expressed it all in your imagination, you can then bring in your good judgment and consciously act rather than react. You might never choose to be violent. But saying that you could be under the right circumstances is empowering. I find gangsta type rap (like DMX and Lil Wayne) is good for me this way. It's real. I'm not a gansta by any stretch of the imagination, but I can and do have as much of an attitude as anyone else.

    Second, rap is assertive in that it promotes being yourself and not worrying about the haters. Most people can identify with this. Listening to it has helped me have more confidence and not care if people judge me or not.

    Third, all African American music to me seems to be characterized by passion. Passion, especially in music, is very healing to me. It is the way I express my emotions. Sexual energy in music goes to my core and gets out all the deep layers of complex emotion I would otherwise never be aware of, much less consciously express. Paradoxically, I find passion to be balancing. I love music with good beats and flow. Once again, it goes to our primal nature- if you go back into human history far enough, all music was pretty much the same, and based around drumming and chanting (kind of like hip hop). Drumming and rhythm accesses our unconscious mind in unique and deep ways, and is used to induce spiritual trance like states. I know music does this for me.

  9. #39
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    I wanna roll with the gangsters, but they all know I'm white and nerdy...


  10. #40
    Senior Member UniqueMixture's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfie View Post
    What she said.

    I think with the expansion of communication, we have access to a lot of different stuff. I have noticed that among white youth especially there is a co-opting of different cultural and social aspects, usually to appear different, unique or experienced. There is a rather large hipster movement in my town, young rich kids running around the ghetto playing poor, like it's a fun game. And it's like the worst thing in the world to remind them that they're actually privileged. That's why they tend to not actually hang out with poor people, just other rich kids pretending to be poor. I just have a hard time respecting a lot of my piers for that reason in particular.

    Your piers

    For all that we have done, as a civilization, as individuals, the universe is not stable, and nor is any single thing within it. Stars consume themselves, the universe itself rushes apart, and we ourselves are composed of matter in constant flux. Colonies of cells in temporary alliance, replicating and decaying and housed within, an incandescent cloud of electrical impulses. This is reality, this is self knowledge, and the perception of it will, of course, make you dizzy.

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