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Hipsters are illogical

The Great One

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Why do Hipsters only listen to "non-mainstream" music? Then, once their favorite artist gets big (mainstream) they stop listening to them because they are too "mainstream" at that point. This seems like an illogical contradiction because many artists aspire to get to the top and make it "big" but it seems like they never could do this and be a true hipster. Discuss.
 

Tyrinth

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Hipsters confuse me. I don't even really understand what makes one a "hipster", and yet I hear the term frequently. And I agree, it doesn't make sense to me. Why would you stop listening to music that you enjoy just because others listen to it as well?
 

The Great One

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Hipsters confuse me. I don't even really understand what makes one a "hipster", and yet I hear the term frequently. And I agree, it doesn't make sense to me. Why would you stop listening to music that you enjoy just because others listen to it as well?

Like I said, it is at that point, "Too mainstream". BTW, I think that about 90% of hipsters are type 4's.
 

Red Herring

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Why do Hipsters only listen to "non-mainstream" music? Then, once their favorite artist gets big (mainstream) they stop listening to them because they are too "mainstream" at that point. This seems like an illogical contradiction because many artists aspire to get to the top and make it "big" but it seems like they never could do this and be a true hipster. Discuss.

Well, I'm not a hipster myself (not that I know of) but surrounded by them. Naturally the main factor here is individualism. People define themselves via the "other". That can be a neigboring country, different religious school or political opponent, etc. In the case of the hipster, it is mainstream lifestyle. They just might sincerely have a different taste in art, of course.

The artist in question however often doesn't just "make it big". Yes, sometimes they are dicovered by the masses, but often they change their style to better fit mainstream demand, some even change the language in which they sing. It is understandable that this puts off old fans while I also understand that artists develope and style doesn't have to be static.

I also wouldn't call this illogical. If you define hip or hipster as off-mainstream or avantguard it is only logical that you can't be both mainstream and hipster-compatible at the same time.

Like I said, it is at that point, "Too mainstream". BTW, I think that about 90% of hipsters are type 4's.

That is very well possible :D
 

The Great One

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Well, I'm not a hipster myself (not that I know of) but surrounded by them. Naturally the main factor here is individualism. People define themselves via the "other". That can be a neigboring country, different religious school or political opponent, etc. In the case of the hipster, it is mainstream lifestyle. They just might sincerely have a different taste in art, of course.

The artist in question however often doesn't just "make it big". Yes, sometimes they are dicovered by the masses, but often they change their style to better fit mainstream demand, some even change the language in which they sing. It is understandable that this puts off old fans while I also understand that artists develope and style doesn't have to be static.

I also wouldn't call this illogical. If you define hip or hipster as off-mainstream or avantguard it is only logical that you can't be both mainstream and hipster-compatible at the same time.

Exactly. But why would one possibly be interested in a system where they could only have limited success? That's dumb.
That is very well possible

Not only do I think most Hipsters are 4's, I think most are Fi users as well.
 

ZPowers

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Exactly. But why would one possibly be interested in a system where they could only have limited success? That's dumb.

I suppose different people put different premiums on things. Some might prefer recognition among a 'cool' crowd over recognition generally or resorting to some kind of empty, artless style to appease larger crowds.

I don't think the bands in general do strive for limited success, however. They're just in that place of semi-success.

And I have to second that with most hipsters I know it isn't about the actual art they are consuming, it's about establishing their unique relationship to it in order to make themselves more intersting complex (often artificially so). It's why they'll abandon music they love if it gets too large (or ignore a song they actually like by a major artist, at least publically) and also listen to, honestly, some pretty horrendous music in the name of faux experimentalism and originality.

It's a silly thing. I know a fair number of hipsters and a fair number of ex hipsters (late HS and early college seems like a big time for this and to their credit they've introduced me to both great and truly insufferable bands). The thing about them is the real goal there is creating this perception of themselves as some form of non-traditional, rebellious coolness.

In some ways it's the spiritual successor to, say, punk movements in the 80s (another group who had major concerns about 'sell outs') or the emo surge in the early 2000s. it's new and cool and a pretty simple (and in some ways appealing) way for a young person to try and define themselves.
 

Within

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Why do Hipsters only listen to "non-mainstream" music? Then, once their favorite artist gets big (mainstream) they stop listening to them because they are too "mainstream" at that point. This seems like an illogical contradiction because many artists aspire to get to the top and make it "big" but it seems like they never could do this and be a true hipster. Discuss.

The one thing that I know for sure on the topic of hipsters, is that if it isn't a womens article of clothing it makes me sick.
 

pinkgraffiti

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well, a musician will not become mainstream if he doesn't sign to a major label, right? major label implies making money, selling music, thus changing your music to make it more palatable to a wider audience. many are the bands that start pretty well and once they go big start making really bad music (from my personal experience. like: first two records really great. become known. 3rd, 4th ex are way more commercial and....bad).
not that i'm defending hipsters or anything. but i guess i could see the reason for your particular question. if you don't agree with my reasoning, please shoot a band that arrived to mainstream without signing to a major label (also so that i know what we define as mainstream etc)
 

r.a

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Check out this page, it give you a great idea of who hipsters are....

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hipster

quite the flattering synopsis. i suspect whoever wrote that is from brooklyn, listens to bad synth pop and does cocaine recreationally. i am surprised the author didn't praise cocaine as the primer to all of the enlightening conversations one can have with these culturally superior demigods. 2/10
 

chickpea

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hipsters have always existed in some form. the kids who were goth or punk in middle school turned emo in early high school, then were "scene," then indie and now progressed into hipsterdom. it's kinda a type 4 mentality, but i doubt most hipsters are 4s, they're just trying to fit in with their friends. i've always just found it really ironic because they're trying so hard to be original and different but end up being exactly the same as so many other people in the process.

i think part of the reason i am so into mainstream pop culture is because i've always been surrounded by so many hipster type people. so i rebel against that in my 4 way.
 

UniqueMixture

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It's a form of social group signalling like fashion. These are the people I want interacting with me and these are the people I do not want interacting with me.

Other things that fall into this category:

Politics
brands (iphone for example)
Favorite activities (for example dirt bike riding vs meditation)
Personal philosophy/spirituality
Humor
Taste in food (do you like wine or beer?)
 
A

Anew Leaf

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Hmm, I usually find that the best way to understand a difficult concept is to break the word down.

Hipster: Hips Ter

No idea what Ter means. Therefore hipsters are unable to be discovered or understood.

/Thread
 
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Why do Hipsters only listen to "non-mainstream" music? Then, once their favorite artist gets big (mainstream) they stop listening to them because they are too "mainstream" at that point. This seems like an illogical contradiction because many artists aspire to get to the top and make it "big" but it seems like they never could do this and be a true hipster. Discuss.

I think it's pretty simple. People who cop this attitude take pride in their rarefied and discerning taste. If everyone likes the same thing as they do, then their taste is common. That's why they abandon bands that get big and search out the next cool band that hardly anyone likes yet. As long as their favorites remain unknown or unappreciated by a majority of the population, these people can maintain the illusion that they possess rare powers of music appreciation. It has nothing to do with quality; it's all about perceived quality.

They, along with like minds in the music press, maintain the circle jerk by promulgating the lie that once bands hit it big they begin to suck. It helps their argument - what could give an aspiring tastemaker more cred than knowing when the jig is up before everyone else? What they fail to factor in is that when a band hits it big it's just as common that public taste came around to their sound as it is that the band compromised to get more popular. They can't see this because the given in their thinking is that their taste is unassailable.

Besides, even if were true, what is the harm in making music that people enjoy? I like a lot of bands that were pretty obscure when I first started listening to them, and I'm happy for their success because I think they're good and they deserve it. "Selling out" is the most overused and misused term in popular culture that I can think of.
 

xisnotx

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It's an appreciation of the "starving artist" lifestyle. They appreciate the struggle that starving artists are going through, but once they become successful they don't see the appeal of their product anymore. I think it's a way of living vicariously through another persons work, knowing that if they were to attempt the same, they would very likely always be a starving artist. By relieving their starving artist urges, they are more capable of concentrating on other aspects of their lives that are perhaps more practical. The same phenomenon can be found in a lot of underground rap fans. Once an artist has made it though, they can't relate to them any longer because their urges to be a "starving artist" themselves are no longer being fulfilled. (An idea that seems like the epitome of self in this generation (really, is there any other lifestyle more noble?)).

So they move on, hoping to either find the next big thing...or the perfect "small thing" for them.

There is also enjoyment in trying to guess which acts will turn mainstream. It's almost like a "buy low, sell high" social system with the prize being demonstrated superior understanding of others.

I'd imagine that hipsters know they're not all that unique. They realize that conformity is inevitable...and they respond to that with irony. By taking individuality to an extreme they become part of the group. Within the group, though, there is room for much individuality which I think appeals to them. In a sense, they are always either beating them or joining them...which is a win win in their eyes.

I find it one of the more interesting fads.

The fact that hipterdom has turned mainstream probably fuels it's mainstreamness as well. It's ironic...and it's exactly what it wants to do.

Too bad I'm not one.

I've always been labeled as a jock or stoner...perhaps with a weird habit of isolating myself and reading.

My question is: How do these pre adult fads integrate themselves into the the battle lines already drawn by previous generations?

There is already pretty clear cut evidence that hipsterdom doesn't smoothly integrate into traditional American liberalism. Perhaps somewhat surprising...but I've suffered through many talks about Ron Paul and the failures of Obama from many of my hipster peers.

Funnily, hipsters seem to be the voice of my generation.
 

Thalassa

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I thought it was an appreciation of thrift store tee shirts, ironic sweater parties, Pabst Blue Ribbon, and paying WAY TOO MUCH for bicycle while claiming to be a "starving artist."

Anyone who listens to music *just because* it's underground, and not because of the way it sounds is a tard.

I respect a person who has a broad and/or deep knowledge of different kinds of music, not someone who only listens to bands no one's ever heard of. I mean sure go see local bands, but they don't automatically become bad if they sell an album (and being local or unknown doesn't always equal good, derp.)
 

Thalassa

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hipsters are like emos.....irrelevant

/thread

Don't tarnish the beautiful name of the emos.

tumblr_lns4ak7eTM1qcyhw1o1_500.jpg
 
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