Hipsters are illogical

[Thalassa]

Well in all honesty here's what I remember about being in my late teens and very early twenties: it's FUN to go to parties and feel that you belong to a certain subversive social group.

However, it's when hipsters are over 21 or so that it starts to bug me. And some of them are 35.

 

[Viridian]

I think it's pretty simple. People who cop this attitude take pride in their rarefied and discerning taste. If everyone likes the same thing as they do, then their taste is common. That's why they abandon bands that get big and search out the next cool band that hardly anyone likes yet. As long as their favorites remain unknown or unappreciated by a majority of the population, these people can maintain the illusion that they possess rare powers of music appreciation. It has nothing to do with quality; it's all about perceived quality.

They, along with like minds in the music press, maintain the circle jerk by promulgating the lie that once bands hit it big they begin to suck. It helps their argument - what could give an aspiring tastemaker more cred than knowing when the jig is up before everyone else? What they fail to factor in is that when a band hits it big it's just as common that public taste came around to their sound as it is that the band compromised to get more popular. They can't see this because the given in their thinking is that their taste is unassailable.

Besides, even if were true, what is the harm in making music that people enjoy? I like a lot of bands that were pretty obscure when I first started listening to them, and I'm happy for their success because I think they're good and they deserve it. "Selling out" is the most overused and misused term in popular culture that I can think of.

I do wonder - is it possible to make music that is popular and has "artistic merit"?

 

[ZPowers]

So what you are saying is that hipsters abandon music that they once loved once it becomes mainstream. The reason being is because they feel that when their favorite bands become famous, then the music is no longer about creativity anymore, but instead about prestige and recognition?

That might be true in part. Moreover, I also think it has to do with the perceived superiority of being on board with something only a very small group of people are aware of (and sometimes that means pretending to like things you don't, or, in the converse, abandoning things you like because they no longer carry any special prestige).

 

[The Great One]

That might be true in part. Moreover, I also think it has to do with the perceived superiority of being on board with something only a very small group of people are aware of (and sometimes that means pretending to like things you don't, or, in the converse, abandoning things you like because they no longer carry any special prestige).

Wouldn't that just make you a turn-coat though? Seriously, take for example if you were a hipster and your best friend had a band. Then, your best friend's band sky-rocketed to fame and success. Why on Earth would you then abandon your friend's band and say, "They aren't for me anymore" just because they rose to fame. It seems like an absolutely ridiculous concept to me.

 

[prplchknz]

sometimes "group non-conformists" are the worst conformists of all... we have an area of the city here where hipsters usually reside and work and such... I've had the misfortune of having that area as my sales route before... it was horrifying :horor: I actually ran across an eye doctor who sold non-prescription glasses to those who really didn't need them but wanted them for goodness sake!

I hate glasses and contacts, I'm suppose to wear them but don't so i can never see the road signs until i'm right up on them.

 

[miss fortune]

I hate glasses and contacts, I'm suppose to wear them but don't so i can never see the road signs until i'm right up on them.

I wear contacts all of the time... I haven't worn my glasses for about 10 years, when I got my last pair that any hipster would be proud of... I went all Rivers Cuomo before doing so was hip to do because it went better with my face shape

 

[prplchknz]

I wear contacts all of the time... I haven't worn my glasses for about 10 years, when I got my last pair that any hipster would be proud of... I went all Rivers Cuomo before doing so was hip to do because it went better with my face shape

haha "I was cool before it was cool to be cool"

 

[miss fortune]

haha "I was cool before it was cool to be cool"

I went through a hipster phase and out before it even became "hipsters"... I became a square and am quite content with that now

now the next cool thing is going to become squares

 

[Lexicon]

haha "I was cool before it was cool to be cool"

I was cool before cool was considered overrated!

It's just another childish pissing contest, I guess.
/shrug

 

[prplchknz]

I went through a hipster phase and out before it even became "hipsters"... I became a square and am quite content with that now

now the next cool thing is going to become squares

I hope not *shudders*

I was cool before cool was considered overrated!

It's just another childish pissing contest, I guess.
/shrug

delusional

 

[EffEmDoubleyou]

I do wonder - is it possible to make music that is popular and has "artistic merit"?

Well, of course it is. It happens all the time. But the sort of person described in the OP finds those terms largely incongruent.

 

[ygolo]

I know this is a bit off topic, but can people PM me links to good, new, popular music?

This thread just reminded me that I haven't just sat and listened to music in a long long time (we're talking many months).

I enjoy silence, but music is important too, I think.

 

[Viridian]

Well, of course it is. It happens all the time. But the sort of person described in the OP finds those terms largely incongruent.

Well, there's also people like some of my university staff, who believe that being mainstream means you have co-opted into a paradigm that strives to culturally perpetuate itself by clinging to the status quo. Or that art only has true merit when it challenges people's deeply held preconceptions, subverts their worldview and makes them uncomfortable.

I've no idea what to think of that. At least they're less self-absorbed than hipsters.

 

[Lexicon]

Some people call me a hipster/punk; that's kind of always been the case, but I never found a sense of ''identity'' around what others associated me with. Since it never mattered to me, I never gave it a lot of thought. My reasoning for my ''style'' was/is pretty simple; I've worn the same kind of sneakers since I was a kid, they're comfortable & I can order them online now, & know the size'll be consistent [I hate shopping/malls, etc. Just hectic, provokes anxiety]. I've always taken my pants in at the legs because I'm lanky & cant find any that fit properly [til skinny jeans came out]. Graphic teeshirts, or plain ones, are comfortable. Most of the stuff I pick out is silkscreened on dark cotton, & I'm grateful for that, because I'm a gangly klutz, spilling things on myself constantly. It doesn't help much that I'm naturally translucent pale with almost black hair, haha.

I've had pockets of friends with a variety of interests. When we were younger, some of them had elitist attitudes about certain types of music or clothing, or how it was worn. I always just ignored it. I saw the hipocracy in keeping up with the dress codes of others while telling yourself that you were ''rebelling'' against authority. Your authority is your herd.. it's just boring, and silly. I usually didn't bother trying to reason with my friends about such things, unless they were attempting to give me ''fashion advice.'' Everyone explores and expresses their identities differently, so I figure live & let live. If they're happy with what they're doing, I don't have to value it, or understand it the same way they do. Good for them, good for me.

I've had friends ask, if I feel that way, why do I continue to wear the things I do.. since they're often associated with those people, with ''hipsters.''
''Wouldn't the hipster thing to do be to stop doing something just because it got too ''cool'' with a given group of people?'' I'll jokingly respond. Other people's feelings about what I do or don't like has no impact on my preferences, that's all, I guess.

Either way, it's just clothes- I like what I like and don't give it much consideration, otherwise.. this post is about as indepth as I bother to go, in terms of analysis. I can't take shit like social genres that seriously.. I mean.. that's something people waste tons of energy on? is the thought I always return to.

..who.. ..fucking.. cares

 

[Thalassa]

I do wonder - is it possible to make music that is popular and has "artistic merit"?

Of course.

Nirvana
The Cure
Nick Cave
The Bauhaus
The Church
Tori Amos
PJ Harvey
Moby
Santigold
The xX
MGMT
Eminem
Chaka Khan
Marvin Gaye
Adele

I mean...that's just the tip of the iceburg. I can't believe this is even a question, but I suppose it has to be.

 

[Vasilisa]

I don't consider hipsterdom much anymore.

http://rookiemag.com/2012/01/how-to-not-care-what-other-people-think-of-you/
"What such people don’t get is that most people who like more obscure music or wear vintage clothes don’t think of themselves as artsy, they’re just exploring and trying to define their taste instead of being someone who likes whatever is handed to them so they’re not mistaken for pretentious. I don’t like the term hipster—I think it’s become so broad as to apply to basically everyone—but the defining quality is that a hipster thinks and cares about what their tastes say about them, instead of just liking what they like. And so there is nothing more hipster than a person who decides that the only reason another person is wearing a colorful dress is that they’re concerned with what that dress means for their image. It’s hipster to give a shit if other people are hipsters or not; this is why people who claim they’re not hipsters are the most hipster of all, because they’re thinking that hard about it, and caring that much about what other people think."​

then there is the other side http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/arts-entertainment/37614-guilty-pleasures-just-pleasures.html

 

[Lexicon]

I do wonder - is it possible to make music that is popular and has "artistic merit"?

As long as the creator is making music that they love, whatever that means to them, and not diluting it to appeal to anyone else in particular, I'd still call it art, & not manufactured garbage. Sometimes it catches on, and a lot of people like it. Sometimes only a select group like it. There's a genre called ''noise'' - and while I can't stand it, I still consider it art/human expression. Some human expression is bound to be awesome or retarded to others; it's a coin toss, perhaps.

 

[1487610420]

I don't consider hipsterdom much anymore.

http://rookiemag.com/2012/01/how-to-not-care-what-other-people-think-of-you/
"What such people don’t get is that most people who like more obscure music or wear vintage clothes don’t think of themselves as artsy, they’re just exploring and trying to define their taste instead of being someone who likes whatever is handed to them so they’re not mistaken for pretentious. I don’t like the term hipster—I think it’s become so broad as to apply to basically everyone—but the defining quality is that a hipster thinks and cares about what their tastes say about them, instead of just liking what they like. And so there is nothing more hipster than a person who decides that the only reason another person is wearing a colorful dress is that they’re concerned with what that dress means for their image. It’s hipster to give a shit if other people are hipsters or not; this is why people who claim they’re not hipsters are the most hipster of all, because they’re thinking that hard about it, and caring that much about what other people think."​

then there is the other side http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/arts-entertainment/37614-guilty-pleasures-just-pleasures.html

 

[Thalassa]

Well, of course it is. It happens all the time. But the sort of person described in the OP finds those terms largely incongruent.

The only thing I could muster that would ethically admirable about it would be to reject anything that was corporate. Like music carried by corporations.

You'd have to be hyper-religious about being anti-corporate, though. It's better just to continue listening to the music, but circumvent it by stealing it or just watching it or listening to it for free on-line.

HAHAHAHA.

Okay but seriously musicians have to make money to live.

I dunno.

 

[UniqueMixture]

I do wonder - is it possible to make music that is popular and has "artistic merit"?

No, because most people's brains aren't specialized to appreciate auditory complexity in the same way as great composers. It's the same with any human activity. Generally great composers write for themselves privately and hit more general overtones in their work for profit. Some of the greats find a way to transcend both worlds though