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  1. #41
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    I was bothered by the overselling of his faith combined with his demonization of a woman because he found her attractive. That kind of projection of guilt onto an object of desire is just really disturbing.
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  2. #42
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stalemate View Post
    Something about the way he is toward women and the overselling of his faith. If I had to guess, I would say he has done something to, because of, or with a woman that he is having some problems getting over. I think he thinks of himself as a Bad Person (tm).
    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    I was bothered by the overselling of his faith combined with his demonization of a woman because he found her attractive. That kind of projection of guilt onto an object of desire is just really disturbing.
    Appreciable answers. Brandon may definitely either see himself as a bad person or be strongly fighting the image of one create by Russel. He has openly stated that and struggled with it. I don't think there is anything particularly wrong with that, we all fight these battles, and to me, he has done a fine job of being a Good Person on the show. It was strange at first, it seemed that he had more than just an attraction to Mikayla but something more like a full-blown infatuation. It happens. He's 19. She's a lingerie football player. He didn't fight his urges very gracefully, but he fought them nonetheless. Everyone wants someone gone, for whatever reason. This incident fits in with the bigger picture of Brandon, that yes, he is fighting to be a good person above winning the game. I admire that. Nothing wrong with a struggle to be a good person, particularly when others look so childish the way they get caught up in the game.

    The person who is really overselling religion is "Coach". He seems to both believe it and use it to his advantage when possible, which is slimy. He abuses it and insults it, in my opinion, by praying for things that god isn't really about - for instance when his tribe won a close challenge, he ran around screaming, "GET ON YOUR KNEES!" as if his tribe were the chosen one and this challenge in Survivor's 23rd season mattered on a biblical scale. Brandon is more in touch with god's timeless values of honor and integrity than Coach, as I see it. They're both human beings, of course, but I find Brandon's approach admirable and Coach's typical, if not disturbing at times.

    The other player who I find admirable is Ozzy. I didn't favor him at all in the beginning, because he was acting like a high school kid flaunting popularity, but as the game has gone on character has shown through. He has taken some big risks, dominated physically and mentally, and started to show some connection to his inner-self. While Jim became furious at Cochran, Ozzy accepted a little more responsibility. How could Jim (who was a scheming rat with no core personality) pretend, in his own mind, that Cochran would have any loyalty to him? Ozzy seemed a little less selfish here.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    Appreciable answers. Brandon may definitely either see himself as a bad person or be strongly fighting the image of one create by Russel. He has openly stated that and struggled with it. I don't think there is anything particularly wrong with that, we all fight these battles, and to me, he has done a fine job of being a Good Person on the show. It was strange at first, it seemed that he had more than just an attraction to Mikayla but something more like a full-blown infatuation. It happens. He's 19. She's a lingerie football player. He didn't fight his urges very gracefully, but he fought them nonetheless. Everyone wants someone gone, for whatever reason. This incident fits in with the bigger picture of Brandon, that yes, he is fighting to be a good person above winning the game. I admire that. Nothing wrong with a struggle to be a good person, particularly when others look so childish the way they get caught up in the game.

    The person who is really overselling religion is "Coach". He seems to both believe it and use it to his advantage when possible, which is slimy. He abuses it and insults it, in my opinion, by praying for things that god isn't really about - for instance when his tribe won a close challenge, he ran around screaming, "GET ON YOUR KNEES!" as if his tribe were the chosen one and this challenge in Survivor's 23rd season mattered on a biblical scale. Brandon is more in touch with god's timeless values of honor and integrity than Coach, as I see it. They're both human beings, of course, but I find Brandon's approach admirable and Coach's typical, if not disturbing at times.

    The other player who I find admirable is Ozzy. I didn't favor him at all in the beginning, because he was acting like a high school kid flaunting popularity, but as the game has gone on character has shown through. He has taken some big risks, dominated physically and mentally, and started to show some connection to his inner-self. While Jim became furious at Cochran, Ozzy accepted a little more responsibility. How could Jim (who was a scheming rat with no core personality) pretend, in his own mind, that Cochran would have any loyalty to him? Ozzy seemed a little less selfish here.
    Yeah I actually agree. I still don't like any of them. I'm rooting a lot more for Ozzy at the moment. I hated him at first , but his continuous effort to stay in the game has caused him to grown on me. There isn't anyone in particular I want winning at the moment. Possibly Ozzy, which is slightly funny because I was initially cheering for coach, who annoys me now.

    I felt Coach's pushiness to express religious-thanks is extremely disrespectful to those that might not share it. He's constantly shouting "let us pray", "come here guys, lets give thanks to god", "GET ON YOUR KNEES".
    It doesn't seem they really have a choice but to join in, unless they want a target on their back. Since religion is so valuable to Coach, Brandon, and possibly, Ricky, the other three seemed to join in for the mere advantage of "fitting in" and being a tribe of "one".

  4. #44
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    The facial expressions at tribal council last night were priceless..

    Brandon went out with honor. What I found most interesting was Jeff's question to Brandon and Coach: are you at peace right now? Brandon says definitely not, Coach says absolutely and spreads his arms open as if he were a meditating guru. I wonder if it wasn't just the opposite of what was said. Brandon may not recognize that being at peace sometimes involves struggle, when it is for the right reason. Coach may well be putting on an act, as far as I'm concerned. If I'm Coach, and I know I'm on TV, and I say I'm a man of god and integrity, would I lie to protect this image? Probably. After all that preaching about honor and integrity, could Coach really stab Brandon in the back like that in front of a TV audience? Not without saying god commissioned it. So, let me get this straight: Coach went and made a big show of praying in the sand, and god came to him and told him to vote Brandon off Survivor 23: South Pacific? Why did he leave it as a surprise, then? Why didn't he go to Brandon and say, "god wants me to vote you off."?

    I dunno.

  5. #45
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Actually what seemed initially as a stupid move for Brandon now seems more like "stupid like a fox". With the redemption island factor (and clearly the limited amount of Redemption Island challenges left) Brandon needed to make a bold move to "win" the game.

    Before this last tribal counsel (before Brandon played the martyr) Brandon was deemed by most of those who will vote on the winner, as a loser/wackjob.

    Now he is the martyr and potentially the slayer of the mighty Ozzie.

    He also pulled some of his competition down a notch or two by showing them for what they are: greedy, conniving and self-absorbed.

    If Brandon beats Ozzie he will likely be the next winner of Survivor (if he doesn't than Ozzie will be the next winner)
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  6. #46
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    Kind of disappointed by the finale. I had hoped ozzy would dominate to the end. Sophie was ok... But I had been rooting for ozzy since I felt he played the best out of them all.

    All in all it was a fun season though. . Hoping the next season is just as fun!

  7. #47
    Klingon Warrior Princess Patches's Avatar
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    Boo.
    “Everybody has a secret world inside of them. All of the people of the world, I mean everybody. No matter how dull and boring they are on the outside, inside
    them they've all got unimaginable, magnificent, wonderful, stupid, amazing worlds. Not just one world. Hundreds of them. Thousands maybe.” -Neil Gaiman

    ~

  8. #48
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Both Ozzy and Coach played strongly. Ozzy came extremely close to a shutout. All he had to do was win the last challenge.

    Coach played a Machiavellian game of high note and I thought even in retrospect his eating humble pie at the end was not such a bad tactic. I would say his primary mistake was to not find a monkey's paw or otherwise get counter dirt on Sophie in response to a cheapshot attack which was foreseeable.

    Sophie did a good job. However, to tell you the truth I was disappointed to see her win because I didn't like her.
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  9. #49
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    I actually felt bad for Brandon. Ozzy deserved it.
    Next seems looks verrrrrrrry interesting. Very excited.

  10. #50
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    This was a great season. Lots of contrast. I saw heros, rats, and nobodies - it was like EVERYONE was one of the 3, profoundly.

    So we wound up with 3 rats.

    Coach was a backstabber and a politician. If any of the 3 really deserved to win, it was him. The other 2 rode his coat tails, he dominated the game. It all fell apart, though, because of his hypocrisy. There must be a want to do whatever it takes to get as far as possible, but if you really want to play for #1, the first thing you have to do from day 1 is play honorably. Otherwise, you won't have the jury. This is why Coach got 2nd place.

    Sophie hung around in the background and casually played a solid but typical game. Not a clean record as far as honor goes, no big moves. Her best claim to victory is winning 3 individual immunity challenges. That's impressive.

    Albert was a little rat and everyone knew it. He quietly rode Coach's coat tails the whole game. Lucky him, but then again he didn't win.

    The heros were Brandon and Ozzy. What's brilliant about it is that neither of them really grasped at the million dollars like the others. They both made big moves and played the game from the heart, putting their dignity first and doing what they thought was right, not what would keep them safest. I was inspired by their strength and courage. It was great to see them both hold their heads high all the way through the end of the series. They were the true winners. The ones who made it to the final three will always have that bittersweetness of knowing that sure, they made it pretty far but no one really respected them and that's worth more than a million dollars. Seeing those 2 heros play is what made this season worth watching.

    Another big player was Cochran. He came from a unique standpoint, and really wound up making the most of it. He didn't play perfectly, but he wound up making big moves and really playing the game like he hoped he could. That's why he went out with a smile, and it was touching. I also agreed with his final assessment that Coach should be the one to win the million. Coach may have been a rat, but he dominated while others who were also rats rode behind.

    This has solidified my appreciation of Survivor, anywho. It is more than just a competition involving petty drama between people. It reveals character like few other scenarios. There will always be rats, heros, and nobodies. The day it's not, there will be no show. I think it is particularly interesting to see the ones who return for a second or third run, and how they change. Survivor seems to build character, from what I've seen, and that's cool. I think people like Ozzy and Boston Rob, and even Brandon vicariously, have shown how Survivor can turn someone into a winner. I think even Coach, if he came back for another season, would definitely change his game and play more gracefully.

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