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  1. #1851
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    @Qre:us

    Well... damn. That's really insightful.
    I hope this is one of those cases where the audience isn't more insightful than the showrunners and they actually do something like that.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
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  2. #1852
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.
    Likes MDP2525 liked this post

  3. #1853
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    :O

    That would be great
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
    10w12

  4. #1854

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    ^
    @ceecee
    I don't think so....


    Quote Originally Posted by Totenkindly View Post
    @Qre:us

    Well... damn. That's really insightful.
    I hope this is one of those cases where the audience isn't more insightful than the showrunners and they actually do something like that.
    Crossing my fingers but not holding my breath. I learned my lesson from the hopes I put into the Arya/Faceless Men S/L. SMDH.


  5. #1855
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    ^
    @ceecee
    I don't think so....




    Crossing my fingers but not holding my breath. I learned my lesson from the hopes I put into the Arya/Faceless Men S/L. SMDH.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  6. #1856

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post

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  7. #1857
    Sweet Summer Child yama's Avatar
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    Holy fucking hell. This is one of the best episode of the entire show, I think. There's nothing I can say that the rest of you haven't already said, so I'm just going to gasp in awe in that corner over there.
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  8. #1858

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    Quote Originally Posted by Totenkindly View Post
    ----
    A great article about the complexity of Jaime and Brienne's relationship:
    Jaime and Brienne’s Relationship Isn’t Sexual -- Vulture
    A wonderful read. Good find! I love analyzing their relationship (it's my favourite in the show, and I'm a shameless fanwoman about it!)

    My musings....

    I agree with the article's analysis, and love the way they have presented and explained it. It's quite complex, their bond, and it did a wonderful job at explaining such a complex relationship.

    The one thing I would disagree with is the assessment that Bronn reducing it to 'just fucking' is silly. I agree, it is silly, it was meant to give levity to the scene, but I think Bronn was a representation/reflection of the audience, at that moment. Albeit a crude one. I think anyone watching their relationship's evolution has wondered what is up with them. Their bond seems so deep. And because they happen to be different genders, and because we know that Brienne does have a bit of a crush on him (Cersei called her out on it, correctly), the doubts in the audience are real. Will they? Won't they? Do they? In this way, I think Bronn's role in that scene served something similar to the chorus in greek plays.

    It was a great set-up for the following scene, when we see them truly interact, away from the eyes of the world, in the tent. And, as always, they're so naked and vulnerable with one another. And both are filled with affection and longing and relief, all at once; you could feel the emotions heavy in the tent. A great reminder for the audience that simplifying them in those terms as 'will they/won't they' (Bronn being the audience) doesn't even scratch the surface of these two individuals and their bond with one another.

    In its simplest form, I would say they are soulmates. Not the kind where two are fated to be, and happen to meet each other. But the ones that are formed, through creation of the bond. Each serves to challenge, and elevate the other to a higher level of (self)awareness. Thus, simplifying them in sexual terms doesn't capture that depth, and feels 'cheap', perhaps. Because we're so used to the social construct of such relationships, where the height of romance is a culmination of the bond in the physical act.

    It's almost an ironic turn-on-its-head of the ideal courtly love. Out of all the women on the show who pine for it (e.g., old Sansa), the one who scoffs at it, and considers herself too ugly and big, and without the disposition to have the patience for such 'silliness', ends up experiencing it. In its ideal and purest form. But I don't think she is aware that she is/has experienced this. Ah, Brienne. Which makes the relationship all that more wonderful to watch. The ideal kind of medieval romantic love, whose ideal lies in its chivalry and purity, i.e., sans the consummation; however, potent and sensual all the same. Yet, the characters do not fit the conventional mold of the players of knight and lady. Love it!

    Jamie will fight men and bear to preserve her virtue and protect her, and through her eyes and acceptance and actions, he is delivered the very honour that a knight aims to achieve in his idealized form. And add to that the authenticity and genuineness of it, means that they also recognize each other and their flaws.

    The show, I believe, fully acknowledges this aspect by having the characters refer to each other as....

    Ser Jamie
    Lady Brienne

    Jamie treats her as a lady (disregard his beginning conduct!) without diminishing the essence of Brienne and her strength or asking for her submission. Brienne treats him as an honourable man without diminishing his flaws and uniqueness that makes, Jamie, Jamie (There is no other man like me. Only me). Equals.

    I googled courtly love, and there's a very apt and wonderful quote in its wiki page:

    "It is the pure love which binds together the hearts of two lovers with every feeling of delight. This kind consists in the contemplation of the mind and the affection of the heart; it goes as far as the kiss and the embrace and the modest contact with the nude lover, omitting the final solace, for that is not permitted for those who wish to love purely....."

    - Andreas Capellanus in De amore libri tres (1184)

    Ah, hey, look, although there has been no kiss, there has been a wonderful modest embrace of the naked 'lovers' (bath scene). Check, check, check. It's like reimagining courtly love through a feminist lens. heh.

    However, I would not be adverse to them recognizing one another as more than simply platonic, and culminating in a physical act. Ha! /fanwomaning

    I could go on, waxing poetic, but shall stop here for now.

  9. #1859

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    Quote Originally Posted by 93JC View Post


  10. #1860
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Jon should've died. Dude gets too many chances.

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