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  1. #1411
    Member Doktorin Zylinder's Avatar
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    Did anyone see this?


  2. #1412
    The Green Jolly Robin H.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    I made no unlikely claim. The onus is on you.
    I will do a clothed j-lo style pose at some point since my derriere is j-lo shaped. Do you find the j-lo shaped derrier on a male attractive? Can you imagine a j-lo shaped derriere on a male in the first place?

    Most male derriere from what I've seen are seldom j-lo shaped...I personally don't find the j-lo shape as attractive as many because it probably looks too much like my own.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    I made no unlikely claim. The onus is on you.
    I will do a clothed j-lo style pose at some point since my derriere is j-lo shaped. Do you find the j-lo shaped derriere on a male attractive? Can you imagine a j-lo shaped derriere on a male in the first place?

    Most male derriere from what I've seen are seldom j-lo shaped...I personally don't find the j-lo shape as attractive as many because it probably looks too much like my own.
    "i shut the door and in the morning
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    -the end"




    Olemn slammed his hammer and from the sparks on the metal of his anvil came the spheres of the heavens.

    Sayrah blew life into the spheres and they moved. From her wheel she weaved the names of people in to mystery.

  3. #1413
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    So do people have strong feelings about how the episode ended? I've seen a lot of Internet complaints (from myriad reviewers and show watches) in the last week about what happened to Sansa and assumptions that it was somehow a bad choice by the showrunners for pointless reasons.

    it was weird, but I just didn't view it that way. Aside from a plot point that could conceivably be used by the writers to shake Theon out of being Reek, it just seemed like something that would have happened naturally -- typically behavior for Ramsay. In fact, I would have been shocked if there HADN'T been something like that, and sadly it was not as bad as some of things I had imagined. And Sansa, I think, knew that but was playing the game anyway... her choice after her discussion after her talk with Littlefinger. I think everyone knew that such a possibility was on the table, and it was part of bringing down the Boltons, even if it was one of the worse-case scenarios that could befall Sansa.

    I'm just curious how people parsed it overall. I guess past history of the show (where they have seemed to subjugate women to abuse where it wasn't necessary) has allowed this particular scene to resonate as "more of the same," but I parsed it myself as just a natural plot point where Ramsay is concerned, and him not behaving this way would have been breaking character.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #1414
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    So do people have strong feelings about how the episode ended? I've seen a lot of Internet complaints (from myriad reviewers and show watches) in the last week about what happened to Sansa and assumptions that it was somehow a bad choice by the showrunners for pointless reasons.

    it was weird, but I just didn't view it that way. Aside from a plot point that could conceivably be used by the writers to shake Theon out of being Reek, it just seemed like something that would have happened naturally -- typically behavior for Ramsay.
    Yes, it struck me as entirely in character for him. There was even a similar scene in the book with a different character, and I think it's possible that something like that is going to happen to Sansa in Book 6, anyway. It wasn't a pleasant scene, but this show has been filled with unpleasant and grotesque moments. That's just the world the show takes place in. It's violent and brutal and the violent and brutal things often happen to the good people. I can understand someone having an issue with that and not wanting to watch it, but what I can't understand is why they've been watching this show for 5 seasons.

    Anyway, there was a rape scene in the first episode of the series, and nobody complained then. And I'd argue that scene was a lot more problematic in the grand scheme of things (considering all the factors involved and everything that emerged from it), but nobody talks about that.
    Forget the dead you've left; they will not follow you.
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  5. #1415
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    since it just aired:

    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
    Likes Qlip, Udog liked this post

  6. #1416

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    and now we know where Ghost is as well.
    It was so sweet to see Ghost come and rescue the duo, almost like Jon is still there, looking out for his bro, even when he's not there.
    Stannis Is Conflicted. Which is good. And we saw that coming too. But I have no idea what he will decide. It's a great dilemma: Loyalty to his daughter, or loyalty to Westeros.
    A conflict between his head and heart, finally. Where logic, strategy and all the other things that he trusts, in making such decisions, are in complete conflict with his heart. We all knew this was coming...

    "Tyrion Lannister, I presume?" Well, that connection has been fast-tracked. I'm not sure how Jorah will fare, but Tyrion at least has a chance.
    FINALLY! The meeting between Tyrion and Danerys takes place. Tyrion always cracks me up, "I am the gift." *camera pans to his whole form, dirty, short and completely unassuming in appearance*

    Somewhere out there Varys is rubbing the good oil on his head, patting it for a job well done.

    Speaking of, Varys is known to have his 'little birds' everywhere. I'm sure he will soon hear that Tyrion has reached Danerys. Also, Littlefinger's 'sigil' is that of a bird.....found that to be an interesting little tidbit.

    Looks like it wasn't Bronn's time to go. Another bit of relief I was happy to witness. (and saved by his song, not his sword this time.)
    What a Lothario! I'm sure he'd reply that his tongue is his (second) favourite sword.

    Lady Olenna is getting more frustrated with everything. It was a great scene between her and the High Sparrow.
    If I didn't know better, I'd say there was a bit of flirting going on!

    And I guess Baelish might have been involved in that little bit...? Or Baelish -> Olenna -> etc?
    My guess is that Oleanna definitely enlisted the help of Littlefinger in Joffrey's death (as revealed), and in return, promised to give him Sansa, which she did. Now, she sought him out, as co-conspirators, to topple Cersei once again, calling on her trump card that his hands are just as bloody as hers. I think he's the one who tipped off the Sparrows that Lancel Lannister was the link to Cersei's demise, and I'm sure the Sparrows did their brainwashing, guilt-trip on Lancel, to confess it all.

    And the last five minutes: karma <-- bitch, isn't it, Cersie? Hilarious. I've been waiting for all that to bite her in the ass. She's far more damned than Loras or Margaery even would be, which is the most ironic part. How could she have been so stupid to give so much power to a man who honestly has no biases? Maybe that is where Cersei went wrong: The sect is harsh in doling out judgment, but the Sparrow's heart is quite sincere in that no one is favored or excluded, and Cersei has always assumed that she would in some way be shown favor. Now her power means nothing.
    I agree. Cersei is still under the presumption that everybody wants power, over all else. That no one has any other motivation that trumps that one. And if she can barter power as a chip, meaning she must have the power to use it as a chip, then she is untouchable. That's her ego's blind-spot. And what a fall it will be. Was interesting to see that the women who threw her in the cell, were dressed like Lady Oleanna. I'm sure that was Lady Oleanna's doing, as a message to Cersei, 'Don't fuck with the Queen of Thorns, or you'll get pricked!'

    I loved Cersei's fire, in the end, 'Look at me, look at my face, this is the face you will see when you die.' Throwing shade, even in that position. Oh, Cersei.

    ****

    And, Maester Aemon dies. All the good ones in Night's Watch, the wise ones, are dropping like heavy icicles.

    The lady who was Sansa's ally, telling her to light the candle, dead and skinned. Ramsey's words, about the candle. That he knew. Sansa's heartbreak. They're making her more cunning, in how to play the game.

    Jamie and Myrcella's conversation, again, predicted this, that he'll come to realize that his daughter's wish and happiness (which he is completely unaware of, as he has never tried to get to know them) is in direct conflict with this ridiculous mission.

    The passing of time is hard to tell on this show. I found it puzzling when Myrcella said something to the effect of, 'Dorne has been my home now for years'. ?? Did I mishear? I thought she was sent there after Joffrey's death. How long ago was that? Has years passed in the GoT universe since then? I'd guess so, as Tommen is not the little boy on his mother's lap about to drink poison. Anyway, this is part of the show that is hard to keep track of, in terms of context.

  7. #1417
    Senior Member riva's Avatar
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    When you are siding with Cersi Lannister over a religious institute, you know you have a loathe religious institutions.

    Perhaps if it was Jeoffry I would have sided with the other group.
    .

  8. #1418

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    So do people have strong feelings about how the episode ended? I've seen a lot of Internet complaints (from myriad reviewers and show watches) in the last week about what happened to Sansa and assumptions that it was somehow a bad choice by the showrunners for pointless reasons.

    it was weird, but I just didn't view it that way. Aside from a plot point that could conceivably be used by the writers to shake Theon out of being Reek, it just seemed like something that would have happened naturally -- typically behavior for Ramsay. In fact, I would have been shocked if there HADN'T been something like that, and sadly it was not as bad as some of things I had imagined. And Sansa, I think, knew that but was playing the game anyway... her choice after her discussion after her talk with Littlefinger. I think everyone knew that such a possibility was on the table, and it was part of bringing down the Boltons, even if it was one of the worse-case scenarios that could befall Sansa.

    I'm just curious how people parsed it overall. I guess past history of the show (where they have seemed to subjugate women to abuse where it wasn't necessary) has allowed this particular scene to resonate as "more of the same," but I parsed it myself as just a natural plot point where Ramsay is concerned, and him not behaving this way would have been breaking character.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vulcan View Post
    Yes, it struck me as entirely in character for him. There was even a similar scene in the book with a different character, and I think it's possible that something like that is going to happen to Sansa in Book 6, anyway. It wasn't a pleasant scene, but this show has been filled with unpleasant and grotesque moments. That's just the world the show takes place in. It's violent and brutal and the violent and brutal things often happen to the good people. I can understand someone having an issue with that and not wanting to watch it, but what I can't understand is why they've been watching this show for 5 seasons.

    Anyway, there was a rape scene in the first episode of the series, and nobody complained then. And I'd argue that scene was a lot more problematic in the grand scheme of things (considering all the factors involved and everything that emerged from it), but nobody talks about that.
    That doesn't make sense at all. The complaints from the viewers. You almost want to ask those viewers if only now, after 5 seasons, they're figuring out what GoT is like, and if that's the case, then it's fair game to question their power of observation and intelligence. What show did they think they were watching, all this time?

    Did they think Ramsey would woo her in a bed of flowers, and sing her a song, on their wedding night? The same Ramsey who has tortured and castrated Reek/Theon? Really? Really?!!!! I think the show was actually subtle, for once, in that they didn't show the graphic rape taking place, choosing instead to pan to Theon's expression. Compared to, I dunno, having Oberon's head squished like a canteloupe, in its gory detail.

    Or, the prostitute tied up and dead, with arrows pierced through her (Joffrey's artwork).

    Far more graphic and in your face.

    I also don't understand the outrage over the violence and sexual abuse. It's the universe of GoT, medieval times, when women were seen as bartering chips in men's power games, to be married off for alliance, property, and strategy. I'm sure the incidence of marital rape was sky high back then. With relationships like Catelyn and Ned, being lucky exceptions. Even Cersei was a victim of marital rape, at the hands of Robert Baratheon. Danerys and Khal Drogo.

    Hell, I don't think 'marital rape' would have registered as a valid term, back then, but rather laughed off. How can a husband rape his wife?

    It was the fate of women back then. The very thing that Cersei repeatedly makes a commentary on, that only if she were born a man in that world.....otherwise, the only thing a woman has, in terms of power in those times, is what's between her legs.

    Then you have Arya, Brienne, challenging that, but they're the rare ones. The fringes of society. And Danerys transforming her worth into a power of her own making.

    The moral outrage should be at the whole society/universe of GoT, not that it is shown.
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  9. #1419
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    I agree. Cersei is still under the presumption that everybody wants power, over all else. That no one has any other motivation that trumps that one. And if she can barter power as a chip, meaning she must have the power to use it as a chip, then she is untouchable. That's her ego's blind-spot. And what a fall it will be. Was interesting to see that the women who threw her in the cell, were dressed like Lady Oleanna. I'm sure that was Lady Oleanna's doing, as a message to Cersei, 'Don't fuck with the Queen of Thorns, or you'll get pricked!'

    I loved Cersei's fire, in the end, 'Look at me, look at my face, this is the face you will see when you die.' Throwing shade, even in that position. Oh, Cersei.
    Throwing shade, but empty threats... and now Tommen, alone. I feel bad for that boy. His helplessness and frustration was sincere, he's like the "average person" in how I relate to him, and he has no way to save the people he cares about.

    I noticed the costumes on those women but didn't really think of Oleanna... good catch.

    It reminds me of something that Varys said -- about power residing where men believe it resides? Cersei has no actual power, and now she has lost the illusion of power.

    Cersei Lannister, Queen of Bad Decision-Making -- Vulture

    That doesn't make sense at all. The complaints from the viewers. You almost want to ask those viewers if only now, after 5 seasons, they're figuring out what GoT is like, and if that's the case, then it's fair game to question their power of observation and intelligence. What show did they think they were watching, all this time?
    I think it's offending their sensibilities to the degree they have stepped outside the boundaries of the story and are casting aspirations at the writers at this point.

    But really, as you've said -- it's the world that has been constructed for five seasons now, and I saw it as less about trying to establish anything about Ramsay we already knew and more about just things playing out logically. After all, if Sauron in LotR tormented and flayed someone alive, should we be shocked or pissed off? [The book never goes into detail, but does talk about him inflicting torment on the souls who fall into his grasp.] I guess the difference is that we never really saw Sauron do all the evil things to individuals we knew, directly, right there on the screen or in the book, but here of course we have to watch Ramsay do them. Might they have gotten away with just showing a haggard Sansa with horrid bruising? possibly -- we would have filled in the gaps. Still, the camera focused on Theon there at the end, and I think it will contribute to the first breaking of the psychological cage he is in, even if Sansa's first attempt to gain his help failed.

    I was just kind of surprised at about 60-70% of the reviewers were going on about this.

    ---

    BTW, if the royalty of King's Landing keep getting tossed in jail, soon it will be up to Puss in Boots Ser Pounce to save the day!

    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #1420
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    The passing of time is hard to tell on this show. I found it puzzling when Myrcella said something to the effect of, 'Dorne has been my home now for years'. ?? Did I mishear? I thought she was sent there after Joffrey's death. How long ago was that? Has years passed in the GoT universe since then? I'd guess so, as Tommen is not the little boy on his mother's lap about to drink poison. Anyway, this is part of the show that is hard to keep track of, in terms of context.
    It's kept vague on purpose - partly to mask plot holes created when characters move around. (I believe it takes something like a month to travel from Winterfell to King's Landing via the King's Road, for example.) Tyrion sent Myrcella to Dorne in Season 2 while he was acting Hand of the King... for reasons I can't exactly remember. So this episode has basically established that on the TV show, around 3 years have passed since the middle of season 2.

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