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  1. #1361
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Oh, I read about Cersei from the book, in that her deal on the TV show with the Sparrows seems to be very short-sighted and irrational long-term... but apparently she had more method to her madness in the original story -- apparently the Crown owed a LOT of money to the Sparrows and there was no way to pay the debt, which had come due... so in exchange for forgiveness of the debt, she agreed to install them as the enforcers and go do their purge thing.

    (More or less.)

    I still don't much like Cersei, but I think at least there she would have justification for what she did, versus being entirely petty.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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  2. #1362
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Oh, I read about Cersei from the book, in that her deal on the TV show with the Sparrows seems to be very short-sighted and irrational long-term... but apparently she had more method to her madness in the original story -- apparently the Crown owed a LOT of money to the Sparrows and there was no way to pay the debt, which had come due... so in exchange for forgiveness of the debt, she agreed to install them as the enforcers and go do their purge thing.

    (More or less.)

    I still don't much like Cersei, but I think at least there she would have justification for what she did, versus being entirely petty.
    Yeah, there was a bit more context for that in the book. IIRC, she also had debts to the Braavosi (these debts were mentioned by Tywin on the show at a few points), not just the Faith of the Seven. She opted to see if she could turn the Sparrow situation to her advantage.

    BTW, I love the casting of Jonathan Pryce in the role of the High Sparrow.
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  3. #1363
    respect the brick C.J.Woolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Not just that, but palpable irony -- he served as the Hand of the King in Westeros, got canned because he was a dwarf and essentially run out of town, and now his wits + that experience might be used to support the invasion of Westeros by the former rulers. (A Westeros arguably ruled currently by Cersei, the sister who instigated much of this to happen because she hates Tyrion so much. It's sad when you end up biting yourself in the ass.)
    Tyrion's situation reminds me a bit of Prince Eugene of Savoy, who was denied an army officer's commission in his native France because he was ugly(!). He took up soldiering in Austria and later (with the Duke of Marlborough) crushed a French army at Blenheim.

  4. #1364
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.J.Woolf View Post
    Tyrion's situation reminds me a bit of Prince Eugene of Savoy, who was denied an army officer's commission in his native France because he was ugly(!). He took up soldiering in Austria and later (with the Duke of Marlborough) crushed a French army at Blenheim.
    I'm going far off topic here, but something that's interesting for me is intellectual history. Eugene was evidently a major patron of Leibniz and Rosseau. He was lucky in that he died at a ripe old age.Johan De Witt of the Netherlands was not so lucky.

    This is the coat of arms of House De Witt:

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  5. #1365
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Where the hell is Rickard anyway? The boy has been consigned to off-screen hell for two seasons or something. Is he just going to show up at the end after everyone is dead and become the King of Westeros?
    In the show, Osha said she was taking him to stay with the Umbers at The Last Hearth. You may remember Greatjon Umber - the awesome character from Season 1 who challenged Robb during dinner, had his fingers bitten off by Grey Wind (the direwolf), and then laughed it off and became one of Robb's strongest supporters. The actor took another job so we didn't see him after S1, but the character is still alive. I'm really, really hoping he returns when it's time to bring back Rickon and Osha.

    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    Also, why has no one figured out that the Sons of Harpy's are NOT nobles? But the peasant/slave groups dressed as nobles?
    Not a spoiler since the books don't say, but it's more likely the Sons of Harpy largely consist of out of work pit fighters. Or is that what you meant?

  6. #1366
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Udog View Post
    In the show, Osha said she was taking him to stay with the Umbers at The Last Hearth. You may remember Greatjon Umber - the awesome character from Season 1 who challenged Robb during dinner, had his fingers bitten off by Grey Wind (the direwolf), and then laughed it off and became one of Robb's strongest supporters. The actor took another job so we didn't see him after S1, but the character is still alive. I'm really, really hoping he returns when it's time to bring back Rickon and Osha.
    Yes, I hope they do this. In the books, the Greatjon was taken captive at the Red Wedding, and is still a Frey prisoner, but he wasn't even present at the Red Wedding in the show, so it's probable that he'll come back when it's time for Rickon to show up on the scene again.
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  7. #1367
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulcan View Post
    Yes, I hope they do this. In the books, the Greatjon was taken captive at the Red Wedding, and is still a Frey prisoner, but he wasn't even present at the Red Wedding in the show, so it's probable that he'll come back when it's time for Rickon to show up on the scene again.
    I think it's very possible, assuming the actor is available and David and Dan don't have a grudge against him for taking on different work when Season 2 was being filmed. They've shown a willingness to change the books so characters we know can introduce us to places we don't (Jamie and Bronn go to Dorne, Jaqen H'ghar at the House of Black and White), and it makes sense here as well.

    What makes this even more exciting is that last we heard, the Greatjon was leading part of Robb's army to help haze the Lannisters. Which means, if we see him again, not only will he have Rickon and Osha, but he may very well have a contingent of Robb's old army under his command as well. And never forget... the North Remembers.

    Okay, going to stop now before I get too excited about this.

  8. #1368

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    Quote Originally Posted by Udog View Post
    Not a spoiler since the books don't say, but it's more likely the Sons of Harpy largely consist of out of work pit fighters. Or is that what you meant?
    Ah, that makes perfect sense. I didn't think of it that astutely as 'out of work pit fighters'. But more generically, as a sub-group of the slaves who still believe in the old system of master-slaves/still benefit somehow from it, and who are strong enough to fight. Kind of like Spartacus and his gang, when they rebelled. Would align perfectly with the whole, 'open up the pits for the fighters who choose to fight'.

    Nice!

  9. #1369
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Between the hall of faces and that ending, that was a creepy episode.

    What exactly is Littlefinger up to?
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  10. #1370
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulcan View Post
    Between the hall of faces and that ending, that was a creepy episode.

    What exactly is Littlefinger up to?
    Oh, playing off someone against someone else.
    I have trouble thinking he'd sell Sansa off so cheaply, though; he really did love Cat.
    So I suspect he plans to dick Cersei over more.

    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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