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  1. #1351
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Where the hell is Rickard anyway? The boy has been consigned to off-screen hell for two seasons or something. Is he just going to show up at the end after everyone is dead and become the King of Westeros?
    I'm assuming he's going to become important at some point, although I'm not entirely sure how. There's some book information that I'm not sure if they're going to incorporate.



    I find the dichotomy between the two Snows really interesting. Ramsay is obsessed with title and trying to become "legitimate." Jon turns down the offer to become "legitimate" even when it's presented to him. One is obsessed with having a socially acceptable mask, while the other forges his own path and carves out his own place.
    Forget the dead you've left; they will not follow you.
    The vagabond who is rapping at your door, is standing in the clothes you once wore


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  2. #1352
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Rickon, sorry... I even lost track of his name, considering how long it's been since he appeared.

    EDIT: Oh look, I'm not the only one...
    'Game of Thrones' Season 5 will continue to ask 'Where's Rickon?' - Zap2it | News & Features

    Quote Originally Posted by Vulcan View Post
    I find the dichotomy between the two Snows really interesting. Ramsay is obsessed with title and trying to become "legitimate." Jon turns down the offer to become "legitimate" even when it's presented to him. One is obsessed with having a socially acceptable mask, while the other forges his own path and carves out his own place.
    THe apples don't fall far from the trees, I guess.

    Ramsay is looking for a way to legitimatize power to satisfy his own desires. Jon sees power as a tool to be used for the common good and finds it a heavy burden to wield. Self-full vs self-less, I guess.

    They did grow up under different circumstances: The Starks WERE the wardens of the north and had power, so Ned taught his children how to wield it according to this ethics, whereas the Boltons didn't have power but simply craved it. It's been an item of desire for them.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  3. #1353
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    I'm just waiting and hoping to see Sansa to do anything to be less passive in her role of captured princess. Also, excited to see the fallout of Daenrys's announcement to be wed to Hizdahr. She has up to yet gotten much mileage from being 'available'. I kind of want to fast forward to Tyrion joining them in Meeren, if that's to actually ever happen. Is he to manage the city while she marches on Westeros, is he meant to advise her in the offense, or maybe even command an army. That would be fun.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    I'm just waiting and hoping to see Sansa to do anything to be less passive in her role of captured princess. Also, excited to see the fallout of Daenrys's announcement to be wed to Hizdahr. She has up to yet gotten much mileage from being 'available'. I kind of want to fast forward to Tyrion joining them in Meeren, if that's to actually ever happen. Is he to manage the city while she marches on Westeros, is he meant to advise her in the offense, or maybe even command an army. That would be fun.
    Not just that, but palpable irony -- he served as the Hand of the King in Westeros, got canned because he was a dwarf and essentially run out of town, and now his wits + that experience might be used to support the invasion of Westeros by the former rulers. (A Westeros arguably ruled currently by Cersei, the sister who instigated much of this to happen because she hates Tyrion so much. It's sad when you end up biting yourself in the ass.)

    Anyway, I'm waiting too for Sansa to get in a good shot one of these times... she's just biding her time. But there is potential here for a little Stark justice... please, please, please.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
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  5. #1355
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Ramsay is looking for a way to legitimatize power to satisfy his own desires. Jon sees power as a tool to be used for the common good and finds it a heavy burden to wield. Self-full vs self-less, I guess.

    They did grow up under different circumstances: The Starks WERE the wardens of the north and had power, so Ned taught his children how to wield it according to this ethics, whereas the Boltons didn't have power but simply craved it. It's been an item of desire for them.
    Right, but Jon Snow's status with Westerosi society (given the views most people have of the Night's Watch), is probably lower than Ramsey's. Ramsey has a higher "rank" now due to being legitimized. I think if Ramsey were to show up at the wall (without taking the black), as heir to the Warden of the North, Jon Snow would be expected to pay him a certain amount of respect and homage, despite being Lord Commander.

    The thing about the Boltons also don't seem to have a clear sense of what they actually want.... the only thing they want is really more power. They don't seem to have any clue of what to actually do with that power; they just want power. They're like Littlefinger in the sense that they believe the Climb is all there is. They want to be able to say that "I'm on top," and that's basically it. (Littlefinger's motivations might be slightly different here.. I think he wants to be on top, but I think there is a part of him that actually does have some twisted affection for Sansa... perhaps he does actually believe that he's doing it for some messed up perverted version of love.)

    What's the interesting question for me is if they can stay on top that way. I mean, notice how the Stark name commands a certain respect and loyalty even among the peasants, even though the family fortunes have declined. If the fortunes of the Boltons decline, do you think the surviving members of House Cerwyn (members of which were flayed by the Boltons a few weeks ago) will display any such loyalty? It's the age old question... is it better to be feared, loved or is the dichotomy not that simple?
    Forget the dead you've left; they will not follow you.
    The vagabond who is rapping at your door, is standing in the clothes you once wore


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    Oh, I just found this:

    http://www.ew.com/article/2015/04/19...enne-interview

    Gwendoline Christie sits in a cafe in King’s Cross station in London, drinking tea and revealing her perspective on Brienne’s surprise encounter with Sansa Stark ...

    “Brienne kneels before Sansa in an exact mimic of the oath she made to Catelyn Stark,” Christie says. “And Sansa says, ‘No.’ But in the script, it says there’s the tiniest look in Sansa’s eyes. The script says the look is telling Brienne: ‘Get the f–k out of Dodge.’”

    So Sansa’s rejection of Brienne—unlike Arya’s dismissal of her last season—was probably at least partly out of concern for Brienne’s safety. “We can be romantic about it and say that, in that moment, maybe there’s a connection, some part Catelyn that’s within Sansa, that’s trying to help me, to urge me on,” Christie says. “And then there’s the horse chase, which we filmed over days. Really high-speed horse chase, through the forest, rearing the horses. Daniel Portman—Podrick —is a brilliant rider and had to fake being a terrible one...”
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #1357
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    We can be romantic about it and say that, in that moment, maybe there’s a connection, some part Catelyn that’s within Sansa, that’s trying to help me, to urge me on,” Christie says. “And then there’s the horse chase, which we filmed over days. Really high-speed horse chase, through the forest, rearing the horses. Daniel Portman—Podrick —is a brilliant rider and had to fake being a terrible one...”
    That's interesting. I had a hard time reading Sansa's expression. I think Sophie Turner has been awesome on the show, but I had a hard time grasping what was inside her head. It didn't look like fear, and it looked like there was some kind of conflict going on, but I wasn't sure what it was. She seems to have gained a sense, by being burned enough times, of what exactly she is getting into, so I suppose that I shouldn't have found it surprising that she still doesn't trust Littlefinger. Which means that the odds are good that she may come out on top. (I would love that, because nobody would have expected that back in season 1.)

    I also think Daniel Portman's character is smarter than everyone around him seems to think. Hopefully Pod gets to do something cool at some point.



    I like this part of the interview, too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gwendoline Christie
    I feel very encouraged because I think my luck in being cast in these amazing projects indicates people are wanting to see a different side of women, to see women represented in a different way, and to see a celebration of the individual. Perhaps we’re moving away from a homogenized view of society. I hope there’s more interest in exploring the edges of society, or exploring those things that seem unusual. Maybe in doing that we’ll find they’re not so unusual after all.
    Forget the dead you've left; they will not follow you.
    The vagabond who is rapping at your door, is standing in the clothes you once wore


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  8. #1358
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vulcan View Post
    That's interesting. I had a hard time reading Sansa's expression. I think Sophie Turner has been awesome on the show, but I had a hard time grasping what was inside her head. It didn't look like fear, and it looked like there was some kind of conflict going on, but I wasn't sure what it was.
    Yes, I think she's kind of inscrutable sometimes. From a character perspective I can understand it, but some actors still manage to convey things by minor expressions on the face and she's still a young actress. I couldn't read her there, and just assumed she assumed Littlefinger was still the safer risk.

    It does help to understand that scene better if you realize Sansa wasn't totally being a jerk but was looking out for Brienne. It also means Brienne (if she picked up on that) isn't just being stalking the Stark girls... she honestly feels like Sansa wants her help.

    She seems to have gained a sense, by being burned enough times, of what exactly she is getting into, so I suppose that I shouldn't have found it surprising that she still doesn't trust Littlefinger. Which means that the odds are good that she may come out on top. (I would love that, because nobody would have expected that back in season 1.)
    Yup. I really hated Sansa for quite awhile, but she has been growing rapidly in the last season and she finally has some teeth. Regardless of what happens in the end, her just being one of the small group that will remain standing will be a remarkable finish for her.

    (of course, her ineptitude at the game is one reason why she survived for so long anyway; no one viewed her as a serious threat, she was mainly a pawn who could otherwise be ignored.)

    I also think Daniel Portman's character is smarter than everyone around him seems to think. Hopefully Pod gets to do something cool at some point.
    Yeah, if he gets axed through some trivial bit of violence, I would be disappointed.

    I thought that was a great quote from Christie as well. Good for her.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  9. #1359

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    We, The North

    I've been so tempted to peek in this thread, but was avoiding it since I couldn't catch last night's episode. Finally watched it, and, wow! Valyria!
    The poem about its doom, intriguing. Wonder what happened to set that event? Maybe that will happen to Westeros?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vulcan View Post
    I'm assuming he's going to become important at some point, although I'm not entirely sure how. There's some book information that I'm not sure if they're going to incorporate.

    Hello, Mr. Cassowary (your avatar reminds me of the time my friend and I got chased by one of those mofos in Aussieland. They're assholes with an attitude problem!!! Stare at them wrong, and it's on like King Kong!)

    So, Vulcan it is; seems less threatening.

    WTF??!! Unicorns and Cannibals?? Why did you enjoy that SL so much? It seems so....random....

    Speaking of Bran, and The Children (stage whisper), wasn't it mentioned in this episode, that the Children were the only ones to defeat the Whitewalkers in the past? Or something....The Children (at the tree in the cave where we last saw ran), were mentioned in this epi. Can't remember accurately, in what context. Gah, don't feel like rewatching the whole ep. to find out exactly how they were mentioned.

    Maybe Bran is honing his skills and coming back as a surprising threat? I feel like Bran & Co., will eventually face off The Red Woman and the God of Light....

    Btw, Stannis and his insistence on being grammatically correct. LOL. Loved those little glimpses into his personality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Not just that, but palpable irony -- he served as the Hand of the King in Westeros, got canned because he was a dwarf and essentially run out of town, and now his wits + that experience might be used to support the invasion of Westeros by the former rulers. (A Westeros arguably ruled currently by Cersei, the sister who instigated much of this to happen because she hates Tyrion so much. It's sad when you end up biting yourself in the ass.)
    That's something I hope really does happen, Tyrion returning and bringing Cersei to her knees.

    Anyway, I'm waiting too for Sansa to get in a good shot one of these times... she's just biding her time. But there is potential here for a little Stark justice... please, please, please.
    At least Sansa has not illusion about the psychopath she is marrying. Seeing "reek" and what Ramsey has done to him, she knows the type of man she is dealing with. But yeah, very fearful for her and her wedding night.

    Like Ramsey's lover, I have also been admiring Sansa's fashion sense, this season. It's like Regal Gothic. Love it! Her necklace! With the pointy thick needle at the end, that she keeps clutching!!! I wonder if that will be a weapon for her, in some coming episodes? I think there's something to be said for the brief conversation about her making her own clothing. (1) That her mom lives on through her, she is remembering Catelyn, and (2) Sansa might be making some modifications to her wardrobe that has a functionality that's not apparent to the eye.....But my imagination can be running wild, too!

    Loving Sansa's story arc! And the message she got about the candle/bat signal, from Brienne!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Yes, I think she's kind of inscrutable sometimes. From a character perspective I can understand it, but some actors still manage to convey things by minor expressions on the face and she's still a young actress. I couldn't read her there, and just assumed she assumed Littlefinger was still the safer risk.
    Yes, I read it the same way.

    ****

    Jorah, your building rapport with Tyrion and getting a touch of the grayscale, and wondering if you could get him to your princess before it takes over....sigh...I might just like you yet! Fear not, apparently there is a cure for grayscale (maybe...Stannis' daughter).

    Very poetic chapter for Jon Snow! Love his dual interaction - that with Maester Aemon (that old Targaryen - love him!), and with Peter (his squire?). The Boy with his innocent idealism and the Wise old Man, and there is Jon Snow, caught between the threshold.

    Echoes of Ygritte, all around him. "You know nothing, Jon Snow." (Grow up, become the man).

    You're starting to know something, Jon Snow. It's a pleasure to see his arc now. He was boring before...kind of. Like Danerys.

    Loved the little moments of female empowerment:
    - Gilly's little speech/comeback to Samwell's patronization.
    - Danerys and her right-hand maid (lover of Greyworm - they're so cute!) having that conversation. Bechdel Test, kinda pass there! I don't trust Daario as far as I can throw him! Now with Selmy gone, I'm glad she is marrying that Noble, will make Daario's position less 'secure'.
    - Danerys 'asking' for the noble's hand in marriage....
    - Sansa's sarcasm at dinner!
    - Brienne, always, all the time, 24/7, whenever she is on screen!!

    Also, why has no one figured out that the Sons of Harpy's are NOT nobles? But the peasant/slave groups dressed as nobles?
    Last edited by Qre:us; 05-11-2015 at 11:31 PM. Reason: mixed up Rickon & Bran

  10. #1360
    El Papagayo Osprey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us
    So, Vulcan it is; seems less threatening.
    Yes... I like the name because of the web of associations. There's the Star Trek reference, and also the fact that Vulcan was the Roman equivalent of Hephaestus.
    WTF??!! Unicorns and Cannibals?? Why did you enjoy that SL so much? It seems so....random....
    Well, a little nonsense now and then is treasured by the wisest men. In truth, there were other aspects of the storyline that I liked. I'm not going to say more because it's possible that they may work it in next season somehow.

    Speaking of Bran, and The Children (stage whisper), wasn't it mentioned in this episode, that the Children

    were the only ones to defeat the Whitewalkers in the past? Or something....The Children (at the tree in the

    cave where we last saw ran), were mentioned in this epi. Can't remember accurately, in what context. Gah,

    don't feel like rewatching the whole ep. to find out exactly how they were mentioned.
    There are a few different legends circulating about the defeat of the White Walkers. One does relate that, yes, the Children of the Forest played an important role.

    Maybe Bran is honing his skills and coming back as a surprising threat? I feel like Bran & Co., will

    eventually face off The Red Woman and the God of Light....
    Bran will be important... I'm not sure how, though. Incidentally, Bran in Welsh means raven.


    Also, why has no one figured out that the Sons of Harpy's are NOT nobles? But the peasant/slave groups dressed as nobles?
    That's an excellent question. I'm not sure that the books ever touched on that.

    I've been so tempted to peek in this thread, but was avoiding it since I couldn't catch last night's episode. Finally watched it, and, wow! Valyria!
    The poem about its doom, intriguing. Wonder what happened to set that event? Maybe that will happen to Westeros?
    I think Westeros is going to deal with a major ice zombie apocalypse. By the rules of rising dramatic tension, that Wall's gotta go down at some point, and the wights and White Walkers will start spreading through the seven kingdoms, munching on brains as they go. What appears to have happened to Valyria seemed to be something quite different.

    Read on for some background info:

    Forget the dead you've left; they will not follow you.
    The vagabond who is rapping at your door, is standing in the clothes you once wore


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