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Thread: Dragon Age II

  1. #131
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Did Hawke's mom die? I can't remember if I avoided that in my game timeline, I don't remember it happening. I know that some of the other characters could avoid their fates if certain actions were or were not taken.
    Yeah, in a gruesome way at that.

    I really think the game was written to make you sympathetic to Templars. You either get betrayed or see firsthand how unreasonable or sick the average Kirkwall mage is. Meridith plays up this angle too with your mother to get you on her side. And if that isn't enough, you find out that the First Enchanter was behind your mother's death all along.. that his whole "innocent mage" act was a lie. He's a blood mage way before the final battle (Hope you don't mind these spoilers.. I'm assuming you've moved on from playing the game again).

    The only good reason (imo) to side with the Circle is if you were a warrior or rogue and Bethany is locked up there.

  2. #132
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Yeah, in a gruesome way at that.

    I really think the game was written to make you sympathetic to Templars. You either get betrayed or see firsthand how unreasonable or sick the average Kirkwall mage is. Meridith plays up this angle too with your mother to get you on her side. And if that isn't enough, you find out that the First Enchanter was behind your mother's death all along.. that his whole "innocent mage" act was a lie. He's a blood mage way before the final battle (Hope you don't mind these spoilers.. I'm assuming you've moved on from playing the game again).

    The only good reason (imo) to side with the Circle is if you were a warrior or rogue and Bethany is locked up there.
    Actually, I don't remember any of this happening, and the First Enchanter (I think) was actually helpful to me. (I ended up killing Meredith, at the end.) Either my memory is pretty horrific for the endgame, or my story played out very differently from yours... But it could easily be my memory. Honestly, it just became a "hack and slash" for me by the end, I was playing a rogue.

    I tried to play through it a second time and got bored. I'm Rift'ing instead.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  3. #133
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Actually, I don't remember any of this happening, and the First Enchanter (I think) was actually helpful to me. (I ended up killing Meredith, at the end.) Either my memory is pretty horrific for the endgame, or my story played out very differently from yours... But it could easily be my memory. Honestly, it just became a "hack and slash" for me by the end, I was playing a rogue.

    I tried to play through it a second time and got bored. I'm Rift'ing instead.
    Hmm.. well, it is Bioware. Heh. I thought this game was more linear than others, but I guess there are a lot of flags towards the end where it could play out in many different ways.

    I assumed both Meredith and the First Enchanter would be boss battles for everyone.

    EDIT: In any case, I think my Hawke played out much like Iron Man in the Civil War story arc comics. In that (huge) story, superheros and their general collateral damage on the population has gotten so out of control that the government calls for registration measures. Otherwise, they're labeled criminals. Tony Stark decides to support it, and gets into a big war with the other side.. led by Cap America.

  4. #134
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    The game was quite forgettable.

    And there is a reason the mages were acting loony and the templars were acting equally so, and why Kirkwell was crazy to begin with. It's a hidden quest (Fucking retarded for what maybe the most important information in this game.) that includes you gathering pieces of history around Kirkwell throughout the game. It's not on your journal, and you can't see how well your doing, there's no reward or even a cutscene. I can't even begin to pretend to know how to explain it adequately however so instead I'll direct you to the link and a quote.

    And no this isn't spoiling. These are literally impossible to find without a guide. No way in hell you would have found these on your own, you wouldn't even know you were looking for them.

    The Band of Three

    The Enigma of Kirkwall

    Archaeologist

    I'll try to paraphrase it.

    During the Tevinter Imperium in Kirkwall, a large number of slaves would disappear every year. Though Kirkwall was a slave-trading hub and required large numbers of slaves in order to work the mines, the Band notes that roughly one of every ten slaves went missing, a disproportionately high number.

    During their research, the Band found some disturbing records about Kirkwall's architecture. The city's sewers have grooves that lead downward, apparently for blood sacrifice. They note that blood magic from a simple cut is already very powerful, and could not understand why the Imperium needed blood magic on the scale of thousands of slaves a year.

    Eventually, the Band's research culminates in the discovery that the Imperium had been deliberately weakening Kirkwall's already thin Veil, though they do not know for what purpose. It can be inferred from the notes that Kirkwall's design was intended to be used as part of a blood ritual to do this, perhaps in order to summon demons like the Forgotten Ones.
    Kirkwell is a giant demon summoning ground. You'll also notice that the happiest people in the game are the people who are sending you letters from outside of Kirkwell, people who left, or never arrived. This summoning circle makes it far easier for mages to become possessed and turn to demons. This in of itself is problem alone but there's the idea that Templars are kind of dicks on top of that. The best solution is the solution never presented in the game, because no one had the chance likely as you don't figure out the mystery till during the final mission and it's not brought up in conversation. The game is lose-lose situation where all the players are idiots who deserve it anyways with the exception of the Hawke family and Varric. That was kind of the point. To present a situation where no one is right, but shit will happen regardless of what you do.

  5. #135
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Hmm.. well, it is Bioware. Heh. I thought this game was more linear than others, but I guess there are a lot of flags towards the end where it could play out in many different ways.

    I assumed both Meredith and the First Enchanter would be boss battles for everyone.
    I remember fighting Meredith outside, as my final fight, but I'm wondering if I ended up fighting the F.E. inside after fending off Meredith's army.... I might have had to kill both of them.

    EDIT: In any case, I think my Hawke played out much like Iron Man in the Civil War story arc comics. In that (huge) story, superheros and their general collateral damage on the population has gotten so out of control that the government calls for registration measures. Otherwise, they're labeled criminals. Tony Stark decides to support it, and gets into a big war with the other side.. led by Cap America.
    Yeah, I saw that.

    The opening was freaking nuts, and then... well... can I say, "Holy Norse Clones, Iron Man!" and "OOooooh, the giant man is toast!"

    Only an ubergeek moron like Reed Richards would have cloned a norse God and thought he could control him. YEeesh.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  6. #136
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    If this refreshes your memory, if you side with mages, you hold off some Templars, but First Enchanter Orsino gives in to despair after the first wave and says "If they're gonna label us blood mages, I might as well give them what they want"... He ends up freaking out and becoming a giant abomination. So, basically, he's a boss fight before Meridith even if you side with the mages, I think.

    So yeah.. the whole mage thing is a clusterfuck even if you're sympathetic to them. They just turn on you. While the only templar who's out of control is Meridith.

  7. #137
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    If this refreshes your memory, if you side with mages, you hold off some Templars, but First Enchanter Orsino gives in to despair after the first wave and says "If they're gonna label us blood mages, I might as well give them what they want"... He ends up freaking out and becoming a giant abomination. So, basically, he's a boss fight before Meridith even if you side with the mages, I think.
    Yeah, that sounds right, now.
    I was on his side, but he basically became scum anyway, and I had to kill him.

    ... blood mages. Ew.

    I still remember the blood mage fun from DAO, where someone ended up dying no matter what solution you took, in the process of saving Eamon.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  8. #138
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Yeah, that sounds right, now.
    I was on his side, but he basically became scum anyway, and I had to kill him.

    ... blood mages. Ew.

    I still remember the blood mage fun from DAO, where someone ended up dying no matter what solution you took, in the process of saving Eamon.
    Oh there's one way to avoid that.. Umm.. I think you just have to save the Circle. Side with the Circle first, and you can go back to First Enchanter Irving. He can supply enough lyrium to enter the Fade and save everybody. Otherwise it becomes a big grey area thing where you have to kill the kid or let Jowan kill Connor's mom to supply enough blood to enter the Fade. But yeah, that sucks if that ends up your only option.

  9. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Oh there's one way to avoid that.. Umm.. I think you just have to save the Circle. Side with the Circle first, and you can go back to First Enchanter Irving. He can supply enough lyrium to enter the Fade and save everybody. Otherwise it becomes a big grey area thing where you have to kill the kid or let Jowan kill Connor's mom to supply enough blood to enter the Fade. But yeah, that sucks if that ends up your only option.
    Darn. I don't think I ever found that option, and I had played it a few ways.

    Yeah, that's what happened... either Conor died, or his mom died. And they were all kind of complicit, so there wasn't a real great answer for any of it. (Which, actually, was realistic. Aside from the whole demons-sucking-your-soul/bloodmagic-plot, of course.)
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #140
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Speaking of other grey areas, my favorite part is Loghain. My first time through I killed him.. it seemed like the game was setting him up as the big bad, but when I revisited, I let him go and made him a Grey Warden. I wish I had done it before.. it such an awesome ending if you decide to let him kill the archdemon. It's like Darth Vader redeeming himself. I think I might have shed a tear for the guy. lol

    And now that I've got the books, I see even further that killing him was wrong all along. Loghain is the shit.

    Of course, this has nothing to do with DA2 or Blood Magic.

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