WORLD CUP 2010

[copperfish17]

SO EXCITED FOR GERMANY VS ARGENTINA.



I'M TYPING IN ALL CAPS.

 

[Ginkgo]

Soccer sucks because I suck at soccer. Go away.

 

[tcda]

Argentina!? When did you forget that England was the land of hope and glory!?

YouTube - England Football - Land Of Hope And Glory

lol I have always supported Argentina, I didn't 'forget' anything.

 

[copperfish17]

Soccer sucks because I suck at soccer. Go away.

I suck at soccer too!

Slovakia VS Netherlands tonight!

 

[MacGuffin]

x-post w/ INTPc

This made me laugh:

The Slippery Slopers: Luddite Cassandras. Worry that any introduction of replay technology will send us spiraling downward to the point where all games will eventually played by soulless robots, just like pro golf. Argue that as soon as you start reviewing goals, you'll start reviewing offsides, then yellow cards, and then Diego Maradona's suits, and pretty soon you're wrestling Mr. Maradona on the floor at a press conference, and he's actually still very strong, but at least he smells like flowers and chocolate-chip cookies.

Mmm... chocolate chip cookies! That's what cocaine smells like?

I at least understand why the offsides goal in the Argentina-Mexico game was allowed to stand. There's chaos in front of the goal, and the official loses track of the offsides player and a goal is scored. What I don't understand is when nothing happens (like the two disallowed USA goals) and the official makes a phantom call. WTF are they looking at? Missing a call is more understandable than inventing one.

 

[onemoretime]

Soccer sucks because I suck at soccer. Go away.

No u.

 

[tcda]

Football is a game of continuity. If the ball bounces out of the goal, then play continues. How can you stop the game to review it by video? It's against the nature of the game. Or otherwise you elt them play on while it's being reviewed, but what if the defending tema got up to an attacking position, or if there was a bad foul, corner, free kick, etc.? You jsut cancel them out?

It's even worse with offside because the referee doesn't know if the offside player will score or not. So what, they'll just not call offside, hoping they score so they can review it?

 

[MacGuffin]

Football is a game of continuity. If the ball bounces out of the goal, then play continues. How can you stop the game to review it by video? It's against the nature of the game. Or otherwise you elt them play on while it's being reviewed, but what if the defending tema got up to an attacking position, or if there was a bad foul, corner, free kick, etc.? You jsut cancel them out?

Yes, cancel it out (except yellow/red cards). Half the time the game is stopped anyway with players celebrating an illegal goal.

It's even worse with offside because the referee doesn't know if the offside player will score or not. So what, they'll just not call offside, hoping they score so they can review it?

What?

 

[PeaceBaby]

I don't agree that once you review goals, the rest will follow. I think the NHL has it right - video goal judging (and only that) has been permitted in hockey for about 8 years now:

Instant replay is only used by the NHL to review goals. Specifically, the video goal judge is only empowered to determine if:

the puck completely crossed the goal line
the puck was hit into the net with a hand or a high stick, or was kicked in
the puck entered the net before the net was knocked off its moorings
the puck was in before the period ended

The replay judge must find conclusive evidence to overturn the original call made by the referee on the ice.

The officials in each game still have live jurisdiction on all other calls.

Actually, it seems primitive to not review goals. The technology exists, other sports have gotten past the hurdles of implementation and this knowledge of what works and what doesn't would benefit FIFA in minimizing pitfalls and shortening the learning curve tremendously if they were to adopt the practice.

The trick would be to have a specific or even stringent set of circumstances whereby replay is allowed.

But anyway, just my 2 cents on that one.

 

[tcda]

Yes, cancel it out (except yellow/red cards). Half the time the game is stopped anyway with players celebrating an illegal goal.

The other team keeps playing.

And how would you restart?

What?

Didn't your mother ever teach you "don't say 'what', say 'pardon'"?

What I mean is that if you let video technology judge offside goals, then the linesman won't call marginal offside decisions, or even if he does the ref won't blow for offside, because they will prefer to wait in case there is a goal, to review it.

But this will be a problem if the offside player doesn't score, but does win a corner/free kick/penalty. Then the defending team which shpuld have had a free-kick, will now have to defend free kick/corner/penatly. Which they could concede from. (unless you then go back and review the original offside, which would be a joke).

 

[PeaceBaby]

Offside also exists in hockey ... if it's missed it's missed ... doesn't affect video review.

The KEY is to establish WHAT is reviewed, what circumstances will prompt a review.

The difficulty of course in football (soccer) is that offside can occur anywhere on the field of play, as opposed to hockey with a defined blue line which readily defines what is on or offside, thereby effectively negating it (most of the time) from the equation.

 

[MacGuffin]

The other team keeps playing.

And how would you restart?

However it would've happened if the ref had gotten the call right in the first place.

Didn't your mother ever teach you "don't say 'what', say 'pardon'"?

What I mean is that if you let video technology judge offside goals, then the linesman won't call marginal offside decisions, or even if he does the ref won't blow for offside, because they will prefer to wait in case there is a goal, to review it.

But this will be a problem if the offside player doesn't score, but does win a corner/free kick/penalty. Then the defending team which shpuld have had a free-kick, will now have to defend free kick/corner/penatly. Which they could concede from. (unless you then go back and review the original offside, which would be a joke).

The linesman should call the game correctly to begin with. If he is incompetent, replace him.

This isn't rocket science.

 

[tcda]

PeaceBaby - so in hockey there are no calls for video to be used for offside calls?

I have no idea I'm just asking. I know in football there are already many such calls.

However it would've happened if the ref had gotten the call right in the first place.

This happens all over the ptich with all kinds of decisions. It's the nature of the game, it's a game of continuity, not a game with stoppages built in. That is what makes it the most accessible sport.

The linesman should call the game correctly to begin with. If he is incompetent, replace him.

It won't happen if you introduce video refereeing for offside goals. The referees and linesman will not risk calling a dubious offside if they can fall back a video decision in the case of a goal. To use your own words back at ya :

This isn't rocket science

 

[MacGuffin]

This happens all over the ptich with all kinds of decisions. It's the nature of the game, it's a game of continuity, not a game with stoppages built in. That is what makes it the most accessible sport.

We're just talking about goals here.

It won't happen if you introduce video refereeing for offside goals. The referees and linesman will not risk calling a dubious offside if they can fall back a video decision in the case of a goal. To use your own words back at ya :

They will if they are replaced by refs that do make the correct offsides calls.

 

[PeaceBaby]

PeaceBaby - so in hockey there are no calls for video to be used for offside calls?

That's right, just goals.

Was just thinking about this ... in football (soccer) the problem is that offside applies at the moment the ball is passed, not at the moment the ball is received.

So the officials have to have their eyes in two places at once, like this guy: ...

 

[compulsiverambler]

I am looking forward to the Argentina match. If we manage to break Messis legs in the first half we have clear chances, otherwise it hopefully will be a great soccer match .

If you do the aggressor will probably get away with a 'stern talking to' the way things have been going. The referees seem to think that if someone doesn't fall down and stay down, no foul has been committed. That's why there's so much diving in the sport IMO.

AFP: Germans eager to tame vibrant Messi

Now they take on Diego Maradona's Argentina in Cape Town on Saturday and according to midfielder Sami Khedira, the key will be to contain Messi, the world footballer of the year and Argentina's talisman.

"Messi is a difficult player to play against, if not the best in the world, there is no way one player can keep him at bay for the full 90 minutes," he said after Messi helped his side to a 3-1 win over Mexico in their last 16 match.

"It will be a team effort and we may have to put several players on him.

I think that might be a mistake. The quality of the other forward Argentine players has been underestimated and as we saw yesterday, when several players collect around Messi he just serves as a decoy and passes to his teammates left open. The Greek tactic (assigning him his own highly focused man-marker) seemed the most effective to me. Messi did lure him away but because it was only one player it didn't make much difference, as our commentator said they just cancelled each other out of the game. I'm glad the Germans don't intend to copy though because it's no fun to watch and I'm not sure what the team could do about it if it caught on.

 

[PeaceBaby]

They will if they are replaced by refs that do make the correct offsides calls.

This replacement does take place ... after a game that's considered poorly officiated, some of these guys aren't invited back to ref another match.

The difficulty of offsides in soccer would be solved with either a zone (as in hockey) that defines where any player is allowed to be at the moment of entering the opposing player's "side" OR changing the call to the receipt of the ball, rather than the striking of it.

Personally, I think soccer fans just love to argue calls anyway, so it would take away from all the fun.

Edit: I want to use this emoticon again ...

 

[JocktheMotie]

I always get scared of the highly skilled/finesse teams against Germany. They're very much a "system" team/defense and are thus weak to players who have a lot of individual skill that can create something out of nothing. If you're Germany, I think you have to go into this match thinking that you're going to concede 2 goals, so they better score 3.

 

[Fluffywolf]

Damnit.

 

[PeaceBaby]

I also have the solution to world peace, if anyone is interested.