Training Day = ENTJ

[DiscoBiscuit]

That whole thing was Alonzo's plan (except being beat of course).

That movie is like ENTJ gone wrong to the max.

 

[Billy]

I can agree with that, he had a very ends justify the means type of thing, while still finding a way for him to come out on top in general over his associates whom looked up to him like an authoritative figure. Very ENTJish.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

"you've been planning this all day?"

"I've been planning this all week."

 

[Billy]

There really isnt much admirable about the way he planned it out though, I see NTJs do it that way here and there when they aren't especially virtuous, they just hold all the cards really secret and have the composure not to let their game slip, and then they manipulate the chess pieces. I watch my mentor do it all the time, he is a master at it.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

The key is not use this skill for ill gotten gains.

 

[corey_vann]

I'll have to watch and take notes, so as not to make the same mistakes.

 

[Riva]

Only 5 replies to such a great movie? Very disappointing. And also, Alonzo a ENTJ? That is even more disappointing. Planning doesn't make one an NTJ. The Way Alonzo planned things all along wasn't a think things through master plan. It was more of a 'this is what I want, so lets make things up as I move along' kind of a plan. I would say XSTP.

 

[Riva]

Improviser, that's what Alonzo is. Not a mastermind planner. Yes he did say -

"you've been planning this all day?"
"I've been planning this all week."

He probably did have it planned. As I mentioned above it was more of an idea as to what he WANTED. He just improvised as he moved along. To do what Alonzo did one needs to have great improvisational flexibility, not mastermind planning.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I still fail to see how Alonzo could be anything but an ENTJ.

[YOUTUBE="guA9tO0rrXI"]Smoke this[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Riva]

I still fail to see how Alonzo could be anything but an ENTJ.

I can't change the way you see brother. I can tell you how I see it though. That's what I pointed out.

I should mention that Denzel's superb authoritative acting does seem ENTJish. But as ISTPs mature (learn to manipulate with Fe) and when Fe gets developed (I would say pass the age of 35) they sure do seem a lot extroverted than they are, and more controlling they become.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I have a hard time seeing an ISTP becoming quite so self involved.

 

[FDG]

I really don't think so. It seems to be more EST, in my opinion. Of course every ENTJ is different, so I might just be a particularly non-impulsive, non-aggressive ENTJ...(but I don't think so).

 

[Riva]

I have a hard time seeing an ISTP becoming quite so self involved.

Haven't seen a self involved XSTP? That's shocking.

Off Topic.
Appearance vise ESTPs appear more self involved than ISTPs. But I've noticed that ESTPs seem to have warmer hearts than ISTPs. Maybe that's due to ISTPs having a hugher tendency of being a bit anti social. (I didn't mean the sociopath anti social, just meant not social.)

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

At one point, Alonzo talks about Hoyt having the "Magic Eye", and how this will allow Hoyt to replace Alonzo if he so desires.

What Alonzo is talking about here, is Hoyt's ability to see what is actually going on regardless of the situation, like when Hoyt noticed the girl being attacked, and his general distrust of Alonzo.

Hoyt, had strong enough gut instincts not to trust Alonzo, and that's what Alonzo liked.

This kind of intuition and especially the comment about the "magic eye" reeks of ENTJ to me.

 

[Riva]

This kind of intuition and especially the comment about the "magic eye" reeks of ENTJ to me.

Gut instinct reeks out SPs. SPs love gut instinct more that deductive conclusions. Now a NT would prefer a conclusion based on deduction rather than a gut instinct. NTs would just die and try to pull their own brains out as to why they received that instinct (what I mean here is conclusion.) An SP would rather not care too much and tag along until they would arrive at the conclusion. (They would arrive at the conclusion as the pieces to the puzzle are found.)

But anyway I should also point out that SPs (XSTPs) love to know and admire instinctual grasp in themselves and in others. And I should also point out that telling Hoyt that he has the Magic eye would not indicate any type. I just pointed out the above to show a different view point to you.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Do a point by point analysis of why Alonzo is an STP.

I haven't closed my mind to any possibilities, but you will have to prove me wrong.

 

[Riva]

I did post the reason, in the improviser post. (That was mainly to prove that he's a improviser and not a mastermind planner.)

Do a point by point analysis of why Alonzo is an STP.

Do a point by point analysis as to why you believe he's a ENTJ.

Anyway there is no point of doing so. I prefer to interpret the facts than make a point by point analysis. Besides an interpretation is what we can make out of the facts pointed out. Non could arrive at a definite conclusion.

But,

From the facts you pointed out, it is easier to interpret that he is an SP than a NTJ.

 

[IZthe411]

ENTJ- Te Ni Se Fi
XSTPs- Ti Se Ni Fe

I agree it could be either, I'll have to take another look at the movie. Both arguments are good- but remember this is a character- not a real person.

 

[Riva]

Hmmm... I wonder what Denzel's type is?

 

[Robopop]

Ethan Hawke's character was probably an ISFP to constrast Alonzo(ENTJ).