PDA

View Full Version : Shadow Types



KDude
09-15-2010, 05:17 AM
Any characters that coincidentally fall into shadow behavior?


Commodus-ENTJ/ISFP
Sarah Connor-ISFP/ENTJ
Tony Soprano - ESTJ/INFP
Sweeney Todd-INFP/ESTJ
Smeagol/Gollum - ESFP/INTJ
Hannibal Lector - INTJ/ESFP (looks like inferior Se to me :rolleyes:)
Anakin Skywalker-ENFP/ISTJ
General Ripper-ISTJ/ENFP
Holden Caulfield - INTP/ESFJ
Angel/Angelus-INFJ/ESTP?

Sol_
09-19-2010, 09:33 AM
Melkor - ESTP
Sauron - ISTJ
:)

You
09-19-2010, 08:01 PM
Tony Soprano?

Aleksei
09-20-2010, 03:31 PM
Sauron is ENTJ.

Shadow characters... hmmm...

A case could be made that Patrick Jane has fallen into his perception shadow (ENTP to INFJ), but it's not very strong. Light Yagami (Death Note) has a perfect INTJ stress-shadow pattern (he becomes a raging beast under duress), but that's probably not accidental. Death Note characters fall within the confines of their types so well that I suspect someone in the writing staff studied MBTI.

Anakin Skywalker is NOT an ENFP. :dry: There's little in that series that's more obvious than Anakin's blatant Se.

KDude
09-20-2010, 03:50 PM
Actually, the more I think of it, whatever the types, Anakin was the shadow, and Vader the good version.

.

You
09-20-2010, 05:36 PM
Sauron is ENTJ.

Shadow characters... hmmm...

A case could be made that Patrick Jane has fallen into his perception shadow (ENTP to INFJ), but it's not very strong. Light Yagami (Death Note) has a perfect INTJ stress-shadow pattern (he becomes a raging beast under duress), but that's probably not accidental. Death Note characters fall within the confines of their types so well that I suspect someone in the writing staff studied MBTI.

Anakin Skywalker is NOT an ENFP. :dry: There's little in that series that's more obvious than Anakin's blatant Se.

No one that kills anything is ever an ENFP?

Aleksei
09-20-2010, 06:30 PM
No one that kills anything is ever an ENFP?
There are plenty of villainous ENFPs out there -- Anakin is just not one of them (not that he's really villainous anyway). Every skill Anakin has is Se-derived; he's a master mechanic, an ace pilot, and a swordsman able to take on an army single-handedly.

KDude
09-20-2010, 07:35 PM
Yeah, but that's all part of the nature of the setting/story. When the average Jedi can do a lot of that, you have to look at characterization more closely. If that's how you'd determine his type, you'd have to say that all Jedi's are Se too. They are not. In terms of character however, he speaks more like some brooding version of NF idealism. He constantly brings up the future, argues more about the theoretical side of things rather than concrete problems, talks of big galactic-sized dreams with Padme, wants to change the Jedi Order, the Republic, even death itself, and ends up falling into the trap of someone who says he can deliver it all to him.

Aleksei
09-20-2010, 07:44 PM
Yeah, but that's all part of the nature of the setting/story. When the average Jedi can do a lot of that, you have to look at characterization more closely.
The average Jedi is an ace pilot and mechanic? :huh:


If that's how you'd determine his type, you'd have to say that all Jedi's are Se too. They are not.
Well, they actually are. Most Jedi are ENFJ or INFJ -- but nevertheless Se is still part of his characterization. He greatly enjoys working with his hands, and is a highly impulsive thrill seeker.


In terms of character however, he speaks more like some brooding version of NF idealism. He constantly brings up the future, argues more about the theoretical side of things rather than concrete problems, talks of big galactic-sized dreams with Padme, wants to change the Jedi Order, the Republic, even the nature of death itself, and ends up falling into the trap of someone who says he can deliver it all to him.
His intuition takes more the form of grand-scale Ni idealism however, which is actually quite common among ISFPs. ISFPs, in fact, are remarkably intuitive, almost indistinguishable from their N counterparts. I'd go so far as saying ISFP is the most idealist of all types.

KDude
09-20-2010, 07:51 PM
I left the SP temperment because I felt I was too idealistic :blush: A confusing enough subject to make me the wrong person to talk to ya about that.

Aleksei
09-20-2010, 07:54 PM
I left the SP temperment because I felt I was too idealistic :blush:
You made a big mistake thinking of your type in terms of temperament. ;) Frankly, ISFPs don't really belong in the Artisan temperament group -- most are Healers.

KDude
09-20-2010, 08:02 PM
Not just in terms of temperment. I'm different than Stepho, Jeffster, Wolfy, Blackcat, Quinlan, etc.. (of course, they're all different from each other too.. I'm just saying that I'm not very Se like they are. I haven't "enjoyed the moment" since Aug. 18, 1986).

Aleksei
10-08-2010, 03:37 PM
I think Patrick Jane shifted into his shadow -- transformed from an ENTP to an INTJ after his family was murdered.

Trentham
10-08-2010, 04:01 PM
There are plenty of villainous ENFPs out there -- Anakin is just not one of them (not that he's really villainous anyway). Every skill Anakin has is Se-derived; he's a master mechanic, an ace pilot, and a swordsman able to take on an army single-handedly.
Plus he's a daredevil and risk-taker. Definite Se.

Jennifer
10-08-2010, 04:09 PM
Any characters that coincidentally fall into shadow behavior?

Commodus-ENTJ/ISFP
Sarah Connor-ISFP/ENTJ
Anakin Skywalker-ENFP/ISTJ


Nice call on these three. I had never even really considered it from this angle before, but it's definitely there.

Aleksei
10-08-2010, 04:29 PM
Anakin is not a goddamn ENFP.

You
10-15-2010, 08:07 AM
Yeah. He's an ENFP

skylights
10-15-2010, 09:21 AM
^ i remember when you used to be an interesting poster :/


anyway, yeah, i dunno about anakin. he was supposed to be so good at all those skills because of his off-the-charts midichlorian count, wasn't he?

stuff from the wiki... i'd quote it, but italicized walls of text suck. anyway:

"As a young adult, Skywalker developed as an arrogant and somewhat socially awkward boy, doubtless in part because of his rapid transition from a scrapyard slave to rising star of the Jedi Order. His natural abilities placed him leaps and bounds above his peers which fed his ego and caused him to distance himself from other learners his age. He frequently showed off, chafed against authority, and displayed little respect for Kenobi, whom he partially viewed as inferior. Despite this perception, he stated that Kenobi was like a father to him, and claimed that Kenobi had the wisdom of Master Yoda and the power of Master Windu. This praise, however, may have been just another expression of Skywalker's arrogance, as he amended that he himself was "beyond" Kenobi in many ways, and felt Kenobi was holding him back from his true potential. His relationship with his master remained complicated and contradictory, partially due to Kenobi's doubts about whether he had the ability to train Skywalker, something the boy did not need, especially during that critical time in his life. Frustrated, Skywalker would turn to another mentor for advice: Supreme Chancellor Palpatine.

As a young boy, Skywalker was thoughtful and intelligent. He was friendly and easily got along with others despite his status as a slave. He also had a special place in his heart for his mother, whom he constantly built inventions to sell or to use to lighten her workload. At the coming of the Jedi, he was both helpful and generous; doing all that he could to help them off-planet, risking his life at the podrace as well as giving them the sizable reward money which he and his mother would have had use for. Though lovable, he also was one to carry grudges and was vengeful, but he commonly held these two traits in check. He also hated being treated unjustly or being wrongly accused. He was fiercely loyal, doing anything to keep those he was close to from harm, at any cost. His only price for this dedication was loyalty in return.

His separation from his mother was the hardest thing he'd ever done, and it still hurt him for years. Because of his fear of losing even more friends in such a manner, he kept to himself, fiddling around with his only friends, the Temple droids. During this, however, he grew especially close to Kenobi, considering him a father and a role model. Due to his sudden escalation from slave to being known as the "Chosen One" and the rising star of the Jedi Order, pride and arrogance set in. He grew cocky, self-appreciating, and he grew to hate being reprimanded or lectured.

He was naturally honest and despised lying and deception, and especially hated politics, correctly considering most politicians to be greedy and self-conceited. Kenobi's continual self-consciousness when it came to Skywalker hurt the boy, who at times wasn't sure whether Kenobi liked him, something his heart craved. Therefore, he turned to a more complimenting, comforting source: Palpatine.

His yearning to be loved, as well as appreciated, came out in his devotion and secret marriage to Amidala, one of the only three people he ever thought appreciated or cared for him. As his fame grew, he became more and more arrogant, and he knew that he was one of the best Jedi of the Order, believing that he could easily best any Jedi blindfolded with his lightsaber tied behind his back. This coupled with his frustration at his perceived injustice at being kept at the rank of Jedi Knight made him more and more bitter and distrustful of the Jedi Council. His belief in them was shattered more and more as Skywalker's closest friend, Palpatine, swayed him from trusting them. Slowly, his bond with everyone except the Chancellor was completely shaken and broken, even that of his wife when he assumed her betrayal of him. Born out of this conflict was the Dark Lord of the Sith, Darth Vader."

this shadow stuff is cool. i go ISTJ when i'm hyper stressed out.

RaptorWizard
09-03-2012, 02:36 PM
You made a big mistake thinking of your type in terms of temperament. ;) Frankly, ISFPs don't really belong in the Artisan temperament group -- most are Healers.

You could make a similar argument that ISTPs don't really belong in the Artisan termperament group -- most are architects. It seems that ISFP and ISTP are separated from all of the rest of the sensors!

Reverie
09-05-2012, 08:36 PM
Fight Club's narrator=INFJ/ ESTP shadow=Tyler Durden