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  1. #21
    Earth Exalted Thursday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riva View Post
    I'm having a hard time understanding this. He's saying not to have goals but to have a system? Does he mean something like an affirmation?The examples he gave were too specific. The only clear part was what the ceo he met in the flight had to say.Could you elaborate a bit? I like to hear what you have to say. Give an example. @kyueii you can add your two cents to it; the mantras. While you are at it please explain to me how to pronounce your username :p. Does he mean affirmations? I personally don't put deadlines to my goals. Simply have them written down and go through them to feel the need and to remind myself to look for opportunities.
    Mantras such as "I must give my empathy and understanding so that it helps both of us, no further" or "building the empire brick by brick, choose wisely"
    I N V I C T U S

  2. #22
    Senior Member Bamboo's Avatar
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    Is goal accomplished?
    Yes or no.

    Is goal being worked toward at present moment?
    Yes or no.

    Is goal being worked toward as a trend?
    Yes or no?




    If you just ask the first question, you're might think you're a loser any time the answer isn't yes.

    But that'd be pretty short sighted.

    Failure or losing would probably be better assessed with the last question, up to the point where you can no longer accomplish the goal (deadline past) and by default you fail.
    Don't know how much it'll bend til it breaks.

  3. #23
    Earth Exalted Thursday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamboo View Post
    Is goal accomplished?
    Yes or no.

    Is goal being worked toward at present moment?
    Yes or no.

    Is goal being worked toward as a trend?
    Yes or no?




    If you just ask the first question, you're might think you're a loser any time the answer isn't yes.

    But that'd be pretty short sighted.

    Failure or losing would probably be better assessed with the last question, up to the point where you can no longer accomplish the goal (deadline past) and by default you fail.
    This for the win
    I N V I C T U S

  4. #24
    Senior Member Bamboo's Avatar
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    But one thing I like to think about is that a 'system' is a way of doing something consistantly.

    If you try and blast off like a rocket at a large, multi-part goal, you're probably going to fall flat.

    So in that sense, you should establish a system to break things down and get them done over time rather than just saying "do this! get it done!". You'll break down eventually if you don't break your goals down first.




    Again, referring to my above post, I think you have to look at your progress in the short term and as a trend overall too.
    Don't know how much it'll bend til it breaks.

  5. #25
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamboo View Post
    But one thing I like to think about is that a 'system' is a way of doing something consistantly.

    If you try and blast off like a rocket at a large, multi-part goal, you're probably going to fall flat.

    So in that sense, you should establish a system to break things down and get them done over time rather than just saying "do this! get it done!". You'll break down eventually if you don't break your goals down first.
    One of the biggest problems with processes is that people often fail to revise or replace them as time goes on and needs and circumstances change. They set up a process that works for awhile, or produces a few good results, and assume it will do so for all time. Their effort in creating the process to begin with seems to make them want to preserve it as-is, and they become invested in it for its own sake rather than for what it can (possibly no longer) do.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  6. #26
    Anew Leaf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    One of the biggest problems with processes is that people often fail to revise or replace them as time goes on and needs and circumstances change. They set up a process that works for awhile, or produces a few good results, and assume it will do so for all time. Their effort in creating the process to begin with seems to make them want to preserve it as-is, and they become invested in it for its own sake rather than for what it can (possibly no longer) do.
    This is something important I have sort of touched upon at times in life but never quite got it deeply.

    I just read a fabulous book the other night and it talked about failure as one point. And pointed out that if you fail at something it has nothing to do with yourself but the method that failed. So create a new method based on the new info and try again.

    I know that that will be self evident to some people but it wasn't to me as I take too much to heart when it comes to myself and failure.

  7. #27
    Senior Member Bamboo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    One of the biggest problems with processes is that people often fail to revise or replace them as time goes on and needs and circumstances change. They set up a process that works for awhile, or produces a few good results, and assume it will do so for all time. Their effort in creating the process to begin with seems to make them want to preserve it as-is, and they become invested in it for its own sake rather than for what it can (possibly no longer) do.
    True, the bad thing about humans is we can form habits.

    But the good thing is we can form habits.

    Well made systems enhance efficiency in the environment they were designed for. Change the environment, and they stop working right. Never make it right to begin with and garbage in, garbage out.

    So part of the system needs to be monitoring the environment for changes. When it does, form a new habit.
    Don't know how much it'll bend til it breaks.

  8. #28
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamboo View Post
    True, the bad thing about humans is we can form habits.

    But the good thing is we can form habits.

    Well made systems enhance efficiency in the environment they were designed for. Change the environment, and they stop working right. Never make it right to begin with and garbage in, garbage out.

    So part of the system needs to be monitoring the environment for changes. When it does, form a new habit.
    We need a meta-process for analyzing and optimizing our processes.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  9. #29
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    Different strokes, I guess?

    He makes the assumption that it's inevitable to feel like a loser if you don't reach your goal. Shoot for first on such-and-such a Top 100 list, and you might get sixth. That's still pretty damned impressive.

    In addition, setting a goal can serve as a motivator for you to figure out a process to use to get there. Often, you can set the goal and (almost) forget it. (It's still worth reminding yourself once in a while that the calendar, scale, or GPA still exists.)

    edit:
    And..
    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    @bologna mentioned somewhere about adjusting your inner perspective by imagining yourself as the kind of person who does whatever accomplishment is embodied in your goals. You progress, then, not by looking at some distant target, but by comparing your small decisions in the moment with such a person. (I hope I am restating this correctly.) This seems useful, but mostly in getting yourself out of a rut of perpetual failure and disappointment. Once you become that person who can do whatever, it is time to decide what to do with your newfound attitude, confidence, and skills. This is where more traditional goal-setting can productively come back into play.

    From my own perspective, goals give me something to focus on, keep me accountable to myself, and break up my dreams into manageable pieces, which I can then realize one by one.
    .. yup, I still stand by this process, especially for getting out of a rut.


    Let's also throw some quotes around:
    “When it is obvious that the goals cannot be reached, don't adjust the goals, adjust the action steps.”
    --Confucius
    Not always the prudent thing to do; but, hey, it's worth a try.

    /xxxJ-talk, I guess

  10. #30
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    I think the book Mastery: the keys to success and long term fullfillment by George Leonard, says it much better.

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