User Tag List

First 21011121314 Last

Results 111 to 120 of 163

  1. #111
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    MBTI
    ISFP
    Enneagram
    2 so/sx
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    why do women's preferred styles tend to involve so much more exposed skin than men's? I don't mean just cleavage/neck, but arms and legs as well (and feet - women seem to wear sandals much more often at work) I have long wondered that.
    Dress code policies and general social acceptance of work attire are discriminatory against men in certain ways.

    This case comes to mind.

    If I could I also would wear sandals and shorts, no tie, etc.

  2. #112
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    enfp
    Enneagram
    8
    Posts
    13,881

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Some people don't choose anything, but live with their head in the sand, and simply reap the rewards of everyone else's effort and risk-taking. The fact that you can't do everything doesn't justify doing nothing. If everyone picked just one area and gave it their best effort, the world would be a better place. We don't need everyone to stop playing the gender game at work, or to attend the civil rights rally, for progress to occur, but if I can count those who do on one hand, it probably won't. Moreover, once the first few start, others are often more willing to join in, since they won't be alone, and the trail has been blazed.
    All very true points. But in THIS aspect, what women's rights entail is COMPLETELY different. To me, a woman is not going to be respected no matter how she dresses. The point is NOT that dressing differently will get us where we need to be--it doesn't even fall close into the realm of it. And there are plenty of women who feel that women before us fought very hard for our ability to expose our chests in some way--since men expose theirs all the time without regard, while women were forced to cover up their entire bodies. I'm not the only woman that thinks that covering up one's own body for the pleasure of other men is NOT helping women's rights. I know there are women that don't cover it for other reasons, but I really don't care about those women.. they won't be the ones that help 'the cause' anyways.

    I don't think someone is a slut, or destroying women's rights, because they wear a low-cut shirt that looks good on them. Clothing has WAY too much emphasis. The fact that people think about what others wear to THIS extent in the first place, and particularly women, just proves that there's nitpicking about NOTHING. People are focusing on whether women expose a portion of their breasts or not, like that matters in comparison to the SLEW of unprofessional behaviors that take place in the workplace. People are pickin' at the peas and forgetting the meat because the peas are more brightly colored and convenient for pushing around.

    My mom wears cleavage-revealing outfits. It was not unprofessional looking, it helped her look taller, and it drew the eye to the neckline to help people conveniently draw their eyes away from her stomach area. There was nothing sexual about it; it just looked a lot better with her body type. She's a big-chested woman, it made more sense to wear something free-flowing and fitting with a hint of cleavage than to try desperately, and it does look desperate, to cover it up and hide it.

    I wear low-cut tops at times too, even though I happen to lack any hint of cleavage. I serve my country, volunteer my time, recycle, and try to give back to my community.. I focus on those battles.. they're the part I think I will do some real good in. I don't see how listening to someone else's opinion, especially that of a man's as if they've always thought that our mentalities are equal, of what I should wear and covering myself up means that I'm somehow fighting for my own rights and respect. The irony of it is ridiculous.

    Yes, there is definitely a double standard about attire and bodily exposure. Assuming, for the sake of discussion, that no form of dress creates distraction in the workplace, and that all workers choose their individual style based on what makes them feel comfortable and by implication more productive: why do women's preferred styles tend to involve so much more exposed skin than men's? I don't mean just cleavage/neck, but arms and legs as well (and feet - women seem to wear sandals much more often at work) I have long wondered that.
    Go to a traditional muslim country for a year. And then come back and tell me why women wear more exposed skin. It is human nature that to cover up is to be modest, calmer, quieter, and more submissive. Why would I ever want to give off ANY of these qualities, even in subtle hints, at the workplace where I am barely respected anyways? Clothing, especially to all the people saying it means so much about professionalism and shit like that, implies things. Yes, a bit of cleavage implies something sexual SOMETIMES.. It also implies confidence, and individuality, being comfortable in one's own body, and proud of one's appearance. If a woman feels more confident by looking a bit sexier, she's going to do her work with more confidence because she's in that mentality. Those statistics posted in the thread reinforce that entirely. So why begrudge them so much?

    Why does it bother you that women feel more confident with more skin exposed?

  3. #113
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    enfp
    Enneagram
    8
    Posts
    13,881

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Istbkleta View Post
    Dress code policies and general social acceptance of work attire are discriminatory against men in certain ways.

    This case comes to mind.

    If I could I also would wear sandals and shorts, no tie, etc.
    The opportunities you gain just from being a man far exceed the clothing standards.

    Men in the army complain constantly about physical fitness standards being lower for women--Why should they only have to do 20 push-ups to pass and get a ton of time on their run? :c Its not fair!! They always cry about it.

    But I don't hear a single man cry that I cannot go to Ranger school. Or any of the other opportunities in the army that men are afforded simply for being men, where my performance doesn't matter one bit. They always cry that women only want equal rights when it is convenient for them.. but men are the exact same way.

    It's give and take. Ya'll nestled yourself in this little niche. I promise you it was not women as a whole that put clothing standards on society. Men have the upper hand in society as a whole.. this I am still certain of.. it would be easy for ya'll to change it right now, before things balance out more and become more equal.. But for some reason, ya'll don't rally together and make it so. You're content, and complacent with what you have, because the little battles like wearing a tie don't really matter--you have enough. This is not the same for women.. little battles are better than winning no battles.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
    Halla74: Think your way through the world. Feel your way through life.

    Cimarron: maybe Prpl will be your girl-bud
    prplchknz: i don't like it

    In Search Of... ... Kiwi Sketch Art ... Dream Journal ... Kyuuei's Cook book ... Kyu's Tiny House Blog ... Minimalist Challenge ... Kyu's Savings Challenge

  4. #114
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    MBTI
    STP
    Posts
    10,501

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    The opportunities you gain just from being a man far exceed the clothing standards.

    Men in the army complain constantly about physical fitness standards being lower for women--Why should they only have to do 20 push-ups to pass and get a ton of time on their run? :c Its not fair!! They always cry about it.

    But I don't hear a single man cry that I cannot go to Ranger school. Or any of the other opportunities in the army that men are afforded simply for being men, where my performance doesn't matter one bit. They always cry that women only want equal rights when it is convenient for them.. but men are the exact same way.

    It's give and take. Ya'll nestled yourself in this little niche. I promise you it was not women as a whole that put clothing standards on society. Men have the upper hand in society as a whole.. this I am still certain of.. it would be easy for ya'll to change it right now, before things balance out more and become more equal.. But for some reason, ya'll don't rally together and make it so. You're content, and complacent with what you have, because the little battles like wearing a tie don't really matter--you have enough. This is not the same for women.. little battles are better than winning no battles.
    Men are a bunch of whiney babies...me, me, me. Just like people who whine because they pay higher taxes. So and so gets food stamps...well quite your job, have a bunch of kids and file. The way I see it is if someone makes you work harder you grow faster and become stronger at a faster pace then if you didnt have to work harder. To many people like to whine about other people.
    Im out, its been fun

  5. #115
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    enfp
    Enneagram
    8
    Posts
    13,881

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by _Poki_ View Post
    Men are a bunch of whiney babies...me, me, me. Just like people who whine because they pay higher taxes. So and so gets food stamps...well quite your job, have a bunch of kids and file. The way I see it is if someone makes you work harder you grow faster and become stronger at a faster pace then if you didnt have to work harder. To many people like to whine about other people.
    I tend to say that a lot too.. People are always "Im so inconvenienced by the actions of others!" "Well, why don't you do the same thing?" "No way! I don't want to live like that!"

    Theyll claim its principles and morals.. as if poor people don't have those things.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
    Halla74: Think your way through the world. Feel your way through life.

    Cimarron: maybe Prpl will be your girl-bud
    prplchknz: i don't like it

    In Search Of... ... Kiwi Sketch Art ... Dream Journal ... Kyuuei's Cook book ... Kyu's Tiny House Blog ... Minimalist Challenge ... Kyu's Savings Challenge

  6. #116
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,594

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Istbkleta View Post
    Dress code policies and general social acceptance of work attire are discriminatory against men in certain ways.
    Exactly. A dress code that requires only men wear ties is just as discriminatory as one that requires only women wear skirts/dresses instead of trousers.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    All very true points. But in THIS aspect, what women's rights entail is COMPLETELY different. To me, a woman is not going to be respected no matter how she dresses. The point is NOT that dressing differently will get us where we need to be--it doesn't even fall close into the realm of it. And there are plenty of women who feel that women before us fought very hard for our ability to expose our chests in some way--since men expose theirs all the time without regard, while women were forced to cover up their entire bodies. I'm not the only woman that thinks that covering up one's own body for the pleasure of other men is NOT helping women's rights. I know there are women that don't cover it for other reasons, but I really don't care about those women.. they won't be the ones that help 'the cause' anyways.
    While the highlighted may be true, the topic here is not women's rights or reception in the workplace overall, but the effects of exposing cleavage at work, or more broadly, certain forms of women's attire. If, as you say, it has no net effect on the respect accorded women at work, does it make any difference, then, how a woman dresses? I don't know where you work, but I have never worked in any setting where men were allowed to bare their chests. We're not talking about string bikinis or even toplessness at the beach here, but about dressing in a professional setting.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    I don't think someone is a slut, or destroying women's rights, because they wear a low-cut shirt that looks good on them. Clothing has WAY too much emphasis. The fact that people think about what others wear to THIS extent in the first place, and particularly women, just proves that there's nitpicking about NOTHING. People are focusing on whether women expose a portion of their breasts or not, like that matters in comparison to the SLEW of unprofessional behaviors that take place in the workplace.
    We are focusing on revealing women's attire because that is the topic of the thread. That does not mean that those of us replying to the OP think about this all the time, or focus on it at the expense of more significant workplace issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    Go to a traditional muslim country for a year. And then come back and tell me why women wear more exposed skin. It is human nature that to cover up is to be modest, calmer, quieter, and more submissive. Why would I ever want to give off ANY of these qualities, even in subtle hints, at the workplace where I am barely respected anyways? Clothing, especially to all the people saying it means so much about professionalism and shit like that, implies things. Yes, a bit of cleavage implies something sexual SOMETIMES.. It also implies confidence, and individuality, being comfortable in one's own body, and proud of one's appearance. If a woman feels more confident by looking a bit sexier, she's going to do her work with more confidence because she's in that mentality. Those statistics posted in the thread reinforce that entirely. So why begrudge them so much?
    First, I had assumed this thread was discussing workplaces in western societies, given the types of attire described. Obviously, customs and expectations in Muslim societies will be much different. Second, I disagree in your assessment of human nature's role in covering up. It is also human nature to want protection from the elements, and simple privacy, which covering up facilitates. Also, some of the greatest female exposure is found in situations where women are not respected at all, but objectified for sex purposes. In any case, modesty and calmness are usually desirable in the workplace. If demonstrating these does not enhance one's respect more, demonstrating their opposite certainly will not.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    Why does it bother you that women feel more confident with more skin exposed?
    I did not say it bothered me. I said I was curious as to why women seem to prefer exposing more skin than men in professional or formal situations. Consider the photo below of the Obamas and Bidens from the 2008 Democratic Convention. Politics aside, most would agree that all four of them are tastefully and not inappropriately dressed, yet the women show much more exposed skin than their husbands. This seems to be both generally accepted, and individually preferred by those two women. In fact, sleeveless dresses have become a fashion trademark of Mrs. Obama. If her husband tried to go sleeveless in the same situations, however, I doubt it would be so well received.

    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  7. #117
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Posts
    2,968

    Default

    Everyone should wear a fire suit and a gas mask.

    And carry an axe. And a flamethrower.

  8. #118
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Posts
    2,968

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    The opportunities you gain just from being a man far exceed the clothing standards.

    Men in the army complain constantly about physical fitness standards being lower for women--Why should they only have to do 20 push-ups to pass and get a ton of time on their run? :c Its not fair!! They always cry about it.

    But I don't hear a single man cry that I cannot go to Ranger school. Or any of the other opportunities in the army that men are afforded simply for being men, where my performance doesn't matter one bit. They always cry that women only want equal rights when it is convenient for them.. but men are the exact same way.

    It's give and take. Ya'll nestled yourself in this little niche. I promise you it was not women as a whole that put clothing standards on society. Men have the upper hand in society as a whole.. this I am still certain of.. it would be easy for ya'll to change it right now, before things balance out more and become more equal.. But for some reason, ya'll don't rally together and make it so. You're content, and complacent with what you have, because the little battles like wearing a tie don't really matter--you have enough. This is not the same for women.. little battles are better than winning no battles.
    At least women make better fighter pilots.

  9. #119
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    enfp
    Enneagram
    8
    Posts
    13,881

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Exactly. A dress code that requires only men wear ties is just as discriminatory as one that requires only women wear skirts/dresses instead of trousers.
    These two comparisons are very much so similar, and are a better comparison than women exposing their chests vs men. I don't see the reason for women being forced to wear skirts or men forced to wear ties or bowties--but I have to wear high heels and skirts regardless of how comfortable I feel in them to events where men are allowed to wear pants, and I feel the same sort of envy.

    While the highlighted may be true, the topic here is not women's rights or reception in the workplace overall, but the effects of exposing cleavage at work, or more broadly, certain forms of women's attire. If, as you say, it has no net effect on the respect accorded women at work, does it make any difference, then, how a woman dresses? I don't know where you work, but I have never worked in any setting where men were allowed to bare their chests. We're not talking about string bikinis or even toplessness at the beach here, but about dressing in a professional setting.
    And my point is that the topic goes beyond simply, "is it good or bad that they expose their chests at work?" The issue is much deeper than that. It's about women not being cornered into what men think is appropriate attire. As I stated before, businesses lay out what they find appropriate, but usually they do not touch the subject of cleavage because women's body types and styles are very finicky issues. They are so because of women's rights movements and the push for equality in the workplace.

    It can just as easily be asked, "If it has no net effect, why stop it?" But it DOES have an effect on women. How they dress does effect them. The picture you posted shows modest, but fashionable attire--it also shows a lot of skin on the arms and legs. I don't understand how that is so much more professional than something that covers nearly everything but has a lower cut on the neck. Women's fashion in the work place is different from men--if men really want it so equal, maybe they ought to start branching out and wearing less and getting away with more and pushing the subject into a full blown revolution. That's what people do when they want change--they make it happen. But men aren't going to do that anytime soon--all in all, they're content with their lot in life, annoyances and all. Women were not so content, and years later the changes are showing.

    We are focusing on revealing women's attire because that is the topic of the thread. That does not mean that those of us replying to the OP think about this all the time, or focus on it at the expense of more significant workplace issues.
    I wasn't so much thinking about the replies to the OP when making that statement, I meant people as in the general populous. Even the replies, including my own, had some very strong feelings behind it.. so regardless of thinking about it all the time, the thought that is put into it is very strong. People went out of their way to say that EVERY woman showed cleavage to get the attention of men that they came across--a fact I find hard to believe but I cannot testify otherwise for their particular scenario. Many people were very strongly against it--and brought up that things like that were destroying women's rights movements, taking steps in the wrong direction, and that it was generally disruptive.

    It is a lot of very strong opinion put into something that, in truth, is really no one's business except the company with it's policies and the women dressing themselves.

    First, I had assumed this thread was discussing workplaces in western societies, given the types of attire described. Obviously, customs and expectations in Muslim societies will be much different. Second, I disagree in your assessment of human nature's role in covering up. It is also human nature to want protection from the elements, and simple privacy, which covering up facilitates. Also, some of the greatest female exposure is found in situations where women are not respected at all, but objectified for sex purposes. In any case, modesty and calmness are usually desirable in the workplace. If demonstrating these does not enhance one's respect more, demonstrating their opposite certainly will not.
    The question was posed why would women dress in that manner. My answer was simply because we can. We live in a culture where we aren't *forced* to cover ourselves up, and seen as degrading if we don't try at all costs to live completely modest lives. Many women are very grateful for that fortune, and are not going to give it up anytime soon.

    There are some situations that, unfortunately, most men are not going to completely acknowledge and understand are simply different for women. Yes, modesty and calmness is admired in some work situations. But certainly not all. A quiet, modest office cubicle working with nice, sweet people all around them is not the only professional institution in which women find themselves working. You really don't see how many people see modest attire, and a quiet demeanor in a woman, and assume they can walk all over them because they assume they lack a backbone and the confidence to retaliate. I've dealt with it on several occasions, and even my modest male friends were not picked on in the same way I was. I'm sorry, but if you cannot accept that there are some situations males simply do not deal with in the professional environment, then there isn't more I need discuss with you. The difference is there, and the equality is not as equal as we'd like it to be. It is leaps and bounds from where it was--but with a long way to go.

    No one is complaining and in a huge uproar about a pepsi commercial being on in the office with a girl in a bikini. But a woman with cleavage is somehow a disaster in the workplace? I refuse to believe the matter is that simple. The matter is a deep one, and seated with a lot of bias and strong opinions about women's looks in general, not just cleavage and not just in the workplace.

    I did not say it bothered me. I said I was curious as to why women seem to prefer exposing more skin than men in professional or formal situations. Consider the photo below of the Obamas and Bidens from the 2008 Democratic Convention. Politics aside, most would agree that all four of them are tastefully and not inappropriately dressed, yet the women show much more exposed skin than their husbands. This seems to be both generally accepted, and individually preferred by those two women. In fact, sleeveless dresses have become a fashion trademark of Mrs. Obama. If her husband tried to go sleeveless in the same situations, however, I doubt it would be so well received.
    My apologies. The tone seemed like one of annoyance, since your post had a "well, men deal with discrimination of clothing too, so why do women get away with so much?" tone to it.

    I find all of those attires appropriate. I also find polo shirts, suits without a tie, suits without a jacket, and golf shorts very professional looking and appropriate. I don't create the fashion do's and don'ts in society (probably a good thing), but I do know if men wanted to break out of their fashion box of a measly 4 choices (jeans and t-shirt, polo and slacks, suit, tuxedo) they simply would do so. Women get daring, wear something crazy, and then support is backed until it is a normal thing. Change doesn't come simply because someone says a tie is annoying. You have to really, truly want the change to occur, and push for it. I don't see men doing that is all. Whereas women obviously put a lot of value into the clothing they wear and how it affects their mentalities in the workplace. The stances are different, and thus socially acceptable attire is different.

    Which I am okay with.. but I am not okay with someone telling a woman that a portion of her body is inappropriate and that she cannot wear the same clothing as someone smaller-chested than her just because she was born with a different lot. What is cleavage-revealing for one girl is not at all for another. It's hard to make a dress code without offending someone in a professional environment--and why go through all that painstaking trouble anyways just for a bit of cleavage that, in the grand scheme of things, isn't that big of a deal? The amount of effort that would take, you might as well make a blanket dress code (which many businesses do), or work on issues that actually need addressing.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
    Halla74: Think your way through the world. Feel your way through life.

    Cimarron: maybe Prpl will be your girl-bud
    prplchknz: i don't like it

    In Search Of... ... Kiwi Sketch Art ... Dream Journal ... Kyuuei's Cook book ... Kyu's Tiny House Blog ... Minimalist Challenge ... Kyu's Savings Challenge

  10. #120
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,594

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    And my point is that the topic goes beyond simply, "is it good or bad that they expose their chests at work?" The issue is much deeper than that. It's about women not being cornered into what men think is appropriate attire. As I stated before, businesses lay out what they find appropriate, but usually they do not touch the subject of cleavage because women's body types and styles are very finicky issues. They are so because of women's rights movements and the push for equality in the workplace.
    The highlighted is far too simplistic. Many of the expectations about appropriate women's attire come from other women, just as expectations for men's attire often come from other men. Girls learn what is considered appropriate from mothers, aunts, older sisters, female teachers, etc. You might argue that the standards originally were made by men. I don't know if this is certain, but the older generations of women have to large degree embraced them and willingly pass them on. Similarly, men are held to expectations, too, whether an official dress code at work, or informal advice from a supervisor, or peer pressure. A man who won't wear a suit and tie at a big law firm is probably as out of step as a woman wearing a sundress and sweater.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    It can just as easily be asked, "If it has no net effect, why stop it?" But it DOES have an effect on women. How they dress does effect them. The picture you posted shows modest, but fashionable attire--it also shows a lot of skin on the arms and legs. I don't understand how that is so much more professional than something that covers nearly everything but has a lower cut on the neck. Women's fashion in the work place is different from men--if men really want it so equal, maybe they ought to start branching out and wearing less and getting away with more and pushing the subject into a full blown revolution. That's what people do when they want change--they make it happen. But men aren't going to do that anytime soon--all in all, they're content with their lot in life, annoyances and all. Women were not so content, and years later the changes are showing.
    I did not say these outfits are more professional than, say, a pantsuit with a low-cut blouse. In fact, I personally find them less so.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    You really don't see how many people see modest attire, and a quiet demeanor in a woman, and assume they can walk all over them because they assume they lack a backbone and the confidence to retaliate. I've dealt with it on several occasions, and even my modest male friends were not picked on in the same way I was. I'm sorry, but if you cannot accept that there are some situations males simply do not deal with in the professional environment, then there isn't more I need discuss with you. The difference is there, and the equality is not as equal as we'd like it to be. It is leaps and bounds from where it was--but with a long way to go.
    And a woman who is not calm can be considered overly emotional. Calmness is not timidity, meekness, or even silence. It is maintaining self-control, even when tempers flare; keeping a clear head when all hell breaks loose. If a woman lets others use her as a doormat, it is not because she is calm and modest, just spineless. Of course true gender equality has not yet been achieved yet, and until more women are willing to step outside those stereotypes and expect more for themselves, it won't be.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    I find all of those attires appropriate. I also find polo shirts, suits without a tie, suits without a jacket, and golf shorts very professional looking and appropriate. I don't create the fashion do's and don'ts in society (probably a good thing), but I do know if men wanted to break out of their fashion box of a measly 4 choices (jeans and t-shirt, polo and slacks, suit, tuxedo) they simply would do so. Women get daring, wear something crazy, and then support is backed until it is a normal thing. Change doesn't come simply because someone says a tie is annoying. You have to really, truly want the change to occur, and push for it. I don't see men doing that is all. Whereas women obviously put a lot of value into the clothing they wear and how it affects their mentalities in the workplace. The stances are different, and thus socially acceptable attire is different.
    So why don't men buck the trends? On the one hand, you say women take advantage of the freedom to be more daring about what they wear; on the other, you say they are overly constrained by the expectations of men. These observations are contradictory. Men, by contrast, have a much narrower range of what is considered acceptable attire, but feel less constrained by that? None of this makes sense.

    Part of the problem is that there are several questions entangled in this discussion:

    1. To what degree should attire be constrained in the workplace?

    2. Is itt unfair discrimination for dress codes to be different for men and women?

    3. What drives broader (non-professional) expectations for male and female attire?

    4. Is the whole issue of clothing more important to women than to men, and if so, why?

    5. What drives the clothing choices women (and men) make when they are completely free to follow their own desires?
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO