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  1. #1
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    Default Career Changers! Share your stories and advice!

    Hello all, I've noticed there are lots of people on MBTIc (which makes sense) who are exploring 2nd or 3rd careers and/or are back at school, particularly in the late 20s-mid 30s age range.

    I thought it would be nice to have a thread dedicated to career explorers and jumpers and 2nd chancers to just share and give input.

    For me, I did the trad 4 year college thing straight out of highschool, had no idea what I wanted to do, graduated, had too many things I wanted to do to the point of paralysis, bummed around for a year or two (or three...), fell into a sales/marketing/pseudo consulting track, and now BAM I'm back in school and floundering again. I think it's partly an ENFP thing.

    I was wondering how other people decided on their jumps and the steps they are taking/have taken to get there?

    I'm stilll kind of in the early crossroads stages and I feel I have to make the jump soon or I'm just going to go back to default work to have direction.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

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  2. #2
    Senior Member LostInNerSpace's Avatar
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    I currently work as a software developer. I am also a part time trader. I've been trading for about seven years. I started trading just after the tech bubble popped.. That was painful. I traded my capital down to zero serveral times through one of the worst bear markets in history. But I learned a lot. There's a saying in the markets that any fool looks like a genius in a bull market. I just incorporated my business. I plan to build and sell analytical software, but I've gone into debt investing in my business so I plan to generate cash flow by training and mentoring new aspiring traders.

    Also working on (towards) a CFA.

  3. #3
    Senior Member creativeRhino's Avatar
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    CzeCze,

    like you, I did the basic degree that (back then) found me overqualified/under specialised for the job market. I did "stopgap" work and travel for 5 years then decided that if I wanted to keep travelling (or do many of the things I wanted to) a higher income was needed. Also the thought of doing the boring admin work I was doing for 30 more years scared me....

    So I turned my (early 1980s) hobby of computers into my career. I did a post grad diploma and then spent 17 years getting the $ I wanted, but struggling to get the time I wanted to do the things I wanted to do.

    I had 4 options I looked at at that point - computing, librarianship (I loved research/books) and some more corporate generalist roles - but picked computing because it paid more and was just a "new industry" then. I morphed my way from being a real techie to management stuff. Research is important, and if in doubt do some short courses to find out if something is interesting enough (or even what you expected!)

    I found myself ejected just after the dot-com crash. So I experimented with many "just jobs" and short term consulting/mentoring etc. I decided to do a serious "downshift". Then yet another hobby took over (ceramics) so I did a diploma and have just finished that and am trying to work out what is "next" - probably a mix of old tech/management stuff and the art.

    It sounds corny, but you really have to do something as close as possible to what you want to do in life. Waking up and dreading the day is a lousy way to spend life. I've seen what it does to people over 20-40 years. If one really has to do something incompatible with their desires then they need to keep their work and personal life well separated psychologically - see it as a means to an end... money to do the things they want to do.

    Two lessons I've learnt -
    keep $ spending low as possible and
    avoid as much debt as possible (education and housing are OK)


    Essentially live below your means and you can take "risks" in life like career and lifestyle changes.

  4. #4
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    I'd like to hear from more people--even if they haven't figured out where they're going yet. It's good stuff to hear at 21 years old and undecided.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  5. #5
    Senior Membrane spirilis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LostInNerSpace View Post
    I currently work as a software developer. I am also a part time trader. I've been trading for about seven years. I started trading just after the tech bubble popped.. That was painful. I traded my capital down to zero serveral times through one of the worst bear markets in history. But I learned a lot. There's a saying in the markets that any fool looks like a genius in a bull market. I just incorporated my business. I plan to build and sell analytical software, but I've gone into debt investing in my business so I plan to generate cash flow by training and mentoring new aspiring traders.

    Also working on (towards) a CFA.
    Heh, I just started trading in the past ~4 months or so. Hopefully I started at the right time... (down a bit, but certainly not '0')

  6. #6
    Senior Member LostInNerSpace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spirilis View Post
    Heh, I just started trading in the past ~4 months or so. Hopefully I started at the right time... (down a bit, but certainly not '0')
    Best thing you can do for yourself is to stop live trading and signup for a free forex practice account. The hardest thing about trading is the psychology. Most people lose money until they have developed the necessary psychological conditioning to avoid feeling the pain of loses and the over confidence of gains. It's never bad to take some money off the table even if you feel you will be leaving money on the table. Just remember that the markets are an all you can eat buffet of opportunity. Practice for a couple of months in a free practice account, then go to a live account. You will see a world of difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by creativeRhino View Post
    It sounds corny, but you really have to do something as close as possible to what you want to do in life.
    I agree. My passions are business and the financial markets.

    Quote Originally Posted by creativeRhino View Post
    Two lessons I've learnt -
    keep $ spending low as possible and
    avoid as much debt as possible (education and housing are OK)

    Essentially live below your means and you can take "risks" in life like career and lifestyle changes.
    I've done the opposite. I've taken very big risks and gone into a lot of debt investing in myself. It's definitely not for the faint of heart. I have an incredible amount of inner confidence that I am on the path to success. I rarely doubt myself. On the rare occasion that I do feel some self-doubt it will be if I'm getting spanked in the markets or not making quick enough progress towards my goals, but that self-doubt will last all of five minutes before I snap out of it.

  7. #7
    Senior Member creativeRhino's Avatar
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    LostInNerSpace

    I should have been more specific. Consumer debt (for household goods etc) what I was talking about - "bad debt", not the "better debt" that is for investment in real assets.

    Kiyosaki (of "Rich Dad,Poor Dad" fame) puts it well - "turning cash into trash" -and his other line bears remembering -

    "Assets feed you, liabilities eat you".

    Shares/Stocks during the late 90s got me in a good position financially. I've lived through 3 major low points in the stock market and tend to dip out a bit earlier than the most brave just before bubbles burst - but I haven't managed to end up having to hold shares for years to wait for them to even recover. Nobody goes broke taking a profit.
    Share trading is a great way to build wealth if you have discipline and are prepared to "go deep" to understand the stocks and the market, otherwise it is just gambling.

  8. #8
    Senior Membrane spirilis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LostInNerSpace View Post
    Best thing you can do for yourself is to stop live trading and signup for a free forex practice account. The hardest thing about trading is the psychology. Most people lose money until they have developed the necessary psychological conditioning to avoid feeling the pain of loses and the over confidence of gains. It's never bad to take some money off the table even if you feel you will be leaving money on the table. Just remember that the markets are an all you can eat buffet of opportunity. Practice for a couple of months in a free practice account, then go to a live account. You will see a world of difference.
    I've noticed; the psychology of trading and investing is downright brutal, and is NOT for the faint at heart. Luckily a healthy dose of patience and some common sense go a very, very long way. Sometimes you really have to close the window/look away from the terminal and forget about things for a while, and assume you will be okay based on faith alone.

    I decided when I first got into stocks that I wanted to write some software to help me research them, as much as an exercise in the mechanics of stock trading as for the usefulness of the tool. I have a simple "paper trading" system on a home machine that I can access remotely and I use a combination of "paper trading" and real trading. One of the more effective techniques I've found is to "paper trade" a stock first, then track its progress and get an intuitive understanding of the general pattern behind its trading, then trade it for real if/when I see a good opportunity. I made a decent 30% return on a stock within 1 week using this method, although I haven't done much with the trading in a few weeks.

    I can say that I've definitely found a small niche of motivation in approaching the stock-trading world from a computer-oriented perspective, using my intermediate programming skills to the best benefit I can put forth.

  9. #9

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    This make me wonder (new topic?)....How many people are learning to trade on the side? and in what markets? What technichals? What strategies (long, short, credit, debit, beta netral, delta neutral...more buzz-words I bearly understand)?

    I already do some long-mid term investing, and have been learning to trade stop-options for some time (but I have done very little actual trading, practicing with paper trades and back testing).

    I am facsinated by the "market makers" and the "box" trade. The box probably isn't a good mony making strategy, but as an alternate means of closing a spread seems very illustrative.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post

    For me, I did the trad 4 year college thing straight out of highschool, had no idea what I wanted to do, graduated, had too many things I wanted to do to the point of paralysis, bummed around for a year or two (or three...), fell into a sales/marketing/pseudo consulting track, and now BAM I'm back in school and floundering again. I think it's partly an ENFP thing.

    I was wondering how other people decided on their jumps and the steps they are taking/have taken to get there?

    I'm stilll kind of in the early crossroads stages and I feel I have to make the jump soon or I'm just going to go back to default work to have direction.
    Or maybe an NF thing?

    I did pretty much the same thing as you. Went to college for 5 years (transferred schools after sophomore year), graduated and fell into management/sales due to a job I had during college & HATED it. I've travelled a bit after realizing how much I hated my career and now after flip flopping between going back to school for teaching or nursing, I've FINALLY decided upon Nursing and I start in the fall. I plan on hopefully working in the ICU or NICU for a while and possibly eventually switching over to being a Hospice nurse. I want to be there for others to comfort them when they need the comfort the most, I guess. It's very satisfying to me.

    My biggest struggle was between doing something that made me enough money to support myself & live comfortably and doing something where Ifelt I had a purpose. In my career out of college, I felt as though I wasn't being authentic & I had problems with essentially not having a purpose or helping other people. Now that I'm working towards a career in a helping profession, I feel SO much more fulfilled and better about myself in general.

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