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  1. #31
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    I personally am trying to aim for a field where I can work with a variety of tasks/instruments so that I can keep on doing it for a long time while still being challenged (quant finance). I would hate to jump from position to position, I prefer to have a type of "stable progression" in my life. That's just a preference, though.
    Things can progress without being procedurally obvious.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  2. #32
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    Things can progress without being procedurally obvious.
    Yeah, you're right, it's just my personal...feeling, I guess. It might be caused by J's need for more control-structure over their life (or rather, delusion of control, since many outcomes are still governed by fate).
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  3. #33
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    It's hard for SFJs.

    I've just been talking to one who is very close to me, who is basically being run through the wringer at a place where she has worked loyally for ten or more years. She was always dedicated, more than the other employees and even most of the managers, although she was only office staff; and I had discussed with her how she was giving them far more than they were giving her; but she just has an insanely strong work ethic.

    Now they are trying to basically run her out, as far as either of us can tell, by increasing her work hours past what they know she can handle and/or doesn't want, taking away duties that were hers and that she did well and giving them to less qualified people, etc. I think it's because they pay her too much for the nature of her position, and in that business they really don't want overqualified or overdedicated staff due to the bottom line.

    She is absolutely devastated and even bitter, she spent a long time in denial and then just wondering how they could do such a thing to her. Being practical and persistent, she did her best to make her needs known to them and was promptly rebuffed, and now she's been looking for other work while jumping through these hoops until she has an escape route but...

    ... no, there is no such thing as company loyalty.

    I learned that lesson very early in my career, and I also was fairly pragmatic to begin with. But loyalty is everything to her; she gave them her best, which was SO better than what many others gave...and they devalued her contributions, in her mind, now.

    SFJ just usually has this expectation of devotion, commitment, and relational fairness. Even when someone breaks faith, it seems very difficult for them to accept the change and move on. Change is strongly resisted. Even when the other side is faithless, the stronger ones STILL try to adhere to their OWN promise of fidelity.

    .... as for me, now that I have gotten past some massive lack of self-confidence issues, I'm much more pragmatic. My basic plan is to see the ship sinking early, and have an exit strategy planned... but as my self-confidence continues to increase, I start looking for better ships to sail on even if my old one is running okay. I won't leave people in the lurch but I won't hesitate much to go to a better place for me, nowadays. I just want to keep things FAIRLY stable once I'm there and make sure there are no leaks in the boat that might catch me off-guard.
    Yes, you got it. I suppose that SFJs are idealists and think that employers will be loyal to them just as they are to their employers. They learn otherwise the hard way once they are laid off or replaced, but probably not before then. The is one of the reasons why SJ's tend to favor working in the public sector.

  4. #34
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Yeah, you're right, it's just my personal...feeling, I guess. It might be caused by J's need for more control-structure over their life (or rather, delusion of control, since many outcomes are still governed by fate).
    Men make plans. God laughs.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  5. #35
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    Best summer of my adult life, layed off with a package. I could have stayed, but really didn't like the organization.

    Had a job lined up with a previous employer, and took the whole summer off knowing the new job would be there.

    I worked out in the mornings, played golf or went to the pool in the afternoon. Spent my evenings going off with friends. It was so nice to have other people to do things with during the day, without that I don't think it would have been as enjoyable.

    Times have changed much since then. My field has shrank considerably where I live, we used to have tons of major employers for IT folks...but now I know of so many who have left the field, not being able to identify a new job post layoff....

    Or they just got sick of being worked to death by the right now demands of the business area's...the CIO's failed to communicate and set realistic expectations and/or need for resources with.

  6. #36
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I'll clarify that I believe in doing one's work professionally and competently (i.e., you invest yourself in your work for an agreed-upon wage)... but as far as longevity?
    The way you guys talk in this thread, one would think that jobs are coming out of everyone's ears right now.

    It ain't a marriage, folks.
    It's a business transaction, pure and simple.
    Some people see marriage as a business transaction too. Where does the detached attitude end? I happen to be a fan of stability when it's a viable option. Not everyone is alike and variety is the spice of life, right? Not every corporation has to offer stability, and not every worker has to seek job security, but to say that every worker should think a like about this seems a bit closed-minded.

  7. #37
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    I went through it almost a year ago today

    Was told at.. oh.. 4:45pm on a Monday. Met a recruitment agent 8am the next morning, got a job within 2 weeks, took a couple of months off before starting (courtesy of about $40k of money in my pocket for severance).

    It was sobering though, I never thought it'd be (I was in round 3.. so far they are on round 3 since then in the same place)

  8. #38
    Senior Member avolkiteshvara's Avatar
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    retool

  9. #39
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    I hate layoffs, because I hate looking for a new job. To me the job interview process is more of a meaningless facade than even the typical illusory charades that happens in most large organizations. I prefer it when people say fantasy is fantasy and reality is reality. A job interview is fantasy posing as reality, and therefore I want to avoid it as much as possible.
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  10. #40
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    I hate layoffs, because I hate looking for a new job. To me the job interview process is more of a meaningless facade than even the typical illusory charades that happens in most large organizations. I prefer it when people say fantasy is fantasy and reality is reality. A job interview is fantasy posing as reality, and therefore I want to avoid it as much as possible.
    It is true that a job interview creates a scenario where people purposefully attempt to present fantasy as reality. They do this by claiming to have different personality qualities than they do in reality. In some sense, we could consider this an exercise in theatrics. Theater was your minor in college, was it not? On that account, why is it the case that you do not enjoy interviews because they give you an opportunity to function as an actor?
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

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