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  1. #21
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I don't think anything that's being lost is significant enough to warrant holding on to it as a primary tool rather than an auxiliary/emergency one. The point of writing is to express language in a text format. We can still use different fonts, bold and italicized text, and change the color of our text on a computer, remember.

    Handwriting makes sense as an art form or something ceremonial, but surely you must agree that it's impractical for everyday use.
    Yes, we can change our fonts, etc. But those are still pre-packaged symbols. I know that graphology takes a lot of heat as a pseudo-science, but to me it's nearly common sense to assume that at least to some minor degree, a person's temperament is going to affect their muscle movements and then their handwriting. So, I surely disagree actually, that it's impractical for everyday use. It's not like anyone ever received an e-mail that they cherished for very long.

    The problem with major emphasis on expedience is that it makes everything throw-away. And I know that it seems like a large leap of logic, but even the small things we do have a large impact on the manners in which we think. I think that handwriting as an art form, which you call ceremonial and impractical, can actually stimulate the brain to action and creativity in a way that keyboarding cannot. C'mon: with handwriting, you actually scribe the letter, and with keyboarding you push-a-friggin-button. To me it seems like it can be somewhat mind-numbing.

    Side note: I've noticed before that when I did some rote work on paper, or perhaps some math, my typing speed actually increased for a short while. How odd.

    If the lack of depth in today's youth is any evidence, I give it. It seems cliche to say so, but in many cases I've found it to be true. Especially in Stickam chatrooms. Jeez!

  2. #22
    Senior Member placebo's Avatar
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    I have to say even as a student, though I use electronic forms of writing a lot, and a lot of notes are available on the computer, I still use handwriting everyday--it's far from being impractical for everday use. E.g. I actually find it impractical to carry around a computer to take notes in lectures. E.g. I also prefer physical journals over personal blogs. Leaving notes on stickies and writing messages down is also way easier than sending emails in many situations. Writing is still highly practical the way I see it.

  3. #23
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I think you're romanticizing it too much because you grew up with it. Don't feel bad, a lot of people do that.
    Im 25, I grew up with both computers and handwriting. It's a basic argument for a more integrated sense of life that's doesn't revolve around mere efficiency and practicality. Those are means not ends in themselves.

    I'm just saying that it makes NO SENSE to do something in a slower way that takes more resources just because of the fear of what will be lost. Handwriting should be preserved as an art form, for ceremony, and for emergency situations, but I don't see any good reason to keep it as an everyday tool when it's no longer the best way.
    Culture vs Civilization people, Culture vs Civilization.

  4. #24
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    I use handwriting everyday, especially at work, where we don't even have access to computers except for higher up business.
    Would you still use handwriting everyday if this weren't the case?
    Plus this is built on the false presupposition of the disconnect between art(aesthetics) and everyday life - which is a false premise of modernity. We can also add the semi-Spenglerian contrast between culture and civilization.
    Okay, then... but a lot of people find typed text more aesthetically pleasing than written text, including myself. How do you account for that?

  5. #25
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Im 25, I grew up with both computers and handwriting. It's a basic argument for a more integrated sense of life that's doesn't revolve around mere efficiency and practicality. Those are means not ends in themselves.



    Culture vs Civilization people, Culture vs Civilization.
    Could you go into a bit more depth on "Culture vs. Civilization" Peguy? I'm not exactly sure what you meant by that.

    Oh, and Athenian, I commonly have issues with text generated on a computer screen. Either the resolution isn't high enough, or the program doesn't size the fonts like I want them, and there's no way to change them except choosing a pre-defined number of points. I suppose if you find them aesthetically pleasing, that's your thing.

  6. #26
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Would you still use handwriting everyday if this weren't the case?
    Yes.

    Okay, then... but a lot of people find typed text more aesthetically pleasing than written text, including myself. How do you account for that?
    Simple....they're fucking idiots!

  7. #27
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    Yes, we can change our fonts, etc. But those are still pre-packaged symbols. I know that graphology takes a lot of heat as a pseudo-science, but to me it's nearly common sense to assume that at least to some minor degree, a person's temperament is going to affect their muscle movements and then their handwriting. So, I surely disagree actually, that it's impractical for everyday use. It's not like anyone ever received an e-mail that they cherished for very long.
    Not true. I've saved e-mails from years ago that I still occasionally pull up and read today. I even take special care to back up the ones that matter to me so that I don't lose them.
    The problem with major emphasis on expedience is that it makes everything throw-away. And I know that it seems like a large leap of logic, but even the small things we do have a large impact on the manners in which we think. I think that handwriting as an art form, which you call ceremonial and impractical, can actually stimulate the brain to action and creativity in a way that keyboarding cannot. C'mon: with handwriting, you actually scribe the letter, and with keyboarding you push-a-friggin-button. To me it seems like it can be somewhat mind-numbing.
    I don't understand that at all. You're making my head hurt. There's nothing in what you're saying that I can even... touch. It's all stuff I can't argue with, because it starts with assumptions that can't be proven or dispelled.

  8. #28
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    Could you go into a bit more depth on "Culture vs. Civilization" Peguy? I'm not exactly sure what you meant by that.
    Culture revolves more around spirituality and aesthetics.

    Civilization revolves more around practiciality and efficiency.

    You need both, but sadly there's a great imbalance towards civilization at the expense of culture. We're more interested in kitsch then actual artwork.

    Simple example: It maybe more practical or efficient to just get fast food for dinner rather than take the time and effort to cook a full course meal yourself; but which is more rewarding in the end?

  9. #29
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    They actually quit teaching cursive at my mom's school and teach keyboarding instead.

    I can't say that I'm disappointed, as I quit writing cursive as soon as I could get away with it and have printed every since.
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  10. #30
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anja View Post
    It was an article I read in the paper last week about the narrow window of opportunity each child has to learn certain basic communication skills. It mentioned that today's children are defficient in some areas of one-to-one communication because they have been interacting with machines to the detriment of their living skills.
    What are you proposing?
    It's not surprising to hear someone verbalize the thoughts that they are expendable but it is frightening. I do see the tendency toward your thoughts and attitude, Athenian. But I also see the social state of things these days and it doesn't look like the prevailing direction is for the positive.
    Do you honestly... LIKE the alternative? Forcing people to value things "just because"?

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