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  1. #101
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    ahh.. I was still being a wise-ass.
    I do think that being an English teacher would be an awful job to have though.
    Yeah. I suppose teaching advanced English courses might be marginally better, though I've come to find that 9 times out of 10 the only difference between advanced and regular English students is work ethic.

    I think if the occasional student who actually cared and "got it" were enough to sustain me, I'd consider being an English teacher. But, it's not, and idiots of any age piss me off.
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  2. #102
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    I never saw any big difference between my english teachers and any other teacher.

    I did have one really old english teacher, we are going along like normal and he is talking about "Ode on a Grecian Urn" He is talking about the music that would have been played during it. He said something like "they weren't playing the star spangled banner" and starts marching across the room humming it. All these bored students actually started paying attention. Perhaps if teachers did stuff like this more often kids wouldn't think school sucked so much?

    Actually he used to break us up in groups for discussions about different pieces too, he probably wasn't too bad of a teacher.

    Ode on a Grecian Urn by John Keats

  3. #103
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brendan View Post
    Yeah. I suppose teaching advanced English courses might be marginally better, though I've come to find that 9 times out of 10 the only difference between advanced and regular English students is work ethic.

    I think if the occasional student who actually cared and "got it" were enough to sustain me, I'd consider being an English teacher. But, it's not, and idiots of any age piss me off.

    absolutely. Advanced placement kids are just more neurotic and obsessive kids who are trying to get A's. It has nothing to do with the interest in English.

  4. #104
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    My post wasn't based on my opinion. It is based on the fact that literary theories are extremely political in the methods many prescribe for interpreting texts (e.g., deconstruction, feminist literary criticism, anything to do with Lacan, the list is endless) and if you've ever actually taken a university level literature course beyond the introductory requirements, you'd know this. So despite how "silly" you may find it, it is a fact.

    My point was that, if you are already predisposed to disagree with the basic assumptions upon which those types of theories rest, and which the instructor is most likely sympathetic to (otherwise they wouldn't be teaching it), then you're not going to have a very high opinion of the subject matter. And many of those theories rest on assumptions that people here would probably label as "extremely liberal/socialist/Marxist (literally)/communist." Personally, having studied rhetoric, I am sick of that type of theory. Luckily, my field has other branches that are often unrelated to that stuff, so I'm not stuck with it like I would be if I studied English proper.

    But literary interpretation is basically all about applying new, politically inspired theories to old texts.
    This might be a little off topic, but I just wanted say thank you for this!

    I belong to another forum where in the last 2 years there has been a flood of students asking about the feminist points of view being furthered in "Jane Eyre".
    It was puzzling me, but now I understand.

  5. #105
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post

    I did have one really old english teacher, we are going along like normal and he is talking about "Ode on a Grecian Urn" He is talking about the music that would have been played during it. He said something like "they weren't playing the star spangled banner" and starts marching across the room humming it. All these bored students actually started paying attention. Perhaps if teachers did stuff like this more often kids wouldn't think school sucked so much?
    Oh, you're so. . .

    Kurt Cobain sang it.

    "Here we are now. Entertain us."
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  6. #106
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    This might be a little off topic, but I just wanted say thank you for this!

    I belong to another forum where in the last 2 years there has been a flood of students asking about the feminist points of view being furthered in "Jane Eyre".
    It was puzzling me, but now I understand.
    Yes, I'm running into this as well. Sort of scary, innit?

    Maybe an effort to make "old and boring" literature entertaining/applicable to RL? I can just hear the moans and cries, "Why don't you teach us something that means something?"
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  7. #107
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anja View Post
    Oh, you're so. . .

    Kurt Cobain sang it.

    "Here we are now. Entertain us."
    Hmm, not sure where you are going with that. Schools and teachers are paid to educate us. If I'm teaching kids I don't expect them to just absorb things I read off a paper.

    If someone is an English teacher I would imagine sometime in their life they were turned on by English. Passing that onto their students isn't really an awful thing to hope for.

  8. #108
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    absolutely. Advanced placement kids are just more neurotic and obsessive kids who are trying to get A's. It has nothing to do with the interest in English.
    This can be true, though there often IS a difference in general curiosity and desire to learn between advanced and regular kids. Frequently, I think that the difference is NOT always ability... my upper-level kids were begging me to discuss Lord of the Flies last week when I felt like I needed to be hammering in state test prep. I won't go into my diatribe about my regular group, but suffice to say, this was not the case for them.

    (I have had awful "advanced" groups and fabulous "regular" groups in the past, though - so that's not always the case.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post
    Hmm, not sure where you are going with that. Schools and teachers are paid to educate us. If I'm teaching kids I don't expect them to just absorb things I read off a paper.

    If someone is an English teacher I would imagine sometime in their life they were turned on by English. Passing that onto their students isn't really an awful thing to hope for.
    I agree with this... but as a teacher, it does drive me nuts when I go through the trouble of preparing what I believe to be engaging lessons (collaborative learning, discussion, hands-on stuff) and kids sit in my class, refuse to do it, and then complain that they're bored. I bet they are bored. Sitting and doing FUCKING NOTHING has got to be tedious.

    I have a teaching certification, not a clown certification. Gah!

    But I know that you're not talking about those kids.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  9. #109
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    This can be true, though there often IS a difference in general curiosity and desire to learn between advanced and regular kids. Frequently, I think that the difference is NOT always ability... my upper-level kids were begging me to discuss Lord of the Flies last week when I felt like I needed to be hammering in state test prep. I won't go into my diatribe about my regular group, but suffice to say, this was not the case for them.

    (I have had awful "advanced" groups and fabulous "regular" groups in the past, though - so that's not always the case.)
    Really? I was just basing on my own experience. When I was in highschool I was placed in all the AP groups. Wasn't really interested in the subject matters myself but just had a good memory. I didn't really care at all.
    All the people in my classes seemed to just be very obsessed about getting A's and being in advanced placement classes for one reason or other. (Strict parents, better colleges.) I don't remember any of them being actually very smart, or even interested in Englsih (or any other subjects) but just study-o-holics who needed the grade.

  10. #110
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Well, I think some personality types are naturally turned on by English courses and others just have to suffer through them hoping they learn to interpret the native language in ways which will help them in their lifetime work. Just as INFPs have to suffer through decimals, fractions and equations. (Argh! I died a thousand deaths.)

    Should they be courteous people they will have some respect for their educators, recognizing that we all have to put up with some things which don't amuse us.

    As far as the kids who get "A"s, they may be driven to provide proof of their worth. They may even have emotional problems from their compulsion. Nonetheless they are probably learning more than those who write off anything which they can't figure out how to develop some minimal enthusiasm for.

    Once you're loose in the world there aren't going to be a lot of bosses who will find it necessary to amuse you so your job isn't boring. It's a good skill to learn - how to make an unpleasant task endurable, if not thrilling.

    I didn't learn that until I was in my thirties and finally realized that life was going to provide many boring moments that I needed, for my own well-being's sake, to learn to turn to my advantage. Absolutely nobody else out there was going to do it for me.
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

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