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  1. #11
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    The only thing grades matter in is if you're planning to go to some professional school (medicine, dental, law etc) that looks at your grades for admissions. Otherwise, it's your degree and what you can do with it that matters, not your grades.

  2. #12
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    Well, all I can say is that if you want to make a career in academics/university, excellent grades are a necessity.

    And to be able to build something, to sign the paperwork, you need an architect diploma or else it's illegal. Furthermore, from my experience, I've never seen a good architect succeeding within this milieu if he/she never had outstanding grades in school.
    Every interesting architects I know in France have had their diploma cum laude. Is it a coincidence? I do not think so.
    Last edited by Blackmail!; 12-17-2008 at 09:52 PM.
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

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  3. #13
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Grades matter until you have experience, then they don't. It's pretty much universal - even grad acceptance tends to be like this (executive MBAs come to mind). It's just that post-grad tends to be academic entry only, as the applicants don't tend to have real world experience!

    I don't know of any exceptions - even academics judge you on publications more than 'grades' when you go to get a prof job, as far as I know. I suppose at the ivy league point the source of your degree matters, as a matter of prestige - can be the same for the 'fortune 500' who-knows-who - but in general, the more experience you have, the less it matters.

  4. #14
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Then how much do grades affect your first time getting hired, especially for jobs that are not completely academic, but for which a certain college degree is still required?
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  5. #15
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cimarron View Post
    Then how much do grades affect your first time getting hired, especially for jobs that are not completely academic, but for which a certain college degree is still required?
    Then it depends on your field, but if you are only going to be judged for your position based on your degree, it will matter (it's a 'somewhat' to 'entirely' range).

    If, however, you do have non-academic things to draw on, even in that situation, you can get away with lower marks. For example, if you are a programmer and have taken part of open-source/google projects/etc, then you get away with lower grades. And if you have a long list of community service (notably in the arts), or are otherwise socially involved... that matters too. And if you supported trade organizations, etc. for the business community (or networked, etc.)... and so on.

    But for the first job, it tends to matter. Especially if you are younger, as in just out of college.

    Keep in mind that it's still only the first job. Once you have it, if you look for experience and CV padding, marks won't really matter again. Also, early on, don't turn down promotions in any way. Even dead ends within a company tend to work out when you try to make lateral transfers elsewhere.

    (I'm assuming you are asking because your marks are lower, not higher. If they are higher, try to command a high salary instead, setting a higher initial bar to work from.)

  6. #16
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    (I'm assuming you are asking because your marks are lower, not higher. )
    Yup. Thank you for your in-depth response.

    I didn't want to make it specific to only my situation, though. There are probably other people out there (I guess) who fit into this category.
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  7. #17
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    My experience is that the fact that I have worked through school for 4 years as a freelance translator seem to matter more in the hiring process rather than the GPA of the BS, which is sufficiently good.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  8. #18
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    My experience is that the fact that I have worked through school for 4 years as a freelance translator seem to matter more in the hiring process rather than the GPA of the BS, which is sufficiently good.
    Yup, this can't be emphasized enough.

    A large portion of the value of education is signaling... and you are competing against others who have also done it, making the signal weaker. Lacking anything else, grades is what will count (think of it as 'plumage color among birds').

    What FDG did is huge - it overshadows other signals (heh, think of it as 'scars on alpha males' - no one cares how pretty he is, he's proven his worth). It's the same with experience... it signals ability vastly better than academic learning.

  9. #19
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Yup, this can't be emphasized enough.

    A large portion of the value of education is signaling... and you are competing against others who have also done it, making the signal weaker. Lacking anything else, grades is what will count (think of it as 'plumage color among birds').

    What FDG did is huge - it overshadows other signals (heh, think of it as 'scars on alpha males' - no one cares how pretty he is, he's proven his worth). It's the same with experience... it signals ability vastly better than academic learning.
    Yeah; what I found valuable in this lesson is that it testifies the truthfulness of the signalling approach to education over the human capital theoretical background; I am absolutely certain that my education has been much more useful in providing skills, yet I get chosen on the basis of my working experience. Funny.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  10. #20
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pippi View Post
    I was involved with the screening process in a technical field and grades matter, however where you got your diploma didn't matter much. Generally, it would depend if the degree is directly applicable to the job and what kind of job we are talking about.
    Good advice here, folks.

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